Speculation on Y2K Vandalism, Drunken Mayhem, Terrorism, and non-computer-related Y2K problemsgreenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread
There are several things that concern me about y2k almost as much as the possibility of computer failures. What if there are nutcases who really WANT to help bring on the end of civilization or are being instructed by the "voices" in their head to blow stuff up?
What if terrorists, vandals, and every sick MF in the neigborhood decides that the rollover is the time to burn as much of the world as possibile, setting stuff afire, hacking into "safe" computer networks, chopping down power lines, shooting at cops, etc.? Do you know of anyone who'd be quite so sadistic? Do you think this will be a big deal? Do you think that govt will overreact or resort to terror of its own in order to maintain domestic tranquility? Do you think it will be like Hell Night (night before halloween) to the tenth power?
-- coprolith (email@example.com), August 07, 1999
These events are certainly possible, but I think it's more likely that the violence is going to be caused more by the people who haven't prepared and have just realized that they and their families are going to starve. These are the people to worry about and defend yourself against. Desperation will cause far more death and destruction than a few pockets of pranksters.
-- (firstname.lastname@example.org), August 07, 1999.
Precedents have already been set for many of those things. My concern is about crimes or disaster of omission, as much as those of deliberate commission. Maybe ignorance would be more blissful.
That brings a thought to mind. People from tornado or hurricane country often think we Californians are crazy to live in earthquake country. Most everyone here will tell you they'd rather not know a disaster is about to strike. I think it's a case of 'the devil you know...'
-- flora (***@__._), August 07, 1999.
If that were the case then how come "they" don't just decide to riot on the night of Halloween. Seems to be a more suitable night to wreak havok.
Or for that matter how come "they" just don't do it right now... or last year, or the year before?
-- (Conspiracy@to the. tenth power is more like it), August 07, 1999.
Hell night yes. And no All Clear the next day.
-- 12/31/99 (The Night@black.out), August 07, 1999.
coprolith, your worst nightmares may come true before your eyes.
I hope we can survive WTSHTF.
I just finished talking to my closest neighbor, a 50ish Christian divorcee. She thinks times may get worse like a recession, but she is alarmed at those who are warning people to prepare for the very worst. She thinks we should not panic and prepare for "a three day ice storm". When I asked her about this, she replied she had heard on television a program in which a man warned against overpreparing due to scare tactics from those eager to seize upon the fears and weaknesses of those being gullible.
I pray she will awaken soon, but I didn't want to panic her with the dangerous economic doom about to fall upon the USA. She would not believe me. Maybe I'll tell her more next month, but for now, she is hopeful she will be taken away by Jesus Christ in the rapture.
I myself believe ALL living must endure the Great Tribulation. These times of woe have not yet occurred. There is a grace period in which we can all prepare spiritually and materially.
But MOST will not.
I live in a small city populated by about 9000 people. Although we have industries which have global distribution, for the most part, the citizens are quite asleep. VERY FEW are seriously preparing. (I know of only ONE other who believes we will enter a severe depression.) The rest will not GI until it's too late.
I don't expect extremely serious criminal behavior before Y2K, but WTSHTF, all bets are off. People will do ANYTHING to get food and water for their families, and every thinking individual reading my words knows this instinctively.
I don't know about you other than that you're in the medical field and highly intelligent.
Do you live in a metropolis? If so, do you plan to escape before TSHTF?
-- Randolph (email@example.com), August 07, 1999.
I do believe that if the emergency response system-and the police-are overburdened, that there are many people that will take advantage of it, without even understanding the big picture. If the lights go out, and the looting starts, it will be the TV and stereos that go first- as well as the liquor stores. A DGI rampage. If the lights stay out, and the thin blue line is snapped in places, it would probably be several days before this same group wakes up enough from the hangovers and realizes the smart target would have been the local grocery store-and if there arent sufficient armed guards by then..... What a thought! You can tell the difference between polly and doomer looters by the loot they loot! If TSHTF, by the time Joe Six pack wakes to it, the military may already be in place-at least in metropolitan areas-leaving only the private citizen as a fat target. As I have mentioned before, I am wondering how long the illicit drug supplies will hold out-the counter culture that includes so many of the looter types may be hurting badly by the end of the first week. With any luck, this will incapacitate many-but then, may clog the medical system to a breaking point. I could forsee many breakins of hungry junkies looking for alcohol-when your drug of choice is gone, any other will do. Just my specualtions, based on the clients I see at the hospital ER-I think theres more than one kind of crime potential here, based on the location and surrounding population types. Think overlapping bell curves- The first few days would see the take advantage of chaos types, the second week thru the first month the looking for food types, and if it should continue to a 10, the months following-should law and order be broken down- might see the rise of the Warlord type- organized gangs with a power structure and some planning, looking for all kinds of necessities as well as food and whatever would pass for wealth. Ugly. Doomer. Hopefully wrong. But its happened elsewhere, and bears thinking about- because preps for those scenarios can be made if they are thought of in advance. Big dogs and bullets. Not thinking of them but running into it would be worse, IMHO. I really hate this.
-- LauraA (firstname.lastname@example.org), August 08, 1999.
I intend to be in a most politically incorrect state of mind at the time. However I doubt I'll be in any condition to tear up your neighborhood. Sounds like a party, though.
-- Forrest Covington (email@example.com), August 08, 1999.
god bless John Moses Browning for giving us the 1911, god bless the gunsite training center for teaching me to use this tool to it potential. if i buy a violin does that make me a violinist? if you buy a gun does that make you tactically proficient? this is only my opinion, i may be wrong. Sam Colt
-- sam colt (1911@.45.ded), August 08, 1999.
"There are several things that concern me about y2k almost as much as the possibility of computer failures. What if there are nutcases who really WANT to help bring on the end of civilization or are being instructed by the "voices" in their head to blow stuff up?"
One of these 'nutcases' is Gary North. His so-called 'Christian' beliefs have led him down the evil path of promoting the destruction of Western civilization. He'll have a lot to answer for if the worst effects of Y2K are those caused by panic.
-- Agamemnon (firstname.lastname@example.org), August 08, 1999.
There may be some advantage to living in colder climates. Where I am (mid-west USA), January 1 is in the middle of WINTER. It's cold out, around 10-20 degrees F. May get as high as 30 or as low as zero, or below. Snow, ice, etc.
How rowdy do you want to get at those temperatures? You want to rape someone in the bushes if it's 20 degrees out? Maybe, but I doubt it. It's too f-ing cold. As for the rest of the world.... dunno.
-- staying in (email@example.com), August 08, 1999.
U.S. big cities -- Detroit, Los Angeles, etc. Has happened before; no reason it couldn't again, regardless of weather.
-- A (A@AisA.com), August 08, 1999.
Where to start?
"promoting the destruction of Western civilization"
Gary North will not make the electricity go out, if and where it does.
He can, however, teach people -- in the context of y2k -- that 98% of their money in banks is just not available to them at any time, and that bankers have manufactured, oh, 90+% of the money supply out of credit creation. I didn't know that a year ago, did you?
It's up to each of us to decide what to do with that information, and whether we want to live under such an inherently fragile system. But we were never given that info by TPTB, were we? I have him to thank for convening this class in practical money and banking.
BTW, I don't equate fractional reserve banking with what is truly the best of "Western civilization".
I also don't agree with what I've heard about Christian reconstruction, or the potential prejudicial treatment of citizens who don't measure up to its stern dictates. I'd have to read more before I would opinionate further, but I'm not really much interested in "Christian anything." I hope Christians will further endeavor to live Jesus' teachings of tolerance and forgiveness, as I already try to.
I suspect that I might be one of those who would have trouble under such a regime (a la Margaret Atwood's "The Handmaid's Tale" -- rent the video), but I don't think as of now that they'll take over, or that preparing for y2k supports such a future theocratic regime.
y2k makes strange bedfellows. Meanwhile, Gary North has spoken and acted intelligently and generously toward ALL of us.
And if the IT world manages to pull off a remediation cliffhanger, it will have in great part North's unpaid "Paul Revere" efforts to thank for creating the public climate of credibility for their work. I doubt, however, he'll be offered the President's Medal for his meritorious contribution. Hypocrisy reigns as usual.
-- Mr Gresham (firstname.lastname@example.org?), August 08, 1999.