Here's a quick analysis of what it costs a few people I know who prepped to the max:

Rainwater System - $11,000

Solar Set-up - $14,000

Propane generator w/500 gal tank - $12,000

Freeze Dried Food for 6 people for 1 year - $6,000

New well - $5,000

Solar windmill for well - $4,000

Aladdin Lamps/Petromax - $350.00

Kerosene - 100 gallons - $200.00

Diesel Fuel - 500 gallons - $750.00

Candles/Oil Lamp Oil - $350.00

Wood Stove - $1,500

10 cords of wood - $1,500

Chain saw - $350.00

Guns and ammo - 2 12 gauage Mossbergs - $700.00

Property in the boonies with Travel Trailer/RV - $35,000

Scanner, Short wave radio, Baygen radio - $750.00

Grain grinder - $175.00

Camp stoves, lanterns, and fuel - $350.00

Seeds and gardening equipment - $350.00

Sprouter and seeds $150.00

Gasoline and time spent preparing - mucho.

Blankets, sleeping bags, solar blankets - $200.00

Tax penalty for cashing in IRA/401K - thousands of dollars.

Books, and subscriptions to survival magazines, etc. - $500.00+

Divorce - mucho $$$$.

Yeh, an expensive lesson learned for many, but someone is laughing all the way to the bank.

-- Rasty (Rasty@Bulldogggg.xcom), January 03, 2000

Answers

Damn..and I thought I was bad spending $300 on propane, batteries, water purifiers and spaghettios.

-- Nora Niblette (gotoff@ok.com), January 03, 2000.

Would this be your friend's brother-in-law?

-- nomail (no@lie.com), January 03, 2000.

Sir,

With a bit pf patience, and a real estate agent. I do believe you can not only realize your inital investment in said property back. But with those kind of improvements...You might make a buck or two.

Though my first advice would be to wait for about three months. You see the Fat Lady started her inging todaay (for the first time)..And her song is a long one,And with no gurantee that the ending will be a happy one.

-- Shakey (in_a_bunker@fory.feet), January 03, 2000.

Water purifier and filters - $150.00

Batteries/car battery - $150.00

These were friends and acquaintances that prepped.

-- Rasty (Rasty@bulldoggg.xcom), January 03, 2000.

Whose shopping list is this? Donald Trumps? Bill Gates? The Rothchild's? Elizabeth II?

Who had that kind of money to spend?

And, they sure over paid for some of those items.

-- Richard (Astral-Acres@webtv.net), January 03, 2000.

Well, who made the decisions to spend all that money? Are you going to bitch about all the broker's hype about buying stock when the market bubble breaks and falls on its kiester??? Or is that different? No one twisted anyone else's knickers into a knot and forced them to buy. I am already sick of the whining on this forum. You made your decisions on your own. Personally, we spent over $35k but you don't hear Chubby Hubby and I bitching about it. Why? Because WE MADE THE DECISIONS TO SPEND THE MONEY. And for the most part don't regret it at all. Inventoring my preps this am about all I can see is that I do have a lot of lamp oil that I will never use. Always wanted a handpump. Admit I would rather we had put the $15k for generator into solar, but thats ok. We have power outages all the time here, with and without hurricanes. If you don't like your current situation, change it, don't whine about it.

Taz

-- Taz (Tassi123@aol.com), January 03, 2000.

What poor house?

Much of what you've listed is wealth -- just a different form of it. The rest was insurance expense.

-- eve (123@4567.com), January 03, 2000.

Taz, who is whining? Sounds like your whining and pissed that you spent $35,000. I didn't spend money on any of the stuff listed in my thread except for a few bottles of lamp oil and a few boxes of top ramen soup. But my friends and acquaintances are not happy campers.

Richard: Taz spent $15,000 for her generator, did she pay too much?

-- Rasty (Rasty@bulldoggg.xcom), January 03, 2000.

peace of mind.....priceless

-- Johnny (jljtm@bellsouth.com), January 03, 2000.

Poor house?

Dosen't sound like it; sounds like they can kick back, enjoy all of their stuff, and retire from the rat race. Only thing I see bad about this is the divorce; then again, I don't know the situation(I'd hate to lose my wife to anything; divorce, death, whatever. I love her more that I can possibly describe here; she is my best friend). Maybe it was for the best, and the individuals in question can now find someone more suited to their personalities.

Plant a garden(I personally made out like a bandit in this category; hooked up with a guy that had grabbed an organic, non-hybridized seed bank from a business that went under. I bought seed packets for over two hundred types of plants that will grow in my area for $5.00!! Call me Farmer Don! Even better, my next door neighbor has a huge organic garden, and will GIVE me all the compost I will ever need. Woo Hoo!), grind some grain, bake some bread, eat some easy to prepare food while you wait for the garden to come up, work on your shotgun skills, and enjoy your new found freedom from the grid. Write a book, learn a new trade, master a musical instrument, become more spiritually aware, all of the above, or none of the above; whatever suits.

If you're truly independent, you're never in the poor house!

Peace,

Don

-- Shimoda (enlighten@me.com), January 03, 2000.

Look, WE spent over $20k. I got an email from a PhD. who spent $100k, and said he regrets NOT A DIME spent. Neither do I. It's WAAAAY to early to declare victory and go home.

-- Dennis (djolson@pressenter.com), January 03, 2000.

Next time don't listen to anybody do your own research and listen to your brain when you begin to doubt there is a real problem.

-- ron (rrest@hotmail. om), January 03, 2000.

So who held your friends at gun point and made them buy all that stuff? Get real. We all made good, and we all made bad choices based on some good and some bad info. So what? As to paying too much for generator, I have no idea. The price included the transfer switch and all the wiring. Its a 40 KW New Age/Perkins. Also it has the noise thingie on it and the thingie for running sensitive equipment. Sits on back porch and vented through the roof. We LOVE it. And I am glad we have it. My point is lets get on with life and quit worrying about what was or might have been. We aren't through this yet and I for one don't have a real feel as to how it will run. But if the infrastructure stays up I think most things can be handled by most of us. If you are a single mother with 3 kids and your welfare check and food stamps don't arrive, you are in a world of hurt. Chubby Hubby and I have positioned ourselves over the years where we are not very vulnerable to such glitches, but I worry about those who are. And if your friends are not happy campers it probably because it was a financial choice they would have rather not made. But likely as not, they are the more vulnerable. Its kind of like the advice given to a recent widow. Don't make any changes for at least a year. Taz

-- Taz (Tassi123@aol.com), January 03, 2000.

Taz is quite right.We all as individuals had to make a decision about what might happen & how much we were going to spend.Nobody "forced" us to spend a pound or a dollar on preps.

Strikes me that all these moans are symptomatic of the kind of person who believes in the nanny state.Is America still the land of the brave & the free ???

-- Chris (griffen@globalnet.co.uk), January 03, 2000.

Rasty, your an asshole. I spent 100K, so what? I'm self sufficient, prepared for most anything and don't need to work for years. It's a great life dipshit. Unlike a lot of fools, I could give a shit about money, the stock market and "getting ahead in life". I'm set for a long, long time. I go fishing whenever I want, hunt, cross country ski, mountain bike, four wheeler, hike, enjoy my kids (this is at the top of the list) and have all kinds of fun and freedom.

Preparing was the best thing I ever did. By the way, I started this life of mine in 1996, long before most of you. I'm still at it, still enjoying it and can't stand utter fools who think money spent on preparations is a waste. Following the rat race is the real waste. And no, I didn't incurr a penny of debt doing this either, so I could care less about that issue. Self sufficiency is NEVER a waste, you just got to get your priorities straight in life.

-- Free (your@slave.com), January 03, 2000.

Rasty, I agree with many of the posts that follow yours. I do not regret my preps. They are the best and cheapest form of insurance I've ever purchased, since I can get my full value from the premiums paid. My guiding principle was not not purchase anything I wouldn't need or want ANYWAY. So, this means I have some things purchased in advance...who cares? I'll also be better prepared for my next camping trip with some gear I've wanted for a long time.

No regrets...

-- No Polly (nopolly@hotmail.com), January 03, 2000.

Ditto. Pollies don't seem to understand the concept of self- sufficiency. Maybe the word is too big for them to get their little pea-sized brains around.

Assuming Y2K is less than a BITR, I have a large amount of high carbo, low cal food. I started my diet today. I am 280 lbs 5'11". I want to be at 180. I've got a long way to go. Wish me luck!

Everything I've bought is something I'll use. The CB radio goes in my car. I don't have a cell phone now, so it can be used in an emergency to call for help. My scanner is going into my office at work. I work at a courthouse, so I'll be able to hear the deputies chit-chat. My generator is still ready for a blackout. In this area a 15mph wind sometimes makes the power fail. More than once, the genny kept us warm and happy while our neighbors shivered.

The gasoline is going into the cars. It's stabilized and will last a few months. If the prices go sky-high, we'll be just fine. The shotgun shells will be busy blasting clay targets out of the air. I really need to improve my aim.

I'm not sorry for any of the things I bought. Not even a little bit.

-- Tim the Evil Programmer (tmiley@yakko.cs.wmich.edu), January 03, 2000.

Absolutely amazing that anyone would over spend by the amounts you quote. We are/were very well prepped, but spent a fraction of the sums you quote -- in many cases for the same things -- and don't regret it at all. I think the smarter ones on this forum approached the possible dangers with level-headedness and by looking for the best deals possible, over a long period of time. If you played this right, you should easily be able to break even (and possibly even turn a profit) on your preps. Most of this has been converting certain types of assets into other types of assets and, as you should always do, looking for good deals. If you went hog wild with the credit cards and check book, buying everything in "panic mode," I would expect you to take a beating. This is true of ANY scenario, not just Y2K.

Best regards

Doc

-- T.H. "Doc" Toups (ttoups@aol.com), January 03, 2000.

The new "grandma's motto" of the 21 Century - Waste a lot, want a lot

And I supposed Rasty, you consider spending $100,000 on a car a "wise choice"?

"Less prepared" individuals that let other people do their worrying for them would see a fully self contained family of four with survival preparations in place as "frivolous" while they pay $300.00 a week to someone else to clean their house for them and shine their bloated $50,000+ cars.

Don't assume I don't have a new car or that I live in a shack. Far from it. But I also spent quite a bit of money making sure the family would be safe, warm, and fed. That is my job and my responsibility - whatever it takes.

-- Mr. K (Mr.K@home.today), January 03, 2000.

Hey, Tim . . . right on, way to go. My situation & opinion is quite similar. Good luck!

-- =DSA. (dsangal@attglobal.net), January 03, 2000.

Sorry "Rasty" - I don't believe you (yet). Perhaps you'd like to build some credibility before claiming to know somebody who spent this much.

-- Robert A Cook, PE (Marietta, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), January 03, 2000.

After searching my brain for items that I purchased that I will never get any use out of, I came up with the following list:

-- Uncle Deedah (unkeed@yahoo.com), January 03, 2000.

Robert, I've read your post over the past several months and obviously you were wrong too, so where's your credibility? You all see yourselves in the items that I listed and it wasn't a dig at anyone except for people feel like sh*t right now because they believe they have been scammed by the "experts." Spoke with a friend just a few minutes ago and he's been getting needled all morning by his co-workers. Pretty hard thing to take and it will be a long time before he lives it down. But you must admit this one thing, if it wasn't for Y2K, your money would have been invested or spent somewhere else and not on the items listed in my original thread. Yes, these are lessons learned the hard way.

-- Rasty (Rasty@bulldoggg.xcom), January 03, 2000.

LOL!

Sorry, Uncle DeeDah, I missed it....what was that list of preps you will never use? Could you post it again?

-- eubie (preps@resmart.com), January 03, 2000.

I figure I spent about $125,000 on solar, generator, well, alternative heating, preps, etc and don't regret it a moment. no debt, self sufficient, and alive at a point in this world where the next 20 years will see some interesting times and events. I pity those who believe it to be normal to live hand to mouth, and yet to be self sufficient is extremist. What tree did they fall out of? I built a multi million net worth through prudent risk taking. This was just one more. The fact the world didn't fall into the sh*tter makes me real glad. I want to enjoy my wife, grand children, golf, etc. And if and when it gets tough out there, I am ready and intend to stay that way. What a good feeling!

-- been around the block (Davem8608@aol.com), January 03, 2000.

Which prediction(s) was I wrong in?

Been quite a few (more or less four thousand) messages I've sent up the line, maybe you can remind me which one(s) might be factually incorrect.....

At that much for a solar system, your supposed reference now has "free" electricity for the rest of his life, and everything else remains avialable for any way of life he (or she) chooses. His choices, not mine.

My preparations were a little under 450.00; and as Ole Deedah listed, all remain useable, none are wasted: because I planned it that way. If your supposed reference did not, then that was a choice he (or she) freely made as an adult. If you, as implied by your response, are merely quoting the highest possible price for the maximum possible number of "nice-to-have" items, then your original message, your original premis, is completely false, insulting, and repugnant.

I too could claim ot have saved 50,000.00 by NOT buying a Mercedes, but saved more by NOT buying a Rolls-Royce and a Land Cruiser. Is that the comparison you mean?.

-- Robert A Cook, PE (Marietta, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), January 03, 2000.

It is sorta funny when I think about it. My concerns and preps for potential Y2K mishaps -- *easily* outshadowed by the preps the gov't and industry made -- boil down this: I bought a bunch of stuff I've wanted and needed for a long time, but always managed to procrastinate into the future.

The realization that things *could* get tres ugly motivated me to buy a nice, solid -- yet fairly inexpensive Generac 4000 XL, and then two used Onan propane gensets from a nearby Federal auction (hey, my tax dollars *finally* at work!). As to non-perishable food? As I've explained in other threads, I've always kept several month's worth on hand due to chronic rotten health -- and I've *needed* and *used* it on more than one occasion over the years. Did I buy more? Yup. It didn't cost much, and what *we* don't eat, our chickens, geese, ducks, and goats will be more than eager to convert into *other* tasty morsels for us -- as well as rich compost for our garden!

What am I out?

Nothing at all other than the minor "lost opportunity" of a few bucks invested in some provisions.

What do I have to show for it all? A better quality of life than any of my "city cousins" could possibly imagine.

-- Ron Schwarz (rs@clubvb.com.delete.this), January 03, 2000.

Ron, your outlook on it all is exceptional, I can handle your position as being genuine and respectable. Some peopple are still stuck on solar energy and what it cost them! Good luck!

-- Rasty (Rasty@bulldoggg.xcom), January 03, 2000.

Rasty,

I don't see what the problem is. I also don't understand what you are referring to when you speak of an "expensive lesson".

I wish I had all of the items you listed (except the divorce).

Is your concern for the items purchased, or merely the money paid for them?

-- GA Russell (ga.russell@usa.net), January 04, 2000.

Hey Ratsy- I've got some stuff I wouldn't mind selling the people you hang with, given the prices they'll pay.......

-- farmer (hillsidefarm@drbs.com), January 04, 2000.

The original list makes no sense: My questions in [] - perhaps these are "combined" fictional expenses from several people in several parts of the country?

Rainwater System - $11,000

[Easier to get two barrels and use your gutter drain - if worried about lsong water pressure, and you have no creek nearby. How did he spend this much? Get bulldozer and create a pond in his back yard? BUT - if there is a new well and solar/wind-powered pump, why the catchment system at all?)

Solar Set-up - $14,000

[Free electricity for the rest of the time! But an emergency power pack (good for a few days with prudent care is only 550.00, an elaborate one is 1500.00. Neither is needed if the generator is available.]

Propane generator w/500 gal tank - $12,000

[Borthern Hydraulic had these for 1500.00 - 2500.00. How did he spend the rest? Not needed if the solar was purchased.]

Freeze Dried Food for 6 people for 1 year - $6,000

[His choice - I just used canned food. And am using it now. Total expense = 0.00)

New well - $5,000

[Why? You said he had a tremendous rain-gathering system.]

Solar windmill for well - $4,000

[Please clarify - solar powered, or windmill powered, or windmill-driven/solar option generator for the well pump? If so, a 200.00 dollar unit is available.]

Aladdin Lamps/Petromax - $350.00

[75.00; with rechargeable batteries. How many did he get?]

Kerosene - 100 gallons - $200.00

[Why - kerosene isn't needed - if the rest were purchased.]

Diesel Fuel - 500 gallons - $750.00

[Why? Nothing else purchased is diesel fueled...and propane for the genreator was already listed.]

Candles/Oil Lamp Oil - $350.00

[Not needed if the lanterns were bought. 15.00 in my case as a backup.]

Wood Stove - $1,500

10 cords of wood - $1,500

Chain saw - $350.00

[All above remain useful - but the saw could have been 100.00 - 150.00, and that much wood is more than double what's required. No need to buy wood if the chainsaw were bought. Stove is toio expensive, available here for 500.00 - 800.00]

Guns and ammo - 2 12 gauage Mossbergs - $700.00

[ His choice.]

Property in the boonies with Travel Trailer/RV - $35,000

[Not needed if the others were bought - good vacation house, remember to re-finance/finance and declare the interest deduction. Or sell and pay for the other stuff. Or use the other stuff at the vacation place. ]

Scanner, Short wave radio, Baygen radio - $750.00

[ No way - Baygen is/was 75.00 (125.00 with options.) Scanner 45.00 - 125.00 Shortwave radio also that much....who ever claimed they paid this much is giving you bad data.]

Grain grinder - $175.00

[Nope - they're not this expensive either.]

Camp stoves, lanterns, and fuel - $350.00

[No way - these are 15.00 - 45.00 for the stove. 39.00 for a "big" propane tank. 15.00 - 39.00 for lanterns. NOT needed if the other lanterns were bought. Not needed (for cooking) if the stove were bought.]

Seeds and gardening equipment - $350.00

Sprouter and seeds $150.00

[If his hobby - great. Not needed if the food were bought.]

Gasoline and time spent preparing - mucho.

Blankets, sleeping bags, solar blankets - $200.00

[Maybe - at least this expense is more realistic. But - he doesn't have blankets already? And lives were that much wood is needed?]

Tax penalty for cashing in IRA/401K - thousands of dollars.

[His choice. Should have rolled it into bonds....How much would he have lost if he left it in the market today?]

Books, and subscriptions to survival magazines, etc. - $500.00+

[No way - each is 15.00-18.00 Perhaps 2-3 are useful, the rest would be redundant.]

Divorce - mucho $$$$.

[His choice. His wife's choice. Perhaps the better of the two if these decisions are representative.]

-- Robert A Cook, PE (Marietta, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), January 04, 2000.

Hey Robert, that's why my friends and acquaintances are in the poor house, they over spent, that's my whole point. Sounds like your pissed. I got off very cheap.

-- Rasty (Rasty@bulldoggg.xcom), January 07, 2000.