The Power Grid and Protecting My Home From Surges and Brownouts: Suggestions?

greenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread

I've been hearing enough anecdotal info about the damage inflicted (even with surge protectors), that it's really got me wondering. People report that surges and brownouts have damaged appliances and electronic equipment, so I'm looking for some clarification here.

During the rollover, for however long it seems to go on, I know some of you anticipate surges and brownouts/blackouts of unknown frequency and/or duration. During that period, if I have electrical equipment turned on, can it be damaged permanently by these irregularities in current? What if equipment is turned off, but still plugged in; does contact with the wiring still leave it vulnerable to some extent? Since the rollover will be occurring in winter, I would normally have my heat pump, well pump, frig., phones, kitchen lights, fax, etc., running normally, especially on New Year's Eve, when no one will be going to bed early around here. If the grid starts going through unusual gyrations trying to sort itself out, could that cause surges or brownouts that could "fry" some of these systems? I'm wondering (and this may sound nuts, but I am the first to admit that I don't know enough to assume anything) whether I need to actually turn off the circuit breaker to my house, to protect the wiring and all the equipment installed in it? I sure don't want to have to invest a fortune, and get in line with lots of other folks, to replace the electrical "infrastructure" of my home and business, after the rollover.

While I'm keeping my fingers crossed, and praying constantly that the grid stays up, the anecdotes suggest to me that SOME types of power delivery could cause a whole other set of problems. Is this the case? Or can I leave my house "plugged" in as usual, while I'm "waiting to see what happens", and stop worrying about it.

Any thoughts on this? What are you planning regarding your own connection to the grid? What about the way the solar maximum might play into all of this, too, if you think that is a factor? Thanks, Kristi

-- Kristi (KsaintA@aol.com), September 08, 1999

Answers

Hi Kristi,

My electric company offered a "whole house" surge protector for $150.00. I took them up on the offer even though they are "compliant" (wink wink). I would imagine that an electrician would be able to do this.

-- Mabel Dodge (cynical@me.net), September 08, 1999.


Should I Buy CP&L's whole-house surge protection plan?

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=000Y UD

I have a Question about Surge Protectors******Looking for Advice

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=0014 FP

-- mabel (mabel_louise@yahoo.com), September 08, 1999.


I have bought some surge protectors and also I have an old vacuum-tube type television that I plan to use during the rollover.This is one thing I learned from an electronics course I took, old vacuum-tube technology stands up better to power problems than transistor/chip technology.I will also have a battery powered TV in case of no power.I highly recommend keeping old functioning appliances around as test devices.I have an old still working microwave that I plan to use for this purpose.

-- Stanley Lucas (StanleyLucas@WebTv.net), September 08, 1999.

A surge protector may be helpful in many "overvoltage" situations. But don't trust it 100 %. I believe the greater danger lies in Brownouts (low voltage). Your gear will suck up juice, and fry. Especially motors that are unable to start, like a freezer, refrigerator, and the motor in your "out of sight, out of mind" furnace. Does it have a Surge protector?

The only practical way for most folk to avoid Brownout-Burnout is to disconnect at the breaker box or turn off the main exterior breaker prior to the event occuring, or asap when it hits. Watch for dimming lights as one form of warning. Yes, some gear _can_ burn out out by being plugged in, as when the power switch actually controls the secondary of a Line transformer.

Another problem worth considering: Can you light your gas stove/range when the power is out? Hit the breaker to check on this, then ask someone else how to resolve it.

And don't forget: When your gas supply goes down, so does your furnace pilot light (garage too?), and water heater pilot.

Better practice now!

-- A. Hambley (a.hambley@usa.net), September 08, 1999.


I bought a "Whole House Surge Protector" for $60 a few years ago to protect my electronics against power surges. I have not lost anything since. It took me 20 minutes and a screw driver to hook it up to my home's electrical distribution panel. Unfortunately the manufacturer seems to have disappeared. You might try Home Depot, Hechingers, etc. and electrical parts supply companies.

If you intend to power electronic/computer things off of your generator, I would recommend that you also consider buying a small UPS (Uninterruptable Power Supply) unit from a company like APC (American Power Conversion). They are the leading vendor (I have no relationship to them)for products like this for small offices. Their phone number is 800-800-4272. I just noticed that PC Connection (800-800-5555) has a special $150 off sale for $169 (net) + $20 shipping an APC 'Smart-UPS' that provides surge protection and 5-10 minutes of backup power for about 300 watts of power. (I have no relationship to PC Connection either but have used them as my primary computer mail order company for 5 years)

So if the local power company crashes, I will run my refrigerator, microwave, security system etc off of my gas driven 5000 watt generator. I'll first throw my electrical distribution panel main switch to off so I do not transfer any power between the power company (and thus my neighborhood) and my generator while my generator is running. I'll throw to 'off' all of the circuit breakers on my distribution panel for all the non-essential circuits. I'll plug, with heavy duty (10 or 12 gauge) 3 wire grounded extension cords and male-to-male dongles, my carefully grounded (very important) electrical gas driven generator into several standard 3 prong outlets on my home's critical circuits.

If you use your own electrical generator it is crucial to 1. Disconnect your home from the electrical power company by throwing to 'off' your panel's main disconnect breaker. Otherwise you'll be powering your entire neighbor hood and perhaps even electrocute a power company worker. 2. Ground your generator using a pipe driven into the wet ground. 3. Use extreme caution handling the gasoline for your generator. 4. Power off all applliances before you shut off your generator to refuel it. 5. Operate your generator outdoors in a windy area to disperse the deadly fumes. 6. Hope that your generator's noise does not attract unlawful aggressive hungry cold scavengers.

Good luck. Things might be very interesting in3+ months. I hope not.

Ron Sander

-- Ron Sander (judy_sander@hotmail.com), September 08, 1999.



A. Hambley wrote in part: "Another problem worth considering: Can you light your gas stove/range when the power is out? Hit the breaker to check on this, then ask someone else how to resolve it. "

If anyone out there has a way to resolve this, I would love to know. We have a propane stove and I checked with the manufacturer about the oven. (We can light the burners, but not the oven). The oven requires electricity to ignite-- has some type of striker or sparker ignition. No alternative suggestions were offered...

-- winter wondering (winterwondring@yahoo.com), September 08, 1999.


BROWN OUT: if the equipment is plugged in and the switch is ON, damage may occurre, depends on the lenght of time the equipment is on, 60-600 seconds.

BROWN OUTS: if the switch is OFF, no damage will occurre.

POWER SURGE: if the equipment is pluggled in and the switch is ON or OFF, damage may occurre.

Lightning will pass right through a switch that if turned off. A power surge is concidered Higher then normal voltage, A brown out is Lower then normal voltage. Lower voltage will not pass through a switch that is turned OFF.

If you experiance a brown out, turn your power OFF at the MAIN breaker. Then turn all you breakers off at the panel. Turn on one breaker that will have a lamp, only on it, say your bed room. If you have a T.V. plugged in on this circuit, un-plug it first. Watch your light bulb. If it brightens up to full wattage, its safe to turn the other breakers on again. Learn how to do this. This will save your equipment from burning up in a brown out.

A SURGE on the other hand, will burn your equipment up. Try to turn every thing off as fast as you can. If lightning is close, turn off your equipment off before the surge occurres.

Y2K, may bring brown outs, not surges. Good luck.

-- Hooks (Powerlineman@been there.com), September 08, 1999.


Hooks,

My understanding of the failed Y2K test in Hawaii, back in May, was that half the service area got no juice, and that the rest got way too much. Yet you say that Y2K would only bring brownouts, not surges. Did I receive erroneous information?

-- Bokonon (bok0non@my-Deja.com), September 08, 1999.


A few days ago an old friends visited, who happens to work for an electric company. He told us that a brownout situation automatically shuts down the grid in the area where it is occurring, so nothing can be damaged. Hmmm. Izzat so? Anybody know for sure?

-- Shivani Arjuna (SArjuna@aol.com), September 09, 1999.

Here is a thread that deals with Brown outs. Plus Sysman started a thread above on the topic.

One of the more interesting prep threads I have read.

 Low Voltage problems

"An earlier thread referenced a concern about "low voltage" burning out pumps, furnace motors, etc.  Avery legitimate concern,  and one I have never seen mentioned before."

-- Brian (imager@home.com), September 09, 1999.



winter wondering,

We just replaced a vintage stove. The service fella at the appliance place said that for about the last 30 years the ovens on gas stoves have had a safety device that prevents using the oven when the power is off.

I asked on the prep forum if anyone had used a Coleman camping oven over a propane burner indoors, but I don't think anyone has taken a shot at it yet.

-- flora (***@__._), September 09, 1999.


Apartment dwellers have at least one appliance, the refrigerator, that probably won't be turned off for any extended period. In cold climates any individual apartment furnace (with its blower motor)also probably won't be turned off.

Not all apartment dwellers will be staying in their own apartments during the rollover.

Is it possible for the overheating of appliance motors to cause a fire? If so, perhaps not only apartment dwellers, but apartment owners, should be paying much more attention to the possibility of a brown-out in their location.

-- Tom Carey (tomcarey@mindspring.com), September 09, 1999.


i have serviced various kitchen appliances in one of my former jobs, refrig./freezers are protected by a thermal overload that cuts out the compressor for about 5 minutes if they are tripped. likewise most furnace motors have a built in thermal overload device integral in the motor this will also trip if too many amps are pulled by the motor or the motor temp. rises to a certain temperature.

these appliances are built this way to be self protective by the manufacturer to prevent the exact scenario you folks are talking about. when i was doing tv work the manufacturers were also putting in power sentry circuits into the tv sets to protect them in a brownout, dont know if they still do that now or not.

R-man

-- repairman (tool@time.com), September 10, 1999.


Moderation questions? read the FAQ