We have all seen the threads on why the 1999 predictions havent come true. Some have repeatedly stated that Y2K doesnt happen until 2000, hence the term Y2K. There has also been back pedaling on Jo Ann effect not becoming visible (bad enough to be reported) until 2000. Then why is it that others can justify, Everything happening in 1999 is related to Y2K. I'm speaking of the direct quote from Diane and referencing the threads on gas explosions and MCI problems.

How is it that the problems happening in 1999 (that also happen every other year such as gas explosions and software development glitches) indicate that 2000 will get nasty while those actual Y2K trigger dates (that relate specifically to the year 2000 look aheads) do not provide a barometer of the size of Y2K events?

Talk about double speak!

-- Maria (anon@ymous.com), August 12, 1999

Answers

What is so hard to understand here? Are you stupid??

The vast, vast majority of Year 2000 problems will occur in year 2000. Is that plain enough?

A minority will occur prior to year 2000. Either due to their NATURE (e.g., Jo Anne) or because of testing of a supposedly remediated system.

Problems that are occuring now, though FEW IN NUMBER, give us insight as to what will happen when the problems become MANY IN NUMBER. And that insight leads us to believe that THE SHIT WILL HIT THE FAN.

Gawd. And I know that you will ask the same frigging thing next month, right?

-- King of Spain (madrid@aol.com), August 12, 1999.

Problems ARE happening right now Maria, as you WELL know, but choose to ignore, for whatever reason.

This is the year of "Y2K testing" and system upgrades and system replacements, etc., Maria. But you know that too.

Stay tuned... the race to 2000 is coming is making the turn into the final end lap. AFTER 01/01/2000 we'll see (or not)... what can or can not still be kept "hidden."

Some will be fixed in time and garner a competitive advantage. But the rest of the planet is not "Y2K-fixed." Expect the unexpected.

And... one more time... "no one knows for sure."

Preparation translates into prudence... if you walk in the way of the wise. Or not.

To each their own.

Diane

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), August 12, 1999.

I am having trouble maintaining my "doomer" mentality when nothing has happened. I mean ALL the pitfall days have come and gone with no problems. And don't give me that bullshit about the problems just haven't been reported! If y2k were going to be anykind of "event" You would of heard of something happening by now.I'm giving it till Sept.9th and if nothing happens I'm dropping off the y2k subject.

-- countryboy (I can skin@buck.com), August 12, 1999.

Fewer than 50% according to a recent survey of top companies in the US have not completed testing their mission critical systems. With that in mind, it's obvious that nothing has happened because none of those companies are anywhere near causing glitches...yet. (See several threads below:) Late Breaking News.......

Power outage right now in downtown Chicago, nothing is working! Turn your radio on for details.

-- bardou (bardou@baloney.com), August 12, 1999.

"I'm giving it till Sept.9th and if nothing happens I'm dropping off the y2k subject." Wouldn't it be nice if it was really that easy? Countryboy, I don't think you're paying attention...

I think I may have figured out why Maria is so shrill today. See the "Worst advice ever about Y2K" thread a few down for a clue...

-- (dot@dot.dot), August 12, 1999.

Dot once again you've connected the wrong dots. This thought was from the thread on the gas explosions. Look at my post there.

-- Maria (anon@ymous.com), August 12, 1999.

Thats right, countryboy, wait until you have LESS THAN FOUR frigging MONTHS TO GO UNTIL THE YEAR 2000, then just write the whole thing off. Moron.

-- King of Spain (madrid@aol.com), August 12, 1999.

I've got a time bomb under my bed set to go off in 72 hours. If it doesn't explode in 50 hours, I'm not gonna bother with it no more.

Goodnight!

-- CygnusXI (noburnt@toast.net), August 12, 1999.

Cygnus XI, that was funny, I wish I could come up with those one liners!

-- hehehehehe (hehehehe@hehehehe.com), August 12, 1999.

There's been too many reports of explosions, computers down, billing errors, installation of a White House Y2K bunker, double debits, triple credits, God Maria get a grip!

-- to many to name (toomanytoname@toomanytoname.com), August 12, 1999.

That timebomb under your bed was originally going off on 1/1/99 then 4/1/99 then 4/9/99 then 7/1/99 then 8/22/99 then 9/9/99 then 10/01/99. ALL THESE DATES are passing with NOTHING happening. The bomb under the bed is a DUD. It's not going off! I'm just tired of being a sheeple.

-- countryboy (countryfolks@can survive.com), August 12, 1999.

ALL THESE DATES are passing with NOTHING happening.

Except for all the explosions, power failures, and computer problems. But go ahead and do nothing for the next 4 months and then die with the rest of the Pollys. Nobody will miss you.

-- (its@coming.soon), August 12, 1999.

Countryboy-- Perception Distorts Reality! I'm glad you are comfortable with just walking away and living in denial. But at least stay prepared. There are so many threats to our way of life. Be careful.

-- Johnny (JLJTM@BELLSOUTH.NET), August 12, 1999.

Maria

Maybe you would like to explain why the senate y2k committee would like to have a forum (whatever) in regards to the Chemical - Refining industries lack of awareness of the issue?

Why you guys harp about the JAE is beyond me. Even Joanne recognized it would be an accumulative affect in certian management accounting systems, not the diabilitating problem that would distroy business.

Even myself as a non tech, non business person but Y2K aware thought that the fiscal year problem would be minimal. The affected programs would be fixed first or a work around could be arranged. By the way as I understand it the fiscal year problem and the JAE problem are two distinct problems and not one and the same. Yet both sides of the issue have them confused.

My biggest amazement is the fact that the Y2K business awareness in my area was slim and meetings (by the Government) poorly attended. This is a big worry for the Provincial Government (I have referances).

We do have alot of speculation of the failures seen in the press. We may never find out about the MCI failures in Chicago. But there are reasons for concern and if you have some definitive answers we would like to hear about them. Other wise your speculations are just as good as Diane's. Isn't it amazing that when some of the threads come up such as the MCI the optimist view is slim to none.

And as far as gas leaks go, maybe you would like to tell the parents of the kids that died in Seattle that the problem is nothing to get worked up over eh? The kids should get metals and those at fault should get tossed in jail for threatening a whole city with distruction. If it was my home turf you would bet I would give you and the others with blinders short shrift.

It is just crap to minimize the problem like you do.

-- Brian (imager@home.com), August 12, 1999.

Brian, never said that gas fires weren't a problem but that they are not a Y2K problem. I've seen them many times in the past when I was a child, sometimes lasting two weeks. I question how some can find a dependency of these unrelated events and at the same time down play the much exclaimed Jo Ann effect. I remember a prediction that said 4% of Y2K failures will come from the "look ahead" software. Well, if that's the case then the total Y2K failures will be pretty small. Now I'm not sure of the % but I do believe in the connection to Y2K. Yes, they would be the ones fixed first, so then they must have been fixed. Now following the same logic, the others are being fixed next and they will make it in time. Again these software programs provide the barometer for Y2K disruptions next year.

I just find it interesting that normal non-related Y2K events, such as software problems, power outages, and gas explosions, can create a number of threads pointing out the connection to the Y2K doom. While the real related Y2K events (or lack thereof) doesn't warrant doomers to rethink their conclusions.

-- Maria (anon@ymous.com), August 12, 1999.

Bottom line, you can point to the interconnectedness of it all except the events that are really connected.

-- Maria (anon@ymous.com), August 12, 1999.

Maria is now using rule #9: Play Dumb

"No matter what evidence or logical argument is offered, avoid discussing issues with denial they have any credibility, make any sense, provide any proof, contain or make a point, have logic, or support a conclusion. Mix well for maxiumum effect."

For more Rules of Disinformation, go to: http://www.trufax.org/research2/disinforules.html

-- Anita Evangelista (ale@townsqr.com), August 12, 1999.

Before February 1st, I didn't know one way or another if the Jo Anne Effect was going to cause noticeable problems that would end up being reported. After February 1st, when Wal-Mart and some other companies entered their fiscal year 2000 with no reported problems, I realized that what PNG had been saying was true...that problems in accounting software aren't nearly as noticeable to outsiders as problems in manufacturing or distribution would be.

We won't hear that much about Y2K-related manufacturing or distribution problems until January 2000. It was clear to me in February that we weren't going to hear much about fiscal year rollover problems in accounting software on April 1st and July 1st. Most people on this forum weren't expecting "show-stoppers" on April 1st and July 1st either, and yet the issue of few reported problems has been repeatedly thrown in our faces.

Anyone who honestly wants to learn more about the significance and non-significance of fiscal year rollovers in accounting software can find quite a few links about it on the following thread:

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=00122f

"Significance of States Fiscal Start"

Almost all non-accounting software problems, BIOS problems and embedded system problems are still ahead of us. Those are the ones with the potential of being "show-stoppers."

-- Linkmeister (link@librarian.edu), August 12, 1999.

Maria, I for one am capable of separating what you're pointing out from trying to pin a polly/troll label on you. Some people so can't stand to see someone not buying TOTALLY into the doom and gloom philosophy that a)they either don't finish reading your statement, or b) they can't read anything wihtout putting their own spin on it.

Diane, shame on you; you usually are more reasonable.

King of Spain, you didn't surprise me in the least. You're either an asshole (want to pack mud, kingypoo?) or a fool. Either way, you're obnoxious to everyone who doesn't follow your narrow interpretations of a complex (to anyone with an analytical mind, that it) situation Al

-- Al K. Lloyd (al@ready.now), August 12, 1999.

ANyone that can't connect the spin put out by the government, and the reality of early failures simply doesn't deserve to get it. What do you want, a manual issued by Clinton on how to prepare? Sorry, it ain't gonna happen.

-- DOWNtheROAD (foo@foo.com), August 12, 1999.

Y2K "its not just for breakfast anymore"!

Yes Maria, Y2K is not just about the computer bug anymore. It has become used as the catch phrase for all of the events that are occuring near the Year 2000, thus Y2K. There are a lot of events that may affect how the computer bug hits, some are closely related, others will just be made worse if Y2K is bigger than a "3DayStorm"-tm. Relax and enjoy the last year of the Millinium, the 19th century, 2000AD.

-- helium (heliumavid@yahoo.com), August 12, 1999.

opps read: 20th century.

-- helium (heliumavid@yahoo.com), August 12, 1999.

Country Boy --

The fact that you still include 9/9/99 as a key date in your statements speaks volumes about your overall knowledge. It is a non- issue.

Go punch a cow or something.

-- ariZONEa (desert@sw.com), August 12, 1999.

ariZONEa--I think country boy should tip over cows instead.

-- Nwcowtipping (N2cowtipping@N2cowtipping.com), August 12, 1999.

Maria:

I should think it would be pretty obvious to you by now. Y2K is a code phrase that stands for "All the bad things I've always dreamed would happen to all those people who think they're better than me and aren't cuz I say so!" No longer anything to do with mishandling of date calculations by computer software at all, y2k has changed to pure wish-fulfillment fantasy. And a wonderful opportunity to call rational people names for another few months.

-- Flint (flintc@mindspring.com), August 12, 1999.

A new DoD office to monitor Y2K transition will be operating by early September:

http://www.govexec.com/dailyfed/0899/081099t2.htm

-- Linkmeister (link@librarian.edu), August 12, 1999.

"A new DoD office to monitor Y2K transition will be operating by early September..." Cowboy, please stay with me a moment and focus. IF 9/9/99 is the date at which you will ignore Y2K as a nothing, why is the DoD start the monitoring in early September? Its a real stumper ain't it.

-- smfdoc (smfdoc@aol.com), August 12, 1999.