Here is the latest list of scare tatics,

Dennis B., Alvin K., Joetta D., Donald R., Steve R., Pat K., Oscar S., David R., Albert H., Steve G., Suzanne C., James P., Zeola B., Theresa T., Connie F., Steve S., Tambara M., Ralph P., Robert S., Elton L., Glenn O., Polo M. Dominick L., Walter C., Rickey S., Daniel S., Craig E., Robyn H., Jack F., Art R., William M., Larry S. etc..etc..

Just the first trickle of the thousands of people who will lose their jobs if I-695 passes. If the vote passes Nov. 2nd they will get their pink slips Nov. 3rd and work their last day Jan 3rd. Happy New Year.

And yes, their ARE scared.

We want change also, but we're not crazy!

Vote no on I-695!

Mike Powell

-- Mike Powell (mkpow62@silverlink.net), October 18, 1999

Answers

You ARE kidding, right Mike?

I mean, whoever those people are, or even if they do exist (as we all know, their names were made up at random) we don't OWE them a job.

If they lose it... tough. Working for government can result in layoffs. I knew that when I took this job. So did they. So do you.

Westin

"Americans in every region and in both political parties have been shaken by the betrayal of public trust ... and the dishonesty of the public officials."...

Then Sen. Al Gore, Seattle Times, June 29, 1987

-- Westin (86se4sp@my-deja.com), October 19, 1999.

Kind of reminds me of the used car dealer who used to be photographed with a gun and a puppy saying, "Buy a car from me, or I'll shoot the dog!" I wouldn't buy a used car from Mikey, no matter what kind of acts he threatened to perpetrate on the puppy. Wouldn't put it by him, either!

-- Mark Stilson (mark842@hotmail.com), October 19, 1999.

Gee, I really hope that isn't the Mike Powell, Union Financial Secretary for Amalgamated Transit Local 1384, who posted that. The same one who had his picture in The Olympian, standing on a corner with a No on I-695, debating with an Elderly gentleman. The one who got himself a nice Union Position. Is he finally trying to help his Union Brothers and Sisters and earn a Bureaucrat salary? Too bad he hasn't done a better job getting these people decent wages benefits and working conditions. Too bad he doesn't lobby Transit Boards to stop wasting Taxpayers money. Most of those he just listed would be better off working somewhere else anyway! Gee, do you suppose if That Local loses 40% of their membership Mikey will be out of a job too? It is a little late now Mr. Powell!

-- Marsha Schaefer (acorn_nut@hotmail.com), October 19, 1999.

Just for the record, those ARE real people Mikey posted.

-- Marsha Schaefer (acorn_nut@hotmail.com), October 19, 1999.

Marsha wrote:

"Just for the record, those ARE real people Mikey posted."

And we know this... how? And it matters... why?

Just for the record, 1/2 million people signed the initiative. Just for the record, we don't owe any one of those "people" a job. Clearly, the union rank and file support this initiative, just like they supported I-200.

Just for the record.

Westin

"I seek this office to restore the rule of law and respect for common sense to the White House." ...

Sen. Al Gore Seattle Times, June 29, 1987

-- Westin (86se4sp@my-deja.com), October 19, 1999.

Look, this is nothing more than political manipulation. if the jobs were that important they would not be threatening to cut them. Voting against the initiative will benefit no one. There are plenty of high paying jobs in the area to support the minimal layoffs that are threatened. The real question is what will you do with your extra money? Granted it may not be much over the course of a year -- it's still yours. The only people that gain from you voting against the initiative are the bureaurats and proglaticians who suck the life blood of our communities.

-- William Cole (cole@mindspring.com), October 19, 1999.

Westin,

It's just like you and your partners in crime to avoid the real issue.

The point is not whether anyone owes them a job, nor is it if anyone cares if they have a job.

The point is, you people say "it's only scare tatics, no one will lose any jobs"

Yet people will. You may not care, you may even be happy about it. But how do you respone to the fact that it is real, and not a scare tatic? Or can you? And if you can, can you do it in a real answer, and not just a smarta@@ remark?

We want change also, but we're not crazy!

Vote no on I-695

MP

-- Mike Powell (mkpow62@silverlink.net), October 19, 1999.

First of all, Mike, It's taCtics, not tatics.

Secondly, did everyone see today's Dilbert? In it the "boss" is told that the organization must make a 10% cut. He plays the old bureaucratic trick of "putting up the family jewels," that is, offering up his most important program since he's sure no one will allow him to cut it. To his surprise, someone agrees.

So tell us Mikey, are these individuals "the family jewels," or are they truly the least essential providers of service in this organization? Or, being union, are they just least senior, so they take the hit no matter if they are good, bad, or indifferent?

-- Craig Carson (craigcar@crosswinds.net), October 19, 1999.

Jobs will be lost. I care that jobs will be lost. I know the real responsibility for those lost jobs will lie with "Gimme more money" Politicians and Bureaucrats who have done a poor job of managing that money. Perhaps the lost jobs shouldn't have ever been created in the first place.

-- Marsha Schaefer (acorn_nut@hotmail.com), October 19, 1999.

Westin

Lets go to the bottom line--past all the hyperbole.

The ONLY way that even the tiniest of the dire consequences predicted

can come about is if the Governor and the legislature ALLOW it to hap

pen. If they decide,either through malice or ignorance,not to downsize

the Wants,and reprioritize and reallocate the budget,then we know who

to look at as the responsible parties.

I lived through this as a bureaucrat in Ca. when prop 13 passed. At

first the politicans were stunned and in denial that 13 had passed

but then they realized that THEY would rightly be blamed for failing

to do their jobs if they allowed all the terrible things they

predicted to come to pass.

Of course history shows that they buckled down,did their jobs, and

none of their pre-election lies came to pass. Are the Wa. legislators

stupider and more maliscious than their Ca. counterparts? We will see.

The job after the election is to watch what each one does and let

them KNOW that we are watching.

To that end I hope we can keep this site alive so we can compare notes

as we watch the pols.

If a liberal wants to occupy the 'moral high ground' they first must get directions from a conservative.

Ricardo

-- Ricardo (ricardoxxx@home.com), October 19, 1999.

I'm sorry, Mike...

I missed the part where anyone in the campaign or any supporter of this initiative made the guarantee that jobs would not be lost. I did, however, catch the part, amply pointed out by the Seattle Times, where the antis were lying through their teeth about the NUMBER of lost jobs.

Did you? Or are those kinds of lies meaningless to you?

Westin

"A zebra does not change its spots." - Al Gore, attacking President George Bush in 1992.

-- Westin (86se4sp@my-deja.com), October 19, 1999.

Mike, I see a striking irony here in your plea. First, if you are working for a union, whose receives a salary derived from the sweat of your members, is it not more logical that you should be looking to find ways to streamline your department, so as to defray this looming doom? Seems to me if I was in your position, I would be looking to trim wasted resources rather than putting up the names of everyone that will loose their job. Besides, isn't that a big tacky, and maybe in violation of their privacy?

-- Matt Greenway (mgreenwa@u.washington.edu), October 19, 1999.

Jeffey,

I must admit, you play the role of an abused child far better then anyone else I've ever met.

Look, I know you're still embarrassed over how badly I trashed you on the last thread... but dayam, Jeff... you make is SOOO easy.

I do not call "opponents" of 695 "hypocrites." I call hypocrites who happen to oppose 695 "hypocrites." It's the sorta subtle difference far beyond one of your limited intellectual capability, but its a fact, nevertheless.

That I work for the State of Washington has no bearing, one way or the other, on my position on 695. That the UW screwed up and you obviously managed to get in under some special-ed program, or typo or something has no effect on my position.

I stand by my statement: everyone working for government runs the risk of being layed off due to budget cuts or reorganization... yet another concept beyond you. Adults can understand that. You, obviously, cannot.

Continue to march, Jeffey. Busting you up does hold some amusement for me, and I do admit to a certain enjoyment that you provide.

It's still not too late for you to request the refund for all that money your parents have wasted on you at the Dub... do look into that, won't you?

Westin

"I felt I needed to add some diversity to my campaign staff, so I went out looking for a black, female, handi-capped lesbian with AIDS. I figured that would really get the liberal vote. All I could find was Donna Brazile, a black woman."

VP Al Gore, OCT 6, 1999

-- Westin (86se4sp@my-deja.com), October 19, 1999.

Actually, many of the dire predictions about Prop 13 in California did occur. They are still dealing with them. The program cuts that will result from I-695 will not be painless, and no one knows what programs will eventually be lost or reduced.

-- dbvz (dbvz@wa.freei.net), October 19, 1999.

"Actually, many of the dire predictions about Prop 13 in California did occur" They didn't seem all that dire at the time. In retrospect, they still don't.

-- zowie (zowie@hotmail.com), October 19, 1999.

OK Westin,

Let me try ONE LAST TIME to be constructive with you instead of doing my usual ironic imitations of a certain Westin (in case you hadn't noticed): I'll ask you 3 questions and if you can give me straight answers to them, that will prove that you are indeed Adam Smith, Tom Jefferson and Joseph Haydn all wrapped up in a big high IQ ball & I (as an obvious, um, corollary) am the drooling dumdum of your dreams who faked his way into a 3.93 GPA (which I know you've already long ago checked on, being Credibility Incarnate). Hang on tight, here we go:

1) Where does the quote from Al Gore about the black lesbian with AIDS appear on record as a legitimate quote? (sure it wasn't Dan Quayle?)

2) Where did you ever hear that I drive a car? (Since you said it and have claimed to be "always right", yes, Westin, it IS relevant vis-a- vis your believability)

3) Where DID that $3 billion surplus figure (which even all of your fellow blowhards have since abandoned) come from? (another I-695- relevant question--no fair begging it, Westy!)

Bonus Question: Where did you get the shocking scoop that my parents paid my tuition? You might want to explain this oversight to our readrs since, um, well, they didn't pay it and they ain't payin' back the Stafford Loan--I am!

Remember, the old "truth is relative, man" defense doesn't apply to you, because you are WESTIN, the King Of All Objective Reality!

DEFEND YOUR CROWN, FAIR WESTIN!

-- Bow Down To Chez Ste-vons (chez@u.washington.edu), October 19, 1999.

Mike,

Change is not an easy thing in life. Unemployment is at it lowest level in 20 years. The Government taxes us to death! We are not crazy.

Marc

-- Marc G. (marcgo71@hotmail.com), October 20, 1999.

Jeff...

You're SUCH a hoot!

You refer to your last little vignette as "constructive?" Or are those your "heart pills" doing the talking?

It is SOOO easy to get you off track... to have you brandish your alleged brilliance in the face of the overwhelming disaster that most of your posts represent.

I am, for example, still waiting for a "constructive" response to the post where I answered your "so what's the problem" question... a question so obvious that the PI took an entire editorial to answer you... and much the same way I did.

I guess the problem is that, try as you may to be "constructive," you fail at such an abysmal rate... that it's nearly impossible for you.

As for your alleged GPA? If you have a 3.93, I am, of course, the King of Spain.

For clearly, your efforts on this board show such a decided lack of analytical skills, reading comprehension and situational awareness that for you to have lurched over a 2.0 would rate the level of astonishment amongst us that have actually gone to the school, as opposed to say, being a member of the janitorial staff.

You asked:

"1) Where does the quote from Al Gore about the black lesbian with AIDS appear on record as a legitimate quote? (sure it wasn't Dan Quayle?)"

Gee... did Dan Quayle hire this woman? "2) Where did you ever hear that I drive a car?"

I don't recall ever posting that I had "heard" it.

"(Since you said it and have claimed to be 'always right',"

If you would be so kind as providing the post or posts where I have stated I was "always right?"

"yes, Westin, it IS relevant vis-a- vis your believability)"

Jeffey, if I broadcasted a video of you driving a Porsche on KING 5 News, it wouldn't make any difference vis my credibility.

Try and remember... this is UseNet... where, as you have shown, you can say anything, and claim anything. "3) Where DID that $3 billion surplus figure (which even all of your fellow blowhards have since abandoned) come from? (another I-695- relevant question--no fair begging it, Westy!)"

I really have no idea. Perhaps if you'd be so kind as to indicate where I ever used it?

"Bonus Question: Where did you get the shocking scoop that my parents paid my tuition? You might want to explain this oversight to our readrs since, um, well, they didn't pay it and they ain't payin' back the Stafford Loan--I am!"

Say anything... claim anything. You could have told us that you'd won the lottery. The believeability level would equate to your alleged GPA.

"Remember, the old "truth is relative, man" defense doesn't apply to you, because you are WESTIN, the King Of All Objective Reality!"

I appreciate your slavish devotion.

"DEFEND YOUR CROWN, FAIR WESTIN!"

Fair, huh? Perhaps you've been hanging out on Braodway just a leetle too much?

Westin

Who thinks you did a little too MUCH bowing last Saturday.

-- Westin (86se4sp@my-deja.com), October 20, 1999.

How about this for scare tactics, Mike. Tax and spend, tax and spend. You never DID get the big picture!

http://www.thesunlink.com/westsound99/pages/55.html

http://www.thesunlink.com/news/99sept/daily/0922a3a.html

http://www.thesunlink.com/news/99sept/daily/0930a1d.html

http://www.thesunlink.com/news/99july/daily/0723a3a.html

http://www.thesunlink.com/news/99sept/daily/0915a2c.html

-- Marsha Schaefer (acorn_nut@hotmail.com), October 20, 1999.

Westin,

So, it's the proponents who always give direct and fact-based answers and the opponents who always resort to name-calling and question- begging, right?

Does this mean you're voting NO on I-695 now?

-- Daily Dose of Irony and Minerals (chez@u.washington.edu), October 20, 1999.