Sorry if this has been put up here before...

From Bruce Beach's Email Service:

>I would love to hear more about the ration printing coupons. How verifiable is your source? I still have my ration books from the 40's!

"...from a friend, who has never lied to me before. (So, for what it is worth, I cannot prove it.) He is a Graphic Artist who went to a New Jersey Printer Shop twice last week to get some work done for a client. The shop owner said they were too busy doing 'Government work'. He noticed pallets and pallets of different colored coupons that said GAS on them. Other areas in the shop where pallets were stacked had signs in front of them on the floor that said things like MEAT and PETROL. He went back there yesterday to see if he could steal some samples . . .

"he couldn't, but he had a long conversation with the sales rep. They went out to a bar, and he proceeded to drink all afternoon with this guy, who then spilled his guts. This is what was said: The Government supplied the paper and ink, and everything was weighed when it came in and when it left. Security cages had been installed by the feds, and all hard drives were taken, and all film and press plates were taken, too, and the whole process had been monitored by a Marine Captain and two armed guards.

"The Marine Captain ... a Y2K Nut ... said these things to the sales rep: (snip-- these were speculations about dates, and the opinion of an individual, about dates, to which I attribute no credibility because of the nature of the speculations - Bruce)

"The coupons are in $5 and $10 amounts, and would go on like the odd-even times with license plates like it did back in the 70's gas shortage. Diesel is, at this time in the plan, exempt."

(snip-- Suspect that these people do not know The PLAN. There was much more speculation, but while we can all speculate, the details above impressed me - Bruce)

-- Jeremiah Jetson (laterthan@uthink.y2k), June 12, 1999

Answers

You don't suppose it's scrip for the Kosovo op, do you?

-- bust (your@bubble.pop), June 12, 1999.

Doesn't anybody think that by now SOMEBODY would have leaked real info concerning rationing plans to one of us Yourdynamites? Or REAL info about martial law, etc? Hamre did say Oregon & Washington have plans to call out the National Guard ...

Does anybody know how these coupons can be swapped? Can a vegetarian swap a MEAT for VEGGIES or tofu, etc? Anybody here know what happened in the 40s?

Does anybody really think the government is this organized? while smiling and waving off Y2K with the happy-face snort-sneers?

Disconnect ...

xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxx

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), June 12, 1999.

The beach is a churning, foaming, pounding, roaring, wonder today. Winds out the the Northeast 20 knots for the last few days. 9 to 12 foot waves. You can hear it from 3 or 4 bocks away. Striped Bass are biting and a few surfers are out too. More of the same tomorrow. Tight lines :)

-- Rob Michaels (sonofdust@com.net), June 12, 1999.

PETROL!

We're in America, not England, aren't we?

-- fanchon (yurgsieg@pacbell.net), June 12, 1999.

Ashton and Leska,

Here's a snip from a Web page about World War II rationing, food and recipes:

http"//www.mcall.com/special/veteran/stories/47522.htm

[snip]

While the GIs were fighting ''over there'' in Europe and the South Pacific, a battle of a different sort was being waged on the home front.

Responding to shortages, the federal government imposed rationing and price controls on 20 essential items, including food, under the Office of Price Administration.

In 1942, sugar and coffee were the first foods to be rationed. The next year, it was soups, vegetables and canned goods. Meat, fish and dairy products were added later.

Households were issued two ration books -- one with blue coupons for canned goods, the other with red coupons for meat, fish and dairy products. The coupons were worth ''points,'' and had to be presented at the store when buying rationed items.

In 1943, for example, a pound of beef cost 51 cents plus 8 points. Ground meat was 43 cents plus 8 points.

Rationing changed what American families put on the dinner table.

[snip]

-- Linkmeister (link@librarian.edu), June 12, 1999.

well, since this is my area of "expertise" I can verify the following informatin as sounding truthful:

"He is a Graphic Artist who went to a New Jersey Printer Shop twice last week to get some work done for a client.

[Yep, we do that. This is called a "press check".]

"The shop owner said they were too busy doing 'Government work'."

[Hummm... "government work" has two meanings. It could be real "government work" or a playful term meaning either "in house" or "pro bono" stuff, etc.]

"he couldn't, but he had a long conversation with the sales rep.

[oh yeah, these reps LOVE to talk!!!]

"They went out to a bar, and he proceeded to drink all afternoon with this guy"

[roflmao...I don't drink but I've been invited to by a number of reps. It's usual smooze technique...standard SOP : ) ]

"who then spilled his guts"

[well, after all that booze, who wouldn't? : ) ]

"This is what was said: The Government supplied the paper and ink, and everything was weighed when it came in and when it left. Security cages had been installed by the feds, and all hard drives were taken, and all film and press plates were taken, too, and the whole process had been monitored by a Marine Captain and two armed guards.]

[Now, this has an absolute ring of truth to it. I'm not sure if this is a truthful account but this is exactly what is required when any sensitive work is done at a print shop. Of course, only the government would provide the Marine Captain and two armed guards. But, why a Marine Captain? Why not a treasury agent or the FBI?]

I dunno. Why Petrol? Sounds like maybe if this is true it's stuff going overseas to the Balkans or somewhere in Europe. Of course, if your a NWO conspiracy theorist then maybe things are changing around here.

I'd take it for what it's worth...some interesting speculation amd unsubstantiated rumor.

Mike ==================================================

-- Michael Taylor (mtdesign3@aol.com), June 12, 1999.

Thanks, Linkmeister! Barter 'n trade, swap those coupons ...

"Some 20 million Americans turned backyard plots into Victory Gardens to ease the food shortage. They grew everything from tomatoes to kale, freeing up money to buy War Bonds to finance the $330billion price tag on U.S. participation in World War II."

20 million Americans ... less apartments & condos in those days ... closer in time to working the land ... how far can we turn back the clock? Not to mention team spirit, self-discipline and considerate sacrificies. Nostalgia on that Link!

Reminds us, gotta shop for some more spices.

xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxx

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), June 12, 1999.

Ashton and Leska,

There's one other World War II rationing link you should look at:

http://kuhttp.cc.ukans.edu/carrie/kancoll/voices/1997/0597ratn.htm

[snip]

Notes on Rationing in the United States, World War II:

In the United States during World War I, the use of an allotment system for food and supplies was mostly voluntary. However, World War II was another matter. The federal government set up the system of laws used throughout much of the war. It was used to assure American soldiers and citizens both received a fair distribution of goods. Rubber, which was first conserved voluntarily, became scarce due to Japan's successful invasion of Malaya and the Dutch East Indies. President Roosevelt instituted a "scrap drive." He asked the American people to turn in "old tires, old rubber raincoats, old garden hose, rubber shoes, bathing caps, gloves," etc. at local gas stations. The stations paid the public one cent per pound for the items and then were reimbursed by the government. This campaign instilled patriotism but did not forestall rationing. It was instituted early in 1942.

Gasoline was the next rationing target. May 14, 1942, a direct result of German U-boat attacks in the Atlantic Ocean, marked the day motorists in seventeen Eastern states had their gas usage restricted. It was expanded to the rest of the nation in December, 1942. Ration stamps were issued and pasted to an automobile windshield. A person's gasoline allotment was determined by the class of stamp displayed. Class of stamp was determined by the primary use of the car. There were four classes to begin. Class A received the least amount of gas because the car usage was deemed "nonessential"; Class B cars belonged to people who needed them for work (travelling salesman); Class C cars usually belonged to doctors and law enforcement persons; Class X was discontinued after it became a popular target of criticism. This class was for "very important people," such as Senators and Members of the House of Representatives.

Food prices were monitored (and high ceilings set) by the Office of Price Administration (OPA). About one third of civilian food items were rationed during a majority of the war. The OPA issued "ration books." These books, containing the red, green, brown or blue stamps, were administered at the local level by volunteer rationing boards. Registration began in April of 1942. One member of each household registered themselves and each additional household member with the board. The person performing this task was required to list supplies on hand. They received a book for each member of the household. Coffee stamps were taken from the books of children under the age of fifteen and books required to be turned in for departing servicemen. Shoppers had to get used to reading price tags including not only a dollar and cent amount, but a figure for "points". Points were valued by the color of the stamp in addition to the points. ( Ham would have been 51 cents and 8 points per pound, canned and bottled good varied...a can of tomato juice was 16 points and a 14-ounce bottle of catsup was 8 points): red stamps for meat (except poultry , which was not rationed), butter, fats, cheese, canned milk, and canned fish; green, brown or blue stamps for canned vegetables, juices, baby food and dried fruit. A shopper could earn two extra red points for every pound of meat drippings and other fat turned in. This was part of a "save-fats campaign." In addition to these measures, people planted "Victory Gardens" to supplement fresh vegetables and to can or preserve for colder months. Those living in rural areas kept chickens both for eggs and meat. And lucky was the family in possession of a cow or goat!

[snip]

-- Linkmeister (link@librarian.edu), June 12, 1999.

Other than the fact that anything Bruce Beach posts should be dismissed out of hand we have:

New Jersey Printer Shop

ration printing coupons for who? what? where? made in a New Jersey Printer shop? The Feds and the Military have the ability to make these coupons on their own. They cut "orders" every day for thousands of things. A shop like the one mentioned would hardly be big enough to supply the country? Why would one be used?

MEAT and PETROL.

Oh sure... Meat, as if there would be no difference between trypes of meat, steak, chicken, and spam all carry the same weight on coupons. And Yep..Petrol... That has got to be a dead giveaway that Beach wrote this himself, he isn't even smart enough to use the United States-American word for fuel.

The Government supplied the paper and ink

Why? Was it special paper and ink?

Security cages had been installed by the feds, and all hard drives were taken, and all film and press plates were taken, too, and the whole process had been monitored by a Marine Captain and two armed guards.

Security cages for/around what? And what exactly were FILM, PRESS PLATES and HARD DRIVES used in combination to make coupons for? If all of this stuff was brought and taken away, then why would they not do it in secret as apposed to a place where people could walk in from the street and see the items?

"The Marine Captain ... a Y2K Nut ... said these things to the sales rep: (snip-- these were speculations about dates, and the opinion of an individual, about dates, to which I attribute no credibility because of the nature of the speculations - Bruce)

Gotta love the psychology Bruce uses to attempt to convince the reader, "Y2K Nut" (meaning bruce wants you to think he is not one)

and the snipped speculation about dates which "bruce" saves us from being subjected to. **snicker**

If this were such a secret, secure undertaking then the "Marine Captain" would have been chosen for his "record" of enforcing security.

People, please use your brains and see through this entire "message" from Bruce beach, He made the entire thing up. As I said before, he must think people are stupid enough to believe any of the stuff he "writes" about. To even respond as if there is even a thread of credibility in what he posts is to make yourself look like a fool. Perhaps he suffers from senile dementia.

-- Cherri (sams@brigadoon.com), June 13, 1999.

Cherri's style reminds me of another well-known polly troll.

-- (fonts@html.color), June 13, 1999.

Nobody who's ever read any of my posts here has ever thought I was "polly." Grumpy sometimes, maybe, but not a polly.

What I noticed in the "ration coupon" story here is the use of the word "petrol" together with the denomination of the coupons in "$", namely, U.S. dollars. Canada uses the $ for a dollar sign, but in Canada nobody uses "petrol"--- they use "gasoline". Brits use petrol but not dollars.

Other unlikely aspects of the story have already been pointed out.

That said, there's nothing inherently evil about rationing when essential commodities are in short supply. It's a good faith attempt to distribute what there is to distribute in an equitable way. Every rationing program ever tried attracts rascals and bootleggers, and anything set up along these lines next year surely will too.

But this story really is nowhere near convincing. The only fish that grow older are those that don't take every bait they see.

-- Tom Carey (tomcarey@mindspring.com), June 13, 1999.

I don't buy it.

First off, as several people have pointed out, "PETROL"??? Please, gimme a break. It ain't "petrol" on this side of the pond.

Then, as someone also pointed out, the notion of the federal gov't searching out a print shop in New Jersey to do this strikes me as more than a little absurd.

Maybe there is a real story somewhere that's morphed into the one reported here, but try as I might, I just can't take it seriously at face value.

-- Ron Schwarz (rs@clubvb.com.delete.this), June 13, 1999.

Cherri,

I must say, you sure do dislike Bruce Beach. Whatever has he said or done to make you feel so upset with him? Regardless, he certainly is not ignorant or a nut case. And you also don't seem to think we are going to have any rationing either, is that right? If we *are* going to have rationing, when will the coupons be printed, in the millions? Perhaps you are not old enough to have gone through rationing, as I have, during the WWII era, so it all seems so unreal to you. It's real enough, and probable too, if certain items such as gasoline become in very short supply for a lengthy period of time.

-- Gordon (gpconnolly@aol.com), June 13, 1999.

"Then, as someone also pointed out, the notion of the federal gov't searching out a print shop in New Jersey to do this strikes me as more than a little absurd. "

During the Vietnam Police Action my fathers little shop used to contract to paint parts for the government, olive drab. The parts were made in a little four man machine shop next door to us. Nothing unusual about the governnment handing out contracts to a small print shop etc.

-- Mark Hillyard (foster@inreach.com), June 13, 1999.

Guv'ment won't out-house printing project like this. Rent a building, pull in old presses, start printing. Lock down. But Tres goes 24-7 printing paper money. Think you can get an "out-house" to do that?

Gas rationing? Guaranteed. Plates. Gonna be plates. Guv'ment don't have no original thoughts.

-- Yep (yougotth@right.com), June 13, 1999.

It makes sense for U.S. to be rationing Gasoline. The information about Venesuela and Saudi Arabia being 12-18 months behind in remediation (several months ago) is a clue to our need to ration. The challenge of remediation of the maritime industry and possibly refineries may indicate this as well. I would buy a Bicycle just to have an option.

Has anyone of these industries (maritime and refineries) given us any reassurance that gas rationing won't happen. It has been a while since any posts have come up regarding refineries and maritime.

-- Feller (feller@wanna.help), June 13, 1999.

We'll have the answers in the not to distant future!!

Ray

-- Ray (ray@totacc.com), June 13, 1999.

Sorry....I'm with Cherri on this one. Use your brains guys. The US government would not be using some small little print shop in NJ. I'm a graphic artist also, and I'm quite aware of every size print shop there is and how they operate. The production ability of a small print shop would be so minimal that inorder to begin a process of printing, glueing, correlating and a myriad of other things that entail a project of this size, would not be completed until 2005, and that's if you didn't have to service the equipment. Lord...this makes zero sense.

-- Cary Mc from Tx (Caretha@compuserve.com), June 13, 1999.

It is completely logical that the government would have a contongency plan for rationing gasoline. Overseas supplies of crude oil and gasoline are uncertain. A ten percent shortage could cause panic buying and tremendous price increases. I suspect that price controls are part of the contingency plan. As soon as shortages appear, everyone will try to fill their gas tanks and this will cause further shortages. The problems could actually begin in late December.

-- Dave (dannco@hotmail.com), June 13, 1999.

Cary commented:

"Sorry....I'm with Cherri on this one. Use your brains guys. The US government would not be using some small little print shop in NJ."

Well we know one thing for sure, there won't be any LEADERSHIP coming from this Administration so how do they start to bring the comatose public on board. You got it, leak a little here and leak a little there then drop the bomb so to speak. Should get interesting soon!!

Ray

-- Ray (ray@totacc.com), June 13, 1999.

I agree with you Ray, I don't believe leadership will be coming from the White House on this one. They've already cemented their plans and will follow the course of those plans without any deviation. Their plan is to keep the infrastructure intact for as long as possible. This seems to me to be an awfully easy rumor to check out. What's the city in NJ, what's the name & phone number for the print shop, etc. etc.

Regardless, I stand by my statement about this being a task that wouldn't be assigned to a little print shop in NJ.

-- Cary Mc from Tx (Caretha@compuserve.com), June 13, 1999.

Gordon - Bruce Beach is not a nut case?

Review the following:

http://www.albertaweb.com/year2000/docs/doc0583.html

Back in the 1980s, while bemused farmers looked on and infuriated Niagara escarpment authorities worked the courts to try to stop him, Beach began constructing what was then a nuclear fall-out shelter on land owned by his mother-in-law.

He hired contractors to dig a massive hole in the ground, placed about 40 school bus hulks in the hole and then covered everything up with one foot of reinforced concrete and up to four metres of dirt.

Around the same time, Beach also formed Canada's Tomorrow Discovery Corporation to purchase a ship to train young people in underwater research and robotics.

In 1986, however, the project went bust and 26 young Canadians were stranded in Chile where the 110-metre ship was being refitted.

The story made headlines as did the fact that Beach's corporation received $50 million toward the project from the federal government's bungled scientific research tax-credit program. Though the program existed for only about a year, it was so full of loopholes that it cost the federal treasury $4.2 billion before it was cancelled.

Sounds reasonable to me.

-- Pollyester (Polyester@dacron.net), June 15, 1999.

This is real easy. Anyone live in New Jersey. How many print shops in New Jersey. Print out the article. Check the print shops. In America who would lie to you?

-- thinkIcan (thinkIcan@make.it), June 15, 1999.