.Gov LIES -- Oops, FBI Now Says of WACO Denials

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8/24/99 -- 9:39 PM

Oops, FBI Now Says of WACO Denials

WASHINGTON (AP) - Retreating from its past denials, the FBI is acknowledging that federal agents fired one or more incendiary tear gas canisters during the standoff with Branch Davidians led by David Koresh, a federal law enforcement official said Tuesday.

The agency, however, is maintaining its stance that it did not start the fire that consumed the Branch Davidian compound with Koresh and more than 80 followers inside in Waco, Texas, on April 19, 1993.

``The bottom line here continues to be that the Davidians set that fire and that law enforcement did not set that fire,'' said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

Incendiary devices - believed to be two military tear gas canisters - were fired not at buildings in the Branch Davidian compound, but at a bunker nearby. They bounced off the bunker's concrete roof but did not enter any structures, the official said.

The flammable canisters were fired early in the morning, around 6 a.m., the official added. The fire that destroyed the compound started around noon.

Other tear gas canisters used by federal agents throughout the day were not flammable or potentially explosive, the official said.

Until now, the FBI had maintained it used only nonflammable canisters to get tear gas into the compound because of fears that pyrotechnic grenades might spark a fire in the wooden structure.

However, the FBI is reconsidering those assertions this week after a Danny Coulson, a former deputy director of the agency, told The Dallas Morning News that potentially flammable tear gas grenades were fired into an underground structure that led to tunnels opening into the compound.

But Coulson, who also was founding commander of the FBI's hostage rescue team, told the newspaper the incendiary canisters were fired hours before the blaze began and played no role in starting it.

``We're aware of the reports and we're trying to get to the bottom of it as quickly as we can,'' Justice Department spokesman Myron Marlin said late Tuesday.

Justice Department officials, including Attorney General Janet Reno, in the past have forcefully denied allegations that flammable devices were used by the FBI during the final standoff at Waco.

The issue of whether the FBI used pyrotechnic devices has been a major focus of an ongoing inquiry by the Texas Rangers and a key allegation in a pending wrongful-death lawsuit against the government by surviving Davidians and families of those who died.

The federal government consistently has disputed accusations that the FBI started the fire. Independent investigators concluded the fire began simultaneously in three separate places.

FBI bugs recorded Davidians discussing spreading fuel and planning a fire hours before the compound burned. Arson investigators also found evidence that gasoline, charcoal lighter fluid and camp stove fuel had been poured inside the compound.

-- Ashton & Leska (allaha@earthlink.net), August 24, 1999


Another spin machine spewing sticky cobwebbed LIES busted by a brave ex-system come-forward.

Jim Lord may have started the Lies Hit The Fan :-)

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), August 24, 1999.

For those of you who haven't watched the documentary, "Waco, Terms of Engagement," (I believe that's the title) I highly recommend it. The Feds injected gas into the building via tanks, that was extremely flamable. If you rent the video, like I did, you can watch the infra red video of the Feds firing on the compound. You can see the video of the bullet holes in the front door. You will also find out that the doors were "lost" after the "suicidal fire." It becomes fairly obvious that the raid was a publicity stunt gone horribly wrong. Possibly it was something more nefarious...

-- dgi (dgi@fake.ing), August 24, 1999.

The Texas Rangers are also holding a substantial amount of evidence that documents some of the deeds and misdeeds of the FBI. They are wondering if it is safe to turn this evidence over to the Court or to other officials. I can't find the link but it was within the last 3 or 4 days. This was one of the first official acts of Janet Reno, to accept the blame for this fiasco (inferno?) when she had been on the job about 2 weeks and was still trying to figure out what was going on. Are some Branch Dividians in jail on charges relating to this event? Typical government operation. Burn down the place and then charge the victims. All of this over alleged firearms violations? What next? Confiscation? Second amendment where are you? Hang on Rangers. Ranger Walker what is going on down there?

-- Tom (Tom@notstupid.gom), August 24, 1999.


Is it any wonder why us "Doomers" don't trust the f**king gubmint?

WE NEVER FIRED ANYTHING FLAMMABLE INTO THAT BUILDING... Um, well, we DID (they say, 6 YEARS later), "but it didn't start any fires!"

I wouldn't believe the Goddamned gubmint if they said the sky is blue! There is not ONE SINGLE BUREAUCRAT in federal gov't service today that's even CAPABLE OF UNDERSTANDING WHAT THE TRUTH *IS*, let alone of TELLING the truth to others!

Christ! If there was ever a need for evidence PROVING why we need our personal guns, and why we shouldn't listen to their "spin" (LIES!), this kind of crap is IT!

-- Dennis (djolson@pressenter.com), August 24, 1999.

Hey Ashton and Leska -

Maybe the school kids will have to read "Lord of the Lies" in the New Millennium. (;^}`X~~

-- Michael (mikeymac@uswest.net), August 24, 1999.

Hhmmm, bet there's lotsa home schooling post-Y2K. This Forum has been a crash beyond-college course for us! Previously we had not heard much about Waco, conspiracies, militias, .gov .mil .biz .system anything. Now we don't know what to think, except it's painfully obvious the LIES are the norm, which is a vile abomination of the way things are meant to be.

Will Andy weigh in later tonight? Seems like this article might pique his interest ...

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), August 24, 1999.

Ashton & Leska in Cascadia,

How are you folks doing. I remember a post sometime a few months ago were you said that you didn't expect to live if thing got very bad, because of your lack of funds. Is that still true? Was it you that made the post in the first place?

I remember that night because my parents and I were discussing Y2K and lethal response. We broke into tears when we read, what I believe to have been your post. If people like you won't make it, what's the point?

-- dgi (dgi@fake.ing), August 25, 1999.

I know some folks over that way.

If they wanted to arrest anybody, they could have.

It wouldn't have taken a confrontation.

-- no talking please (breadlines@soupkitchen.gov), August 25, 1999.

dgi, we're doing great, thanks! We're prepped for a 3, sorta hard for wavering fear of an 8.5, but we're OK. We don't have enough funds because we haven't made earning $$ a high priority, so it's sorta our fault. We've gone for quality of life and helping others in this life -- the long term investment to feather our nest in heaven ;^)

If a wild ravenous band of looters comes to pinch our TP, we're goners, at least it looks that way at the mo. We're too peaceful and haven't learned the, um, defensive arts. Although we'd have no mental problem at all defending ourselves, we aren't a match for those who have the Uzis and 10000s of rounds of ammo.

If it weren't for the humanimals we'd do fine, at least the first part of 2000. If it goes Infomagic we don't have the land to grow food. We don't mind exiting the planet peacefully but we're not too keen on the violence thing.

But how many Yourdynamites look forward to being ripped apart by marauders?

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), August 25, 1999.

Wow, folks, look at this! "Watch what they DO, not what they say."

This place has BUNKERS GALORE! Sure, "environmental."
Elizabeth Claire Prophet, who now has Alzheimers.

Remember last year we posted asking about this? We had heard that FEMA/US Gov had bought this place for Y2K hide-out. YEP!

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Yahoo! News Top Stories Headlines, Saturday August 21 10:15 AM ET, By Steve Holland

US Government Buys Ranchland From Apocalyptic Sect

EDGARTOWN, Mass. (Reuters) - President Clinton announced a $13 million deal Saturday to buy 9,300 acres of land owned by an apocalyptic sect in a bid to protect the wildlife and famed geysers of Yellowstone National Park.

Clinton, in his weekly radio address, said the U.S. Forest Service will acquire title to, or conservation easements on, 9,300 acres of the Royal Teton Ranch north of Yellowstone, and will acquire geothermal rights to the entire 12,000-acre Montana ranch.

The land is owned by a controversial apocalyptic sect called the Church Universal and Triumphant, which predicted in the 1980s a nuclear holocaust and built a huge underground fallout shelter in preparation for it.

Environmentalists have expressed concerns about church activities on the ranch north of America's oldest national park.

The church bought the property from the late publishing magnate Malcolm Forbes in 1981. The federal government tried to buy the land at that time, but to no avail.

One church plan involved developing geothermal water rights for a church-run spa. Environmentalists feared the plan could deplete underground water supplies feeding park geysers such as the famed ``Old Faithful.''

The White House said the purchase will provide a critical winter range for Yellowstone bison, which in some years face starvation because of inadequate food supplies in the park, and preserve important migration corridors for elk, antelope, bighorn sheep, grizzly bears and other wildlife.

The land will be owned and managed by the Gallatin National Forest, officials said. The deal to buy the land for $13 million was made with help from the nonprofit Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation, based in Missoula, Montana.

It marked Clinton's second major move to help protect Yellowstone after he visited the park on a Wyoming vacation in 1995.

Last year, his administration completed the acquisition of the site of the proposed New World Mine, which environmentalists had said would damage the park's fragile ecosystem.

White House spokesman Jake Siewert said the federal government had no problem buying the land from a controversial group.

``We appreciate their decision to sell this,'' Siewert said. ''They could have found other buyers that were not as concerned about conserving the land.'' http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/19990821

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), August 25, 1999.

Here is the link to visit the Waco Museum.


-- Sharon L (sharonl@volcano.net), August 25, 1999.

From Cory's ListServ, written by somebody else:

The implications of Waco to Y2K is relevant to our speculation of how the government might react in a crisis, its nature as relates to civilian rights and the follow-on implications to our families' liberty, and possibly, survival.

If more of the Germans had taken better note of Hitler and his nature early on before he reached full power, than history might have been a bit different.

Our current adminstration's nature is self-evident.
Does Martial Law have anything to do with Y2K?

How about violation of civil liberties, or the propensity to violate same?

How about a nation's leader's propensity to lie, steal, rape, murder, or sell national secrets?

Granted that this sight should stay on focus, but I do recall that we went off tangent regarding martial law for some time. I would also consider the link to the other site as an option to pursue this side issue in more detail on a different forum.

As for me, I am interested in all relevant information, from chickens to politics. (Now that I think about it, these days there ain't much difference (I apologize to any chickens or chicken lovers for the slam.)) -----------------------------------------------------------------

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), August 25, 1999.

Waco will be viewed in years to come as one of the most foul acts of our current evil regime; it was a watershed event in contemporary America. I also encourage everyone to see 'Terms of Engagement,' and imagine how it can be that many of the people involved in burning those children to death have been promoted within their ranks. Waco was the Culture of Death unveiled.

-- Spidey (in@jam.commie), August 25, 1999.

The CS gas injected in to and fired in to the Branch Davidian compound is not a fire hazard if used outdoors. The manufactuter warns that if used in doors sufficient concentrations will create a fire hazard.

The documentry "Waco: The rules of engagment" claims to show on infared video the fire starting near the back of the compound when a tank pushes through a wall. The flash seen on the IR video was claimed to be sunlight reflecting off of glass. However the technician who was explaining what the video was showing said that the sun light flashes do not show up on IR. Unfortunatly, I am not an IR tech so I don't know.

I still would like an explainantion on why the parts of the building that were not buring were bulldozed back in to the fire.

Keep your...

-- eyes_open (best@wishes.net), August 25, 1999.

I once worked for FLIR Systems, Inc., the world's leading mfr of IR viewing devices. Light "flashes" do NOT show up on IR, which shows only HEAT. Rest assured on that fact.

-- Dennis (djolson@pressenter.com), August 25, 1999.

CS gas is NASTY!!! In addition to causing total agony in small doses, it can cripple and kill - is almost guaranteed to do so if concentrated in an enclosed space. Watch the candid footage of the BATF agents in "Waco: The Rules of Engagement" video, bragging about their bloodlust; they are ANIMALS! They concentrated CS in that building when they KNEW TINY CHILDREN AND INFANTS WERE THERE. This, in addition to the lies that the whole operation was based on. The whole thing stinks. Please don't stop standing up for the truth.


-- Jim (Jim@disgustedwithgovt.com), August 25, 1999.

After reading this post and going to the link and reading the whole report there, I think that we all need to be afraid in our own country, because if the things documented there are true, then none of us is safe here in our nation anymore. Whew! The entire reading filled me with a nausea and horror that I experienced when reading the non-fiction on the various Nazi concentration camps. Possible here???

-- R. Not Safehere (tooscared@to.say), August 25, 1999.

Wednesday, 25 August 1999 22:28 (GMT), (UPI Spotlight)

Rep. Barr Calls For New Waco Hearings

WASHINGTON, Aug. 25 (UPI) - Reports that the FBI fired pyrotechnic tear gas canisters during the operation that ended the 1995 Branch Davidian compound siege in Waco prompted a Congressman to call (Wednesday) for new hearings into the controversial operation.

Rep. Bob Barr, R-Ga., sent a letter to the chairman of the House Government Reform Committee and to Attorney General Janet Reno saying the reports raise questions as to whether government officials lied to Congress about what exactly happened at Waco.

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), August 25, 1999.

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8/26/99 -- 10:14 AM

Reno vows to `get to the truth on Waco'

WASHINGTON (AP) - Attorney General Janet Reno pledged today to ``get to the bottom'' of why it took the FBI six years to admit that its agents may have fired potentially flammable tear gas canisters on the final day of their standoff with the Branch Davidian cult near Waco, Texas.

``I have no reason at this point to believe the FBI is responsible for the deaths of those people,'' Reno told her weekly news conference at the Justice Department. But she said she was ``very, very frustrated'' that six years after categorical denials by the FBI there were news reports about the possible use of flammable devices.

``It is absolutely critical that we do everything humanly possible to learn all the facts as accurately as possible and make them available to the Congress and public,'' said Reno, who, along with FBI Director Louis Freeh, has ordered a fresh investigation of what transpired on April 19, 1993, at the Branch Davidian compound.

Earlier, Reno and Freeh ordered 40 FBI agents led by an FBI inspector to re-interview everyone who was at the Waco scene. FBI spokesman John Collingwood said Wednesday night that the agents are to report ``within weeks'' on all aspects of the use of military-type tear gas and why it took so long to be admitted publicly.

Reno said she had gone over in her mind many times the events of that fiery day and had many times asked herself how the government might have handled it differently.

Had no stand been taken that day, she said, ``We don't know if (cult leader) David Koresh would have done it two weeks later on his own, without any provocation, and the federal government would have been blamed for not acting sooner.''

Meantime, the chairman of the Texas Department of Public Safety told The Dallas Morning News that federal officials need to explain why members of the Army's secret Delta Force anti-terrorism squad were at the scene the day the compound burned.

``Everyone involved knows they were there. If there is an issue, it was what was their role at the time,'' said James B. Francis of Dallas. ``Some of the evidence that I have reviewed and been made aware of is very problematical as to the role of Delta Force at the siege.''

The News cited a Defense Department document obtained under the Freedom of Information Act that confirms that the Special Forces unit was on the scene when the FBI hostage rescue unit used tanks to assault the compound with tear gas on April 19, 1993. The U.S. military is barred from domestic police work.

Republicans in Congress made clear they would reopen hearings into the 51-day siege. The standoff ended with the death of Koresh and about 80 followers during a fire that erupted after the tear gas assault on their wooden headquarters.

Reno today described herself as ``very troubled'' by the developments and said she had been consistently told that no incendiary devices were used at the compound.

``I will continue to pursue this matter to get to the truth,'' she told reporters. ``I intend the results of the review to be made public and I will not stop until I get to the bottom of this.''

She said a meeting was to be held later today, at which time officials would discuss whether an outside investigation should be undertaken.

Asked if she thought the reversal of position had harmed her credibility, Reno replied, ``I don't think it's very good for my credibility, and that's why I am going to pursue it until I get to the truth.''

On Capitol Hill, Rep. Dan Burton, R-Ind., chairman of the House Government Reform Committee, said, ``I am deeply concerned by these inconsistencies. ... I intend for the committee to get to the bottom of this.''

Sen. Charles Grassley, R-Iowa, who chairs a subcommittee that oversees the FBI, said, ``This is a serious development in terms of further erosion of the FBI's credibility.''

Collingwood said: ``The FBI may have used a very limited number of military-type CS gas canisters on the morning of April 19 in an attempt to penetrate the roof of an underground bunker 30 to 40 yards away from the main Branch Davidian compound,'' he said.

Unlike the civilian tear gas used later, ``the military canisters may have contained a substance that is designed to disperse the gas using a pyrotechnic mixture,'' Collingwood said.

Officials said two military tear gas canisters were fired just after 6 a.m., six hours before the fire began. The canisters bounced off the roof of the concrete bunker and landed in an open field, according to these officials, who requested anonymity.

Nonpyrotechnic tear gas canisters had not penetrated the bunker, which was linked to the main building by tunnels, the officials said. The FBI wanted to clear out anyone hiding there.

Two officials suggested word of the military canisters might not have been relayed to top FBI and Justice officials earlier because original inquiries focused on the fire in the main building and the military canisters had been fired almost 180 degrees away from that building and hours before the fire.

Independent investigators concluded the fire began simultaneously in three places. FBI bugs recorded Davidians discussing spreading fuel and planning a fire hours before the compound burned. Arson investigators found that gasoline, charcoal lighter fluid and camp stove fuel had been poured inside the compound.

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), August 26, 1999.

Waco. May the Truth triumph soon. The Holocaust. The words "Never Again" became the mantra. Study the root causes or prepare to experience the next Holocaust. Read about the political, economical, educational, cultural and spiritual climate of eastern Europe preceding WWII. I do not believe that mankind is beyond another Holocaust. We are the same grasping, greedy, excusing, blaming, and prideful bunch as we have always been. What worldview do people hold? Do they believe that within the context of their beliefs, the end justifies the means? Do they passionately espouse a goal without explaining how it will be implemented? Are they willing to carry out the nitty gritty details themselves? Or will they close their eyes and ears, as did the German, Polish (etc.) civilians who were silent during Krystal Nacht and mass deportations. Will they ignore the burning stench from smokestacks (or whatever method is employed), or swallow the government spin? Will they silently inhabit and possess the homes and belongings of those who have disappeared? Will they ignore the emptying of hospital wards and other institutions of the mentally and physically challenged/disabled? What about your neighbor or co-worker (s)? Will they be targeted, or inform on you? We now have generations raised on situation ethics (no moral absolutes) and the god of Self. Who will bother about wicked doings as long as they are safe and warm in their own homes with a full belly? The New Ager's, for example, pride themselves on their peacefulness and diversity, yet delve into the writings of the leaders of this movement, and you will see their calm and dispassionate belief that certain large groups of people need to be "removed" from the planet. They don't seem to particularly mind how this happens, and if it is something "bad" that happens to them, well, hey, better karma next time. One very interesting and largely ignored facet of Hitler and his henchmen has been their strong occultic beliefs and practices. There is almost always some passion behind the madness. It is the same with many powerful people today. If you want to know the truth, just dig a little.

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), August 26, 1999.


)1999, The Dallas Morning News

In Texas, the chairman of the Department of Public Safety said that federal authorities also need to investigate and explain why members of the U.S. Army's secret Delta Force anti-terrorist unit were present the day the compound burned.

"Everyone involved knows they were there. If there is an issue, it was what was their role at the time," said James B. Francis Jr. of Dallas. "Some of the evidence that I have reviewed and been made aware of is very problematical as to the role of Delta Force at the siege."


(UPI Spotlight)Rep. Barr calls for new Waco hearings WASHINGTON, Aug. 25 (UPI) - Reports that the FBI fired pyrotechnic tear gas canisters during the operation that ended the 1995 Branch Davidian compound siege in Waco prompted a Congressman to call (Wednesday) for new hearings into the controversial operation. Rep. Bob Barr, R-Ga., sent a letter to the chairman of the House Government Reform Committee and to Attorney General Janet Reno saying the reports raise questions as to whether government officials lied to Congress about what exactly happened at Waco.


WASHINGTON (AP) - The FBI is launching an internal inquiry into why it took six years to admit that agents may have fired potentially flammable tear gas canisters on the final day of the 1993 standoff with the Branch Davidian cult near Waco, Texas.

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), August 26, 1999.

The Davidians were never discussing burning themselves to death in a cult suicide; they were filling molotov cocktails for use on tanks. Remember: at that point, many had been shot; tanks were crushing their vehicles and eliminating evidence of bullet trajectories; they had seen the tanks with turrets fitted for breaching walls (which is exactly what they did, in fact tearing down half a building before deliberately setting the whole place on fire). The Davidians clearly thought that the tanks would come in and crush them; they were going to fight back by trying to those tanks on fire. This was not a "cult suicide," it was a fight to the death, for your 4th Amendment rights and mine. The official lie simply doesn't wash when you've seen the video "Waco: The Rules of Engagement." Watch it and know the truth (it's in almost every video store lately; better yet buy it and share it with people who need to know). THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR WHAT OCCURED AT WACO, NOR FOR THE LIES THAT FOLLOW. THE MORE THEY LIE TO THE PEOPLE THEY'VE SWORN TO SERVE, THE DEEPER THEY DIG THEIR OWN HOLE.


-- Liberty (liberty@theready.now), August 26, 1999.


-- RW (Randy@Weaver.com), August 26, 1999.

http://www.dallasnews.com/texas_southwest/0827tsw1delta.htm "A former CIA officer said Thursday that he learned from Delta Force commandos that members of the secret Army unit were "present, up front and close" in helping the FBI in the final tear-gas assault on the Branch Davidian compound......"

http://www.washtimes.com/investiga/investiga1.html "The three Delta Force commandoes at the Branch Davidian compound in April 1993 were part of an elite unit the military secretly founded in 1977 to combat world terrorism. While their use as on-scene observers was legal, a military expert is faulting the Clinton administration for putting the soldiers in a domestic law enforcement setting where innocent people died in a horrible blaze."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/WPlate/1999-08/27/034l-082799- idx.html "A visibly angry Attorney General Janet Reno said yesterday that she had been given repeated assurances by the FBI that the weapons used in the final assault on the Branch Davidian sect near Waco, Tex., six years ago did not include incendiary devices that could have ignited the deadly fire that ended the 51-day siege." "Reno also insisted that there is no evidence indicating that law enforcement authorities fired their weapons at the Davidians during the final assault."

http://news.excite.com/news/u/990826/12/news-davidians-juror Aug. 26 (UPI) "The woman who headed the federal jury that convicted eight Branch Davidian members in connection with the 1993 siege near Waco, Texas, says they should get new trials because of new FBI admissions. "

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/bluesky_rockwell/19990827_xclro_wacos_las t.shtml "Does anyone really believe that these agents were just too caring and law-abiding to have done it? If that were true, the Feds wouldn't have tortured the people inside with recorded rabbit death screams played at high volume, cut off their water and electricity, and generally tried to drive them out of their homes, let alone pumped the church full of a poisonous tear gas banned for use against soldiers under international law."

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/bluesky_dougherty_com/19990827_xcjod_waco _brwro.shtml "Also, I'd like to pose these questions: If the FBI lied about their use of incendiary devices and never deploying anyone from the Delta Force, what else are they lying about? How can anyone trust any of these people, knowing they have lied about so many key aspects of this Waco debacle already? What else has the FBI and the government lied to us about? TWA Flight 800 comes to mind, for starters. "

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), August 27, 1999.

"What else has the FBI and the government lied to us about?"

I wouldn't know where to begin...........

-- Will continue (farming@home.com), August 27, 1999.

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8/27/99 -- 8:45 PM

Filmmaker Says Government Admission Is Satisfying HOUSTON (AP) - The government's admission that pyrotechnic devices were used the day the Branch Davidian compound burned is sweet satisfaction for a filmmaker who has said for years that authorities are lying about the Waco tragedy.

``Getting answers is satisfying, but it will be much more satisfying when the people who are responsible are in prison,'' said Michael McNulty, whose six years of digging preceded the latest revelations about the 51-day siege.

``All of this is not about Mike McNulty, or the films that have been done, or about selling the films. It's about finding the truth.''

McNulty's 1997 film, ``Waco: Rules of Engagement,'' is based on grainy, black and white videotape recorded by an FBI surveillance aircraft circling over the compound.

The film suggests that after Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms agents botched the raid of David Koresh's compound on Feb. 28, 1993, the FBI recklessly attacked the religious group 50 days later with tank-driving commandos, intent on avenging the death of four agents.

The film cast doubt on Justice Department claims it used only non-burning grenades on April 19, 1993. McNulty said he found physical evidence to that effect - one pyrotechnic shell and a photograph of another shell that had been misidentified - more than a year after the movie's release.

The evidence will be included in McNulty's second film, ``Waco: A New Revelation,'' to be released this fall.

Attorney General Janet Reno, following a former FBI official's acknowledgment of the devices, on Wednesday said the incendiaries were used and opened a full investigation. Congress now says it also will investigate.

The Texas Rangers, custodians of the evidence through an arrangement with the federal government, earlier this year opened an inquiry into evidence identified by McNulty.

David Thibodeau, a former Koresh follower and one of nine siege survivors, said Friday that the latest revelations are ``things we were saying for years.''

``People automatically just did believe what they were told because the government and certain members of the press did such a good job of demonizing the Branch Davidians,'' he said.

The case has attracted a cadre of researchers, experts and lawyers who consider themselves government watchdogs.

Arizona attorney David Hardy has fought his battles through open records laws, repeatedly winning Freedom of Information lawsuits against agencies that denied him access to documents about the standoff.

In July, Hardy won $32,000 in attorney's fees - the only financial remedy allowable in such suits - after a judge ruled the FBI and ATF had ``stonewalled'' his requests.

``It's exhilarating because I've spent three years compiling these documents, and to finally have them all, in the space of a week, become useful is great,'' Hardy said of the new public scrutiny. ``We had to pry those documents away from the government one at a time.''

Others hope the flow of information will pick up.

``The American public has a right to know the truth,'' said Danny O. Coulson, the retired FBI assistant deputy director whose statements sparked Reno's admission. ``And we have an obligation to tell the truth.''
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-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), August 27, 1999.

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