The flow of Info is important. I am not convienced that phill is the one who shut down the tb2000. Place your tb2000 posts on this forum until the tb2000 comes back up. Our liberty and famlies liberty is at risk if the flow of info shuts down. Freedom of speech is vital keep the tourch of freedom alive. We have the right to real time uncensored info and to determine what is important. We have to be each others free press, we cant depend on the corp media to give us anything useusable.

-- y2k aware mike (y2k aware mike @ conservation . com), December 29, 1999

Answers

Any alternate non-MIT site we wanna bookmark just incase? Right now looks like only us and y2kprep were closed.

-- Hokie (nn@va.com), December 29, 1999.

I DO think it was Phil. I have been in earlier correspondence with him including earlier this morning and four times since he shut it down. He's completely consistent with the Phil I talked to earlier.

-- Dancr (addy.available@my.webpage), December 29, 1999.

Hokie,

That's a good idea. I'm not so sure this forum won't be hacked, too, if the hacker figures out that some of us have relocated. I saw a post suggesting Rick Cowles Energyland.net forum. I checked that one out when Rick posted it to TB2000...it wasn't very user-friendly, but beggars can't be choosers, I guess.

-- (RUOK@yesiam.com), December 29, 1999.

Yes, Phil shut it down, and it wasn't hacked by anyone. There was a thread from yesterday about people wanting to make copies of all of the archives. They got a software program which penetrates Phil's server and copies every single file from this forum. Well, as you can imagine, when several people start doing this at the same time it brings his server to its knees. He got pissed and shut it down because they din't get his permission to do this. Here is what he wrote...

"Someone was using a robot to grab every page on this server and it washammering my poor ancient Solaris box (167 MHz processors). (Actually there were SEVERAL people with robots hammering the machine at thesame time. Somehow everyone got the same idea to archive the forum at once.)"

Now we have to figure out how to get him to bring it back up and immediately post a warning that no one is allowed to copy the archives any more or we will lose the forum for good. If he isn't willing to do that, then I guess it's hasta la vista to TB2000, nice while it lasted. When this one gets busy he may not be able to handle the traffic here any longer either. In case we get cut off for good, just want to say it has been great fun knowing all of you, even those who I disagreed with. A good learning experience!

Best wishes to all!

(*V*)

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again?), December 29, 1999.

Nice move. I just stumbled here on an off chance that others did the same. Lets hope all the regulars make their way here.

There was a thread that was started a couple of days ago where I suggested a mirror of tb2000 be made for the rollover. Someone (I can't remember who) was going to look into the possibility.

Anybody remember who or if anything got decided. Now would be a good time to re-open that topic.

-- Interested Spectator (is@the_ring.side), December 29, 1999.

I'm wondering if it really is LadyLogic or some other similar creature. I don't know but am speculating that a lot of people started using a spider to download TB2000. I noticed a thread on the issue and someone posted the exact instructions on how to do that as many were floundering. I noticed things begin to deteriorate slowly after that so my guess is that more and more started spiders and trashed the server.

Perhaps the sysops can create a zip file of TB2000/TB2000 prep and keep it on a separate FTP server where we can download from.

-- Interested Spectator (is@the_ring.side), December 29, 1999.

I've created a ONEList forum for backup communications.

Membership is NOT open -- this means "ladylogic" and her ilk will be denied access, and if they slip through, their accounts will be cancelled.

To join, sign up at http://www.onelist.com/community/TB2000-Alternate.

-- Ron Schwarz (rs@clubvb.com.delete.this), December 29, 1999.

Ron, cool! Is the OneList thing an e-mail listservice or a forum? By the way, I saw where you were missing some Aladdin parts. I have a box of parts I ordered, but no lamps (they appear to have been lost by the postal service). Still needing parts?

-- (RUOK@yesiam.com), December 29, 1999.

Ron:

Can we still use our alias names and stay anonymous or will we have to come out and say who we are? I couldn't tell from the sign up form.

-- Interested Spectator (is@the_ring.side), December 29, 1999.

Found my way here. There are a few of us in the Deleted Threads Forum.

-TECH32-

-- TECH32 (TECH32@NOMAIL.COM), December 29, 1999.

I've been reading and sometimes posting to the TB2000 forum for a long time. This morning I quickly scanned the messages posted, but didn't have time to read too many. I looked forward to a few hours of reading tonight. I was very surprised to find the forum gone! I found this only by looking thru the list of LUCENET topics. I don't understand the technical aspects of the Internet, but couldn't this forum be continued as a webpage by itself?

-- Linda Hitchings (lindasue1@earthlink.net), December 29, 1999.

Thanks Ron, I just signed up as an emergency backup, but do I have to wait to be approved now or what?

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), December 29, 1999.

Linda,

Sure, if you have a server you'd like to donate. :-)

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), December 29, 1999.

IS: you can hide the domain part of your address from non-members (and the system will XXXX it out in the web archives), but it will show up in your posts.

If you feel it necessary to remain anon, you should probably set up a Hotmail or similar address and use that to post.

BTW, you can set up your ONEList configuration to email individual posts, email digests, or, email nothing, but read it via the website.

I've left the archives open, so non-members can gain from the posts, since with only a couple of days to go, I think it's important for people to be able to gain whatever help they can.

-- Ron Schwarz (rs@clubvb.com.delete.this), December 29, 1999.

RU: my wife was trying to get some bug screens and a couple of mantles (and I think a wick or two also). Please email me and I'll fwd it to her so she can talk with you. Thanks!

-- Ron Schwarz (rs@clubvb.com.delete.this), December 29, 1999.

From: Y2K, ` la Carte by Dancr (pic), near Monterey, California

He got pissed and shut it down because they din't get his permission to do this. Here is what he wrote...

"Someone was using a robot to grab every page on this server and it washammering my poor ancient Solaris box (167 MHz processors). (Actually there were SEVERAL people with robots hammering the machine at thesame time. Somehow everyone got the same idea to archive the forum at once.)"

I wasn't aware that permission was needed. I did corresond with Phil earlier in the day about it and he said I would need a laundry list of skills to be able to make use of the info, but didn't say anything about not taking a copy. I decided to take a copy anyway, and then deal with how I was going to get the software, manuals, background learning, and reading list to do the job. (Or... more likely trick my nine year old into figuring it out some day)

My friend who was doing the d/l on a cable modem said he could have easily overwhelmed the server all by himself, once he heard what it was. We did have the software set on "netiquette," though, (which reportedly slows the transfer to a reasonable pace).

-- Dancr (addy.available@my.webpage), December 29, 1999.

We are terminating this thread as we have to many on this topic. Please go here:

http://18.24.3.72/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=0028QI

-- Interested Spectator (is@the_ring.side), December 29, 1999.

Dancr: there was more to it than people archiving the threads. His original message said that someone had changed the root password. That's evidence of attack, not archiving.

-- Ron Schwarz (rs@clubvb.com.delete.this), December 29, 1999.

Dancr,

I wasn't rying to say that you did anything wrong... I attempted it myself yesterday, but gave up after 500 files. The thread made it sound like it was OK to do this, but it would seem Phil got angry because apparently he wasn't told how much resources it would drain from his server.

Ron,

Phil did say it appeared that people were archiving, not hacking. As for the password, apparently that program doesn't need a password to go in and copy the files, as long as the URL is provided. Either that, or his password security system is as outdated as his system, and the program just bypassed it very easily.

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), December 29, 1999.

Hawk: his original notice said that someone had changed the root password. That's the main password that gives *complete* "superuser" access to the entire system (not just the forums, but *everything* on the computer). That doesn't just happen. Either a *high level* administrator changed it, or the system was hacked.

-- Ron Schwarz (rs@clubvb.com.delete.this), December 29, 1999.

Oh what a mess! I log on this morning to find everyone scattered over 10 different forums. Personaly I don't think it a good idea to take over Ed's HumptyDumpty forum to continue our regular TB2K discussions. I suggest we stick to the backup forum for now at http:// greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a.tcl?topic= TimeBomb%202000%20%28Y2000%29%20Rollover%2fBack%2dUp%20Forum

About Ron's new forum. I just joined and looked around a bit. One must give one's email address and coordinates, but only the chosen handle is shown on posts. Right now it looks like we can't post on it yet, seems Ron's working on it still. So far there's 76 people who joined.

Ron, can you elaborate on this forum, i.e., what you intend to do with it? Is it only to browse archived TB2K posts or will we be able to discuss there too?

-- Chris (catsy@xxx.com), December 29, 1999.

Closing tag, sorry about that.

-- Chris (catsy@xxx.com), December 29, 1999.

Hawk: his original notice said that someone had changed the root password.

His original message said it looked like someone had changed the root password. He was mistaken, which is why the new message no longer says this. The download program doesn't require a password, and it is certainly possible for a few people running that program to overwhelm Phil's server. This is exactly what Phil said had happened.

-- (tech1@bistrel.com), December 29, 1999.

Chris -- it should be working. I sent a couple of test messages earlier, and they went through. If someone else would like to send a test message I'd appreciate it, in case there's a snafu that only lets a moderator send, but I just checked the settings again and everything should be OK.

-- Ron Schwarz (rs@clubvb.com.delete.this), December 29, 1999.