Just on Drudge (TV):

Retired Special Forces Sargent Steven Barry stated, under oath, several delta force members shot at the Branch Davidians April 19th.

Posse Comitatus has officially been trampled.

All you doubters and mainstream media feeders have been served notice on the belief in your current paradigm. It's about to be shattered.

-- OR (orwelliator@biosys.net), September 18, 1999

Answers

DRUDGE TV ... FOX NEWS CHANNEL... LIVE SATURDAY 7 PM ET/// RERUN SUNDAY NIGHT 9 PM ET.

-- OR (orwelliator@biosys.net), September 18, 1999.

So, when and where does the first Committee of Correspondence convene??

Night Train

-- Jes' an ol', long memoried footballer (Nighttr@in.lane), September 18, 1999.

The first Committee of Correspondence met in 1774 as a result of the British Intolerable Acts. When does the second meet?

-- Ruth the Moab (aapm@aapainmanage.org), September 18, 1999.

My cheesy cable co. doesn't carry Fox News Network, so either you guys will have to keep me informed or maybe the Sunday am shows will get a hold of the big Drudge exclusive. The mainstream guys hate to cite Drudge, so often they ignore his stuff.

-- semper paratus (always@ready.now), September 18, 1999.

AMERICA THE LATE GREAT SUPER-POWER.---GOING DOWN FOR THE COUNT.going the way of ROME. internally-corrupted.TRULY-TRULY=PRIDE does go before the FALL.

-- it was written-long ago. (dogs@zianet.com), September 18, 1999.

Great handle, Ruth. I've wanted to start a thread asking the question, "How many [posters/lurkers] on this forum would sign [post] their "real" name to The Unanimous Declaration of the Thirteen United States of America, otherwise known as The Declaration of Independence? I include myself in my own question.

Consider, ". . .we hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just Powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its Powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. . ."

Personally, I wonder how much "abdication" by government here, how much "declaration" of people out of its protection, and how much "waging" of "war" against them, would cause a critical mass to, "with firm reliance on the protection of devine Providence" would "mutually pledge to each other" life, fortune, and "sacred honor"?

As you can see from my use of an alias that I've answered my own question regarding myself. At this moment, I'm content to let the "laws of karma" meet out "justice" those involved. . .

-- Dewer Dye (qwerty@!!!!.net), September 18, 1999.

Oops-- "justice" TO those involved. . .

-- Dewer Dye (qwerty@!!!!.net), September 18, 1999.

Good question, Night Train, and good correction, Ruth. Sometime in early 2000 is my best guess...

-- Nabi (nabi7@yahoo.com), September 19, 1999.

Is this on the Net yet? Link?

-- Forrest Covington (theforrest@mindspring.com), September 19, 1999.

Us Brits are always intolerable Ruth :)

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), September 19, 1999.

In the past, I have refrained from commenting about Waco on this forum mainly because it is somewhat off-topic. However, in hypothesizing about the response of the law enforcement community to the potential disruptions in infrastructure that might be initiated by Y2K, their past track record becomes highly relevant.

It has deeply saddened me that more of the law enforcement officials involved in disaster known as Waco have not come forward. There is now more than sufficient evidence to suggest that a large number of officials involved are either deliberately lying or are more collectively incompetent than what is reasonable to believe.

Law enforcement as a whole has a strong vested interest in seeing the truth about events at Waco brought to the light of day. If the lies and/or incompentencies are allowed to stand unchallenged in the face of the evidence that now exists, then the confidence that the nation has in the law enforcement institutions will be lost. Once that occurs and once it becomes irreversible, it will precipitate a disaster far greater than Waco.

I guess I've been fortunate. The few law enforcement officials that I've personally known have not been the kind that would go along with the kind of twisted program we've seen here. By and large, the officials that I've known have been hihgly dedicated professionals that I'd be proud to have as my neighbors.

But Waco cannot and should not be swept under the rug. Like a boil that must lanced, healing cannot begin until the full extent of the truth is exposed to the light of day. It is also abundantly clear that this has not yet happened.

I hope that those law enforcement officials who still consider themselves highly dedicated will search their hearts and do what they can to correct the damage that has been done to their profession by those within their agencies who have been less than honest about what really happened in Waco.

Doing so will be painful and depressing for our country. But not doing so will be catastrophic.

-- Arnie Rimmer (Arnie_Rimmer@usa.net), September 19, 1999.

Arnie,

A lot of us are waiting for this. We've waited all through the "drug war," as innocent people were served "no knock" warrants, shot, or their goods seized even though they were charged with no crime. A black man in my area had 700 dollars in his wallet; it was taken from him at a routine traffic stop. He didn't get a ticket, and wasn't charged with a crime, but the cop thought he shouldn't be walking around with that much money. Money stolen by cops in this way goes right into the dept's kitty; they spend it on newer and better equipment, training, whatever. In this way, local law enforcement has been systematically corrupted. This is happening everywhere; they seize homes, cars, boats - and it costs many thousands of dollars just to BEGIN TRYING to get one's property back. Every cop that values or respects the Constitution (THE LAW from which all other laws proceed) has quit the force by now, or is simply ignorant of the legal and moral corruption they are actively participating in. Cops who shoot people in these "dynamic entries" are shielded by the force and the entire machinery of government, and go unpunished. Murder is frequently committed, for instance, when these militarized police target the wrong house "by accident," or their informant's tip turns out to be fabricated. The shooters are often promoted. If you asked these cops to recite the fourth amendment for you, they'd come up blank (and then probably take any cash you happened to have on you).

I think we've waited long enough. They need to be served notice that the American People will not be intimidated, herded, tagged or enslaved. And if they don't respond appropriately, we need to take apart government and re-create it, as is our RIGHT and our DUTY under the Constitution. And if they don't join humbly in this effort, may God have mercy on their theiving, murdering souls.

Liberty

-- Liberty (liberty@theready.now), September 19, 1999.

I have absolutely no problem using my real name here, or anywhere else. As a matter of fact, I have been very open about my identity all my life. And I say this right here, right now, as great as this country is, it could be much better. There really isn't anyplace any better in this world that I am aware of, otherwise I would be there. I am encouraged by this forum. We are talking in ways we never could before now. Our ideas are heard, and shared by many. We are mainstream America, we ARE the majority! Our collective voice does mean something, THAT IS WHAT WE CAN BUILD ON. Change is inevitably painful. Letting go of old ideas is hard, every one I ever let go of had claw marks all over it.

But it is WE THE PEOPLE...still.

-- Tim Castleman (aztc@earthlink.net), September 19, 1999.

Agreed, the full and accurate story of what happened at Waco needs to come out. We really can never understand why it happened until we have a complete picture of just what did happen.

The biggest obstacle is probably a combination of things. First, those there know they got carried away and went WAY over the line (and error, especially big irresponsible error, is tough to admit). And second, there's a camaraderie among law enforcement people -- it's not, uh, approved of to weasel on each other.

We see the same flavor of problem right here. The forum guidelines are clear and posted for all to read, but the moderators tend to turn a blind eye to those who violate every single guideline, in the several cases where the violators are *our* people, and have the *right opinion*.

The distinction between justice and vengeance is clear to outsiders, but nearly invisible when you're in the thick of things.

-- Flint (flintc@mindspring.com), September 19, 1999.

As usual Flint, your parallactic vision paralyzes your medulla. For some things, there is just no excuse! There can be no ?understanding, or "we're sorry" These were women and children, as well as men. Citizens of the United States of America. These were not FALN terrorists. Misguided maybe, but terrorists, get a grip!

To say "We see the same flavor of problem right here." is not only fallacious and self serving, but it demeans the proper significance of the ideology that could allow a Waco to happen at all! If the Judge isn't on the bench, then he's still in chambers crying over the state of his children. But the trial will soon be in session.

"distinction" of Who's "justice" and Who's "vengeance"? ......"invisible"?....... only to the blind!!

Comaraderie, comradeship, commissariat, (commensurate), commandant, compliant, Comm...........uh..oops!! Kinda systemic isn't it?

-- Michael (mikeymac@uswest.net), September 19, 1999.

I just watched The Rules of Engagement tonite. I am at a loss for words, and feel ill to my stomach. The infrared flim is damning evidence.

-- Uncle Deedah (unkeed@yahoo.com), September 19, 1999.

The infrared film may appear to be "damning" evidence, but it could also turn out to be very weak evidence, as it is not really clear and may be subject to other interpretations. This is the claim made at

Waco Holocaust Electronic Museum

along with many other claims, including:

- The "Waco: Rules of Engagement" video is actually a hoax, as it presents damaging but weak evidence to implicate the FBI and ATF, when in fact the real culprit was the U.S. military's Delta Force special operations unit.

- There exists much stronger evidence of Delta Force's direct "hands on" involvement in the Waco deaths, which the video ignores completely, which the web site presents.

- The real intent of this recent Waco "revelation" is to present weak evidence against the FBI/ATF, while suppressing the strong evidence that incriminates the U.S. military.

I can't say that I personally am sure about anything on this, but you sure ought to check out the link. Its a real eye opener.

-- Jack (jsprat@eld.net), September 19, 1999.

Every polly that stupidly accepts government pronounced Y2K success stories without question (yes, Hoffy, Beano, Cherri, Anita S, Maria, Flint, et al, this just might include you) should start thinking about this stuff. It has far reaching significance for what is coming in LESS than three and a half months.

-- King of Spain (madrid@aol.com), September 20, 1999.