Rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanicgreenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread
"TITANIC AMERICA". I've been below deck, along with 0.5% of the American Public, and what we've seen is a mile long gash in the hull of the ship of state. The gash is there, has been since the 60s and 70s, and has only grown wider with the widespread use of double digit date fields and the explosion in the use of computer technology and embedded chips. The systemic nature of the gash, meaning it cuts across multiple decks and compartments, only ensures there is no repairing it without drydocking the whole thing. Too late for that. When the unremediated code starts to unwind, that is when, metaphorically speaking, the "water" will start pouring into the ship of state. The gash in the hull is already there. You've seen it, those of you who have had the discipline and strength of will to pour over thousands of documents over the past year or two and educate yourselves about this insidious problem. The strollers up on A deck for some bizarre reason could cared less about the screeching sound as our ship hit the iceburg - the screeching sounds of Yourdon, Yardeni, North, Milne, Hyatt, Lord, and many others who tried to warn of the impending disaster. "Who are those cads!? The ships seaworthiness is the Captain's concern, and this ship is unsinkable! Another glass of champagne to wash down that caviar, my dear?" It's friggin' amazing how the American people have allowed Corporate America and American Government to lull them to sleep - into some utopian dream. The dream state, they say, is the deepest sleep. Its the nightmares that jolt us awake. Who can explain why our fellow Americans are busy rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic? Either that, or I'm totally nuts and that gash in the hull I've been staring at for a year was painted on by James Cameron's art department. Can anyone, from a trained sociologist's perspective explain this truly disturbing case of denial and avoidance on the part of the American people? I'm not interest in the PR angle and Koskinen's role as Activities Director, or the presses role in Koskinen's back pocket. I want to somehow understand why Americans resist this issue so adamantly?
-- greg walsh (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 09, 1999
We are social animals. For the vast majority, the desire to be accepted overwhelms logic and even self-preservation in the face of a threat against an unseen, abstract foe.
It is probably best not to resist, as it is Darwinian selection in action.
This also tends to explain the recent trends towards denigration of the Constitution and its principles, in which the individual, and not the state, is held in the highest esteem.
My optimistic Humpty-Dumpty scenario envisions a brighter future in which the worth of the individual over the collective state is, in one manner or another, reasserted and restored to its proper place.
In "A Night to Remember", recall the scene in which a man, unable to get into the lifeboats because they are reserved for women and children, grabs a few deck chairs and starts to lash them together to form a makeshift raft.
Lesson? There's always something that one can do. I would welcome all readers of this bulletin board to recognize the opportunity amid the chaos and despair, survive, and help rebuild a better future.
-- Ann Y Body (email@example.com), September 09, 1999.
"For the vast majority, the desire to be accepted overwhelms logic and even self-preservation in the face of a threat against an unseen, abstract foe. "
So true. We would also rather have the painful familiar than the comfortable unknown.
"My optimistic Humpty-Dumpty scenario envisions a brighter future in which the worth of the individual over the collective state is, in one manner or another, reasserted and restored to its proper place. "
You espouse a Darwinian world view, and still think that the worth of the individual will be esteemed?
"It is probably best not to resist, as it is Darwinian selection in action."
Now that rings more true to one who believes in Darwin's views.
It is God who establishes the worth of the individual and the sanctity and irreplaceable value of each human life. As horrible as the Titanic was, compare it to the sinking ship of recent history whose captain and crew fled like rats. They probably held the Darwinian world view, and felt they must survive as the "fittest". Those who are not afraid to die are more likely to find the courage to act nobly and sacrificially.
To answer greg... remember that God Himself calls His people sheep, and strictly admonishes those who are called to care for them and have been given the ability to lead. We have leaders who seem to be wolves in sheep's clothing.
-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 09, 1999.
I live in a small town surrounded by farms.Alot of the people here are quiety putting away things because of y2k or have plans to move in with others that are prepared.I have found here at least that some people are saying one thing and doing another.The man working working for the city bought 40 acres and put a well in and built a house with a wood burning stove and said he would have all his family move in with him,one family has a farm and thier grown children have moved here from out of state and put two trailers on their property.Farmers have put in extra fuel tanks and had them filled.I could go on but,you get the point.At first y2k wasn't going to be a problem and then after you talk awhile you find out they have already made their plans or in the process of during so.There is a sense of concern and a little fear of others knowing that you are preparing,which I can understand.
I believe we are going to see alot of people moving in with relatives or friends before or shortly after the first of the year.What do you think?
-- maggie (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 09, 1999.
Most of the people alive today ,have never seen a bad problem all of their lives. They have no personal experience/memory to draw from. There for, it is impossible, can't happen . It will be fixed. Don't worry about it. Hence the polly stance. Also, most do not know how a puter works . They just use them. I have a friend that is a nuclear engr. When I spoke with him last year, he sent me to a web site to check my PC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And people ask why worry????????
-- FLAME AWAY (BLehman202@aol.com), September 09, 1999.
It seems to have slipped your attention, but most people are dumb asses!!
You have driven on the freeway lately, havent you?? Or watched T.V.??
-- David Butts (email@example.com), September 09, 1999.
Take two cups of History and call me in the morning.
-- Mr. Decker (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 09, 1999.
I think doomers have a real problem with corporate america. Why? What does this mean, "American people have allowed Corporate America and American Government to lull them to sleep". Do you think that communism or some dicatorship is better? You guys are truly wacko.
-- Maria (email@example.com), September 09, 1999.
Why did Romans continue to live on the slopes of Mount Vesuvious?
Why do people the world over continue to live in earthquake zones?
WHY do people continue to flock to California (never could figure that one out), especially Southern California, being a desert region that uses water from many hundreds of miles away to sustain itself?
For that matter, why do we pay so much attention to opinion polls? [G]
People don't like to think. Never have. Not likely to change now. We are the nut cases. The "lunatic fringe". The 1% that doesn't fit and doesn't care.
Or at least I am. Why don't people listen? Who really cares?
-- Jon Williamson (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 09, 1999.
Let me boil this down to three words... dumbass is epidemic !
-- no talking please (email@example.com), September 09, 1999.
Maria -- what do you think we are in, now? Just because we are still prosperous (not having eaten all our seed -- not yet a basket case like Russia or Cuba) doesn't mean we are not living under a lack of freedom that George Washington, Patrick Henry... would have looked at aghast.
-- A (A@AisA.com), September 09, 1999.
Thanks everyone for your responses. Mumsie, thanks for this probably on relevant comment that will carry us into a brave new world post millennium meltdown, "Those who are not afraid to die are more likely to find the courage to act nobly and sacrificially." To Maria: After 23 years as a propanda specialist inside the walls of one of the largest corporations in America all I can say to you is, you missed one of the chairs up on deck C, it needs to move an inch to the west.
-- greg walsh (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 09, 1999.
This is for Maria...
So, Maria, do you think it is OK for the government to take basically half of your hard earned wages every payday?
Which one of the missiles that hit targets in Kosovo/Iraq did you buy?
When lying becomes the norm, what does that make the truth?
Name some Corporate America companies that have NOT affected the enviornment in a detrimental way.
I have a few more but I will spare you...
I have a BIG problem with the corporate america/big government bedmates.
OBTW, I work for a HUGE corporate america member, and have for 20 years.
scratchin my ear....
-- Dog (Desert Dog@-sand.com), September 09, 1999.
On any issue (such as Y2K, abortion, education, gun control, taxes, or welfare) there are always at least two or more views on the subject for us to choose from. As we examine the different views on a particular issue, we usually select the one that most closely agrees with our current biases so we don't have to adjust the way we view the world.
However, our knowledge and beliefs are constantly changing, sometimes slowly and sometimes rapidly. Depending on what outside pressures are bearing down on us at the moment, we may or may not have time to adjust our beliefs as new information becomes available. To quote Scarlett, "I'll think about that tomorrow."
As event horizons draw closer in time, more people will take the time to closely examine the issue and adjust their thinking if that is appropriate. For example, as people age and their bodies gradually wear out, many folks decide to more carefully study the possibility of a "hereafter." But when you are young and believe you are immortal, there just doesn't seem to be any reason for this type of analysis.
The bottom line. As the days tick off and as January 1, 2000 draws closer, each day more people will take the time to more carefully examine all aspects of this issue and adjust their thinking if it seems reasonable to them. I suspect there will be an exponential explosion in awareness at some point between now and 1-1-2000. On the other hand, if the "three day snow storm" receives enough influential support in the various media, the exponential explosion in awareness may be delayed until the second or third week in January of the year 2000.
May God Bless.
-- Grandpappy (Grandpappy@old-timers.hom), September 09, 1999.
I was at a Wallyworld store last Saturday looking for some plastic tubs to put my batteries in for my solar system. So naturally I was thinking about Y2K. I started looking at the other shoppers, just studying their faces, listening to a few words they might say, and what they were buying.
I didn't speak to any of them, so it was a purely subjective conclusion I reached. My conclusion was that none of them had any knowledge of Y2K, except that it means Yes 2 Kia.
They are not resisting anything. They are truly clueless. Maybe when Oprah tells them to worry, they'll finally pay attention, but not until.
-- Dog Gone (email@example.com), September 09, 1999.
I too, where ever I go, I look at people's faces. For months, I've had this edge, this awesome knowledge that what will befall Americans will go so much harder on them because they will fall from such a great height of luxury and convenience.
The faces in America that I see are concerned with fine restaurants and shopping sprees. With stock portfolios and remodelled kitchens. With love affairs and deck chairs.
Nowhere do I see the faces of people concerned with war.
We are not a society of warriors, not spiritually, not physically and surely not emotionally. We are sheep being lead to slaughter. Lemmings being lead to the cliffs. And even the best prepared of us cannot prepare for a nine or a ten on the Y2K seismic scale.
Soon, we will be boiling in our karma, may God have mercy on
-- greg walsh (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 13, 1999.
>>For months, I've had this edge, this awesome knowledge that what will befall Americans...<<
Some of you guys just need to be right so bad....otherwise how will you validate yourselves come an uneventful January?
-- Johnny Canuck (email@example.com), September 14, 1999.
Johnny, some of us need to be right or we'll have red faces in January (or maybe not 'til Sept, but whatever). You, on the other hand, have to be right or you'll have to face your children - and their hunger.
-- T the C (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 14, 1999.
I spent Saturday at a local horse show. (Hunters) the parents had that little distracted air that some do when they are doing things simply to maintain appearances for the kids. These folks represented some of the scions of the sharpest money families in Cleve and surrounding burbs. (If you are familiar, or into horsies, the show was the Chagrin Valley Hunt Club Fall Hunter-Jumper show)
I SO hope that I was reading them right. Though, when I have these same strata of folks in the car (NOT UNLIKELY) they are SO CLUELESS!!
-- Chuck, a night driver (email@example.com), September 14, 1999.
It's so ironic how this Titanic thing is so fresh in our American consciousness (even though I didn't see the latest movie, nor did I want to) what with the movie and all so fresh in the news with all it's hype. It's as if God is and has been trying to tell us something. But for most people, all they saw of the "Titanic", the movie of a real event, was a great romantic love story completely missing the real story which is about the story which is about to engulf all of us. Which is about modern America.
The Bible tells us that God, so merciful and like a perfect gentleman, even when He is about to bring a nation down will make it known. Makes it known in a variety of ways. But, as history will attest, only a few GI. Most are so caught up in their own illusions if not the romance of the ride that they cannot be snapped out of it to save themselves except for those who will be saved out of His sheer mercy and grace working through the preps of another will be given a seat on the lifeboat.
"Surely the Lord God will do nothing, but He revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets. The lion hath roared, who will not fear? The Lord God hath spoken, who can but prophesy?" Amos 3:7/8 (Hint: The Lion is Jesus, the Lion of the tribe of Judah)
Yes, the Lord has indeed spoken to His prophets and they are many. But the church in America refuses to listen or even acknowledge them. She listens instead to the "board members" and pastors preach to itching ears.
Ephesians 4:11 "And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers."
I Corinthians 12:28 "And god has appointed these in the church: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers ..."
But I believe that such a fall forthcoming will be so monumental and will create such a huge wave that merciful God Almighty has erected in our case (The USA) so many diverse voices that nobody can say that they were not warned. If their lifestyle was so depraved that they only cared about daytime junk TV and therefore did not avail themselves of the information to protect themselves and or scoffed at the idea of making preps lest he/she be also ridiculed then who can they blame? Certainly not Bill Clinton. If they even voted at all, that's probably who they voted for.
The Titanic ...so fresh in our minds ...great picture.
-- S. David Bays (SDBAYS@prodigy.net), September 14, 1999.
I beg to be ridiculed in March for having prepared to save my boys from the potential suffering that my research tells me will occur as a direct result of the millennium glitch. Please promise that you will be the first in line to heap the ridicule? Since, in your view, the world will experience only a bump-in-the-road, then my email address will still be valid and simply send the scathing insults to my desktop around March 31 or so, once it is obvious there will be no Y2K disaster. I pray to God for your ridicule as it will signify the world has dodged a bullit the size of Jupit
-- greg (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 14, 1999.