From the "Bonkers Board"

This [email] came to me privately like many others. I told them to follow the Red Cross and FEMA guidelines and stay awake. (After all, the world COULD end 1/1/2000 or it could Halt or it could be messed up OR it could be "business as usual".) [emphasis added]

Here is the final intellectual bankruptcy of the head inmate at the "Bonkers Board". He admits that Y2K could be disastrous. How then can he justify spewing his venom at those who warn people that it could be disastrous? The answer is clear: he can't.

I guess we know who will be the next recipient of the coveted "Flying Pig" award: CPR.

-- Steve Heller (stheller@koyote.com), August 01, 1999

Answers

I think you are grasping at straws Steve. Perhaps a course on the different uses of lnaguage could be of use to you, so you can avoid embarassing yourself in the future. For Steve's sake I suggest we delete this post.

-- embarrassed (prozac@needs.help), August 02, 1999.

I don't recall CEEPER ever saying y2k couldn't produce a disaster. His hangup is business. His fear is that a defeatist attitude will exacerbate whatever disaster y2k might mean to American industry. Whence his angle for the *wrapping myself in the flag* attitude. We've a few different but similarly pleading angles around here. Beyond an arrogance he can't control, what buggs me about CEEP is his putting business ahead of my grandkid's lives. Long view in his view I guess.

-- Carlos (riffraff1@cybertime.net), August 02, 1999.

While I admire CPRs views on hucksters his political views are none of my consern as I am a Canadian. Just stay away from the woodstoves and Beer Debonking eh? :o) Oh and you can never have enough TP!!!

That being said here are a couple of comments from FEMA documents that discribe cautious preparations for a disaster (at any time).

http:// www.fema.gov/library/emfdwtr.htm

"Stocking water reserves and learning how to purify contaminated water should be among your top priorities in preparing for an emergency. You should store at least a two-week supply of water for each member of your family."

"Even though it is unlikely that an emergency would cut off your food supply for two weeks, you should prepare a supply that will last that long. A two-week supply can relieve a great deal of inconvenience and uncertainty until services are restored."
 

 FEMA: Financial Disaster Preparedness
http://www.fema.gov/pte/finplan.htm#where

 "After a disaster, you may need cash for the first few days, or even several weeks."

-- Brian (imager@home.com), August 02, 1999.

Steve

Actually that is not fair that you are knocking some one that is suggesting prudent preparation for the posible failure of systems.

The above suggestions of FEMA are certainly a good start for folk. Of course during January there is an increased risk of winter storms that can disable a region for a month or so (Quebec). The choice for some kind of comfort zone is needed.

Senator Bennett on the CBN y2k special mentions planning for and ice storm (much differant than a snow storm) Koshenin has now suggested to the press that there could be serious disrutions lasting for "weeks to months" there is little dispute that the US Government is taking this more serious.

Canadian Government devoted the armed forces to the contingency planning for the nation last summer. The Ice Storm is very fresh in the minds of Canadians.

You just cannot fuck around when there is a serious disruption in -30. Thankfully the power corps. are very good as a rule and this kind of thing doesn't happen often.

I think that CPR is intelligent enough and realizes this in his comment above and I encourage others to prepare for an Ice Storm.

Oh there is just one small problem. You can't find good information on the net on winter contingency plans for the public that applies to such a thing.

Now Steve I am sure that the gentleman in question just might have a few cans of tuna and some extra KD (and more). To flame such a thing is not really in the spirit of this forum. Eh?

without prejudice or injury

-- Brian (imager@home.com), August 02, 1999.

Of course my above comments only apply where there is snow.

Regional Bias, Sorry folks!

-- Brian (imager@home.com), August 02, 1999.

Steve Heller entitled this thread: CPR (Charles Reuben) exposes himself

Wow. Talk about IRONY.

-- CD (not@here.com), August 02, 1999.

Heller is obviously confused as it is HE that is now exposed. Go back and try again DOOMER!

-- (a@aaaa.hole), August 02, 1999.

>>Actually that is not fair that you are knocking some one that is suggesting prudent preparation for the posible failure of systems.

I think you have missed the point. What I am objecting to is CPR's habit of attacking people such as myself, who suggest prudent preparation for the possible failure of systems, even though he himself admits that they may fail. Here is one example of his vicious attacks on me and others who are trying to warn people of the danger. For your convenience, here is the article he is referring to.

-- Steve Heller (stheller@koyote.com), August 02, 1999.

Ideally, IE, Netscape, Eudora, Newswatchers, etc should have an automatic killfill for CPR.

-- Mitchell Barnes (spanda@inreach.com), August 02, 1999.

Oh man, you aren't really very good at this stuff Steve. You want to see what a hypocrite he is, go to thisthis thread.

-- Mother Nacho (corn@chips.bag), August 02, 1999.

I bow to the expert, "Mother Nacho". Good work!

-- Steve Heller (stheller@koyote.com), August 02, 1999.

Uh... Anybody else notice that Nacho's link takes you to material dated May 1997? Heller understandably elects to enlist any help he can on this humiliating thread by "bowing to the expert". I, on the other hand, prefer to simply ask; Hey Nacho- Since you're so good at looking up ancient history, could you also research, and let us know what CPR's thoughts on Disco were? After all, it's about as relevant to today as that other stuff you dredged up.

-- CD (not@here.com), August 02, 1999.

Sure, if Reuben had changed his mind about the possible seriousness of Y2K, that old post would be irrelevant. But has he changed his mind? It sure doesn't seem like it from the post I linked to, which was posted Sunday, 01-Aug-1999 at 15:46:34. Is that recent enough for you?

-- Steve Heller (stheller@koyote.com), August 02, 1999.

You may or may not realize (or care), but it has always irritated me when I see this forum dragged down via personal attacks. Worse yet, you have initiated an attack on somebody you have had confrontations with in the past and who you *know* will not come here to respond to you in person. With that said, I offer this...

I truly believe that if you take an honest look at this thread, you will admit to yourself that it may have been a mistake to have initiated it.

I don't consider it a mistake at all. It is a valid demonstration of the nature of the head "Debunker".

Each time we post to this thread it is sent to the top of recent answers. Those who may have missed reading it in the past are then given another opportunity to see it.

Since my comments are based on facts and reason, I have no fear of others reading them. What are you afraid of?

I propose that this post should be the final time this thread gets "sent to the top". Let's just allow it to then fall off the board and become forgotten. For you to do otherwise would lead me to believe you feel good about what has transpired here so far.

You would be correct in that assessment.

As I said before, if you take an honest look, I think you'll see it may have been a mistake. Hey, we all make 'em. Let's let this thread die a peaceful death.

No, I don't think so. However, in the spirit of reasonableness, I'll make this counteroffer: As soon as Reuben apologizes to me for his vicious, unfounded attacks on me and on others who have been trying to warn people about a possible Y2K disaster, I'll stop demolishing him. You are cordially invited to let him know about this, assuming he isn't already reading this thread.

-- Steve Heller (stheller@koyote.com), August 02, 1999.

Steve

While I think it is in poor taste to attack someone on this forum when they post regularly on another forum, it is true that the gentleman in question possibly does have a poor view on the real risks that folks can face.

I wrote what I wrote because I am damm sure he is reading this thread.

CD

Are you trying to talk for CPR??? Are you trying to back him up??

Who the hell are you??? Well lets just set the stage a little clearer since you are so concerned about him. Steve is right, the guy has a problem and you seem to also. So try the next couple of links and call your friend CPR to back up his own words or shut up.

This is a good indication of why folk fear CPR. A total lack of heart.

First a post (true or not?? what ever)

 Debunking Y2k webboard - Average European country could lose electrical power for 7 days.

Here is the level of compassion that CPR has for people elsewhere. And by the way it is alot colder in Europe that Texas in the winter.
 

Debunking Y2k webboard - TS for them. GREAT NEWS for USA!!! Seven extra profit days for AMERICAN COMPANIES.

Basicly he says tough shit. He has no idea.

Oh and this is an international forum, I am a Canadian not a US citizen. His bias towards US Companies over peoples lives speaks volumes.

Of course CD or CPR or any of his heartless crew, maybe I should post this right on the top of the forum and make this stick around for a few days or we will here no more of this bull about what the hell CPR means when he says that he doesn't care about the possible failures in other countries just because it will further U.S, business interests.

I know what it is like to almost freeze to death. It is not funny.

-- Brian (imager@home.com), August 03, 1999.

Fine then Steve. Have it your way...

I don't consider it a mistake at all. That truly surprises me. If for no other reason, I would have thought by now you would have realized what a weak example you had chosen to use as your ammunition. (Surely you could have found something a little more substantial couldn't you?) I think you made a mistake for other reasons. It is a valid demonstration of the nature of the head "Debunker". Personally, I view it all as a "valid demonstration" of a different nature and which reflects on you.

Since my comments are based on facts and reason, I have no fear of others reading them. Can't argue with facts but I found your "reasoning" a bit of a stretch when I read the quoted comments in the context in which they were made.

What are you afraid of? I suggested letting this thread die because I believed it was in *your* best interest. Hard to believe huh.

However, in the spirit of reasonableness, I'll make this counteroffer: As soon as Reuben apologizes to me for his vicious, unfounded attacks on me and on others who have been trying to warn people about a possible Y2K disaster, I'll stop demolishing him.

So let me see if I understand this correctly. You plan on continually posting personal attacks on this forum, which are directed at somebody on another forum? Uh...what am I missing here?

You are cordially invited to let him know about this, assuming he isn't already reading this thread.

Do you not know how to reach him yourself?

-- CD (not@here.com), August 03, 1999.

Brian- Let's not be jumping to too many conclusions here ok.

Are you trying to talk for CPR???

No

Are you trying to back him up??

No (I hardly think CPR would need or want my "backup)

Of course CD or CPR or any of his heartless crew

Not sure what you mean here Brian. I'm neither heartless nor part of CPR's "crew"

Truth is Brian, I think we both agree on something when you said "While I think it is in poor taste to attack someone on this forum when they post regularly on another forum, ". Fact is, that is the only reason I am on this thread. I am sick of reading all the personal attacks on this forum. If I think I can help silence it, I will. My participation on this thread really has nothing to do with CPR or his views.

Have I cleared this up for you?

-- CD (not@here.com), August 03, 1999.

What a bunch of lilly-livered, chicken shits! "lets attack someone who doesn't even post to this forum!" "lets use a bunch of outdated info" then "lets heckle anyone who tries to set the record straight" Grow a spine, you mealy-mouthed pathetic worms. Take your bullshit/bitching session OFF LINE or at least off this forum. Confront this person IN PERSON or at least privately, cowards!

-- What (thef@&k.isthiss#$t?), August 03, 1999.

Fine then Steve. Have it your way...

Thanks, I will.

If for no other reason, I would have thought by now you would have realized what a weak example you had chosen to use as your ammunition. (Surely you could have found something a little more substantial couldn't you?)

It's as substantial as it can be. Reuben tells another that Y2K could be disastrous. He is notorious for attacking others who say that Y2K could be disastrous. Hence, he is a hypocrite. Q. E. D.

Personally, I view it all as a "valid demonstration" of a different nature and which reflects on you.

Of course you do. That's because you are unable to understand a simple, logical argument.

Can't argue with facts but I found your "reasoning" a bit of a stretch when I read the quoted comments in the context in which they were made.

Okay, then, let's hear your explanation of exactly why it is all right for Reuben to tell someone else that Y2K could be a big deal while attacking others who do the same.

I suggested letting this thread die because I believed it was in *your* best interest. Hard to believe huh.

Yes. I've read your posts here for some time, and that would be totally out of character.

So let me see if I understand this correctly. You plan on continually posting personal attacks on this forum, which are directed at somebody on another forum? Uh...what am I missing here?

What you are missing is that Reuben is continually posting scurrilous references to me on "his forum".

Do you not know how to reach him yourself?

No, I believe he is unreachable -- in the sense that he is impervious to reason. But I could be wrong; perhaps you could convince him to change his ways. Needless to say, I'm not going to hold my breath waiting.

-- Steve Heller (stheller@koyote.com), August 03, 1999.

CD

Well sorry about that. I will take you at your word. The problem is so many folk post and don't provide there name or Email addresses so it is hard to tell who they are and what their intent is.

One thing is for sure is that the forum Steve pointed out has ALOT of interest in this forum. They post here. If they have a problem well identify who you are and talk about it. I am who I am and Brian is my name and I always use it. My Email is real and I always use it. Some like Mr. Decker and Paul are at least consistant and you know where they stand. But the post such as "What" above is clearly an individual that will not put their name behind there attitude. This is common around here and it is my beleif that much of the venom comes from the forum that Steve is complaining about.

I have a reason to be interested in Y2K as the risk of failure, y2k or not in Canada, is a problem and there is no contingency planning for longer term failure. Y2K if for no other reason is a good excuse to get your shit together.

If CPR says to consult red cross or FEMA recommedations that is great.

But I do believe he has the ability to know the differance between being prepared for a serious problem and the hype of the problem.

There is ALOT of hype on the problem. For that reason I choose Government Documents as a medium of information. There is a problem even in their smiley tomes.

If CPR likes to wade through the false and the true more power to him.

But the time is running short and folks in critical positions are going to have to understand they should be ready.

I mean Senator Bennett is going to have 2 weeks worth of supplies. And a 45 gallon container of water. And that is as things stand now. Of course if he need more he can go see his daughter.

The times are changing. Views are changing. Positions should change.

There is reasonable hype and unreasonable hype. Time to know the differance.

-- Brian (imager@home.com), August 03, 1999.

Steve's remarks could be very pertinent. Has anyone else noticed how much Chicken Little writes like cpr? There's Y2K Pro, too. Hmmmmm.

-- Troll (watching@the.bridge), August 03, 1999.

CPR has said that in the extreme case we might have a couple of Y2K related power outages. If you bothered to check Russ Kelly's site, you would have found out he is now down to a '1'.

In contrast, YOU, Steve Heller, predicted a total collapse of the infrastructure of the United States in one of Cory's weather reports just this last week or so. Trying to compare your position with CPR's isn't comparing apples to oranges, it is comparing grapes to watermelons.

And I have been trying to prepare a reply to the batch of opinions you expressed there WITHOUT sounding like a personal attack. Buster, it hasn't been easy.

-- Paul Davis (davisp1953@yahoo.com), August 03, 1999.

CPR has said that in the extreme case we might have a couple of Y2K related power outages. If you bothered to check Russ Kelly's site, you would have found out he is now down to a '1'.

Yes, I know that. And your point is?

In contrast, YOU, Steve Heller, predicted a total collapse of the infrastructure of the United States in one of Cory's weather reports just this last week or so. Trying to compare your position with CPR's isn't comparing apples to oranges, it is comparing grapes to watermelons.

Yes, I know that. And your point is?

And I have been trying to prepare a reply to the batch of opinions you expressed there WITHOUT sounding like a personal attack. Buster, it hasn't been easy.

By all means, let us know if you succeed. If you don't mind, I won't hold my breath waiting.

-- Steve Heller (stheller@koyote.com), August 03, 1999.

Italics off.

-- Steve Heller (stheller@koyote.com), August 03, 1999.