maybe we are not on the same page as the electrical industry. maybe we ought to sit down and define or redefine our terms.

the following concerns *non-emergency* devices. now read what the union for concerned scientists has to say and then you decide if we are getting what we think we are getting when the industry speaks about 'mission critical.'

it seems to me, that, at this point, all terms are suspect. we have to learn how to ask the right questions[as was noted by someone on this forum]or we are not going to get the right answers... and lord knows no one from the power industry is going to teach us how to ask them.

text

Another non-emergency system at most nuclear power plants that may cause problems is the spent fuel pool cooling system. Spent fuel pools contain irradiated fuel that has been removed from the reactor core. An average nuclear plant has four to five times as much irradiated fuel in its spent fuel pool as in its reactor core. Irradiated fuel releases both heat and radiation for many *years* after the reactor is shut down, which is why emergency core cooling systems are installed. But the cooling system for the spent fuel pools at most nuclear plants is not an emergency system. Experts in a Congressional hearing last year testified that the Millennium Bug might cause the electrical grid to "blackout." A nuclear plant automatically shuts down if there is a "blackout." Emergency diesel generators automatically start within seconds to provide power to the pumps that cool the reactor core. The system that cools the spent fuel pool is not powered by the emergency diesel generators. The irradiated fuel in the spent fuel pool continues to release heat. The temperature of the spent fuel pool water will slowly increase. A watched pot may not boil, but an uncooled spent fuel pool will boil in a *few days.* A boiling spent fuel pool represents a serious radiation threat to plant workers and the public.

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now *they* told us it doesn't take months to close down a nuclear plant and cool the core... so what do we *assume*? we assume that everything is safe and under control.

it takes *years* for that irradiated spent fuel to cool down and there is up to *4* or *5* TIMES as much of it. this begs the question...

just how many years?

it also continues to release *HEAT* and will *BOIL* in a few days.

it represents a *SERIOUS* radiation threat.

there is *no* way for it to cool once the plant shuts down.

and *this* is not an emergency.

will someone kindly tell me what is wrong with this picture. this is the ultimate 'cosmic disconnect.'

we are truly living in a world gone mad.

-- Anonymous, June 05, 1999

Answers

marianne:

Without a drawn out explanation of core physics, emergency equipment is designed to shut down and cool down the reactor. There is no need to worry about the fuel pools for days, if not weeks, depending on the fuel loading of the pool. It may surprise you to know that the cooling pumps for 'my' fuel pool run for just a fraction of each day. I can't understand why you would think that there is no way to cool it, if it became necessary. It is designed into the system to cross connect my fuel pools to emergency cooling - IF it was appropriate. With a loss of all power, it becomes a bit more low tech, yet just as feasible to use our on-site fire truck to pump water into the pool for 'feed-and-bleed' cooling. This *may* or *may not* be a *cosmic disconnect*, since *I* have *no* idea what *that* means.

-- Anonymous, June 07, 1999

Make sure the the fire-truck's pumping system is Y2K compliant.

-- Anonymous, June 07, 1999

nucpwr

Suppose, nucpwr, that after a plant shutdown including activation of the emergency diesel ppowered pumps, and other post shutdown safety procedures, that you just got on your bicycle and rode away.

Is that plant safe for a month or six months or a year or five years?

With no additional power, water or anything.

-- Anonymous, June 07, 1999

nucpwr,

read my post again. the key words in the sentence below are "now read what the union for concerned scientists has to say."

exact quote from original text:

the following concerns *non-emergency* devices. now read what the union for concerned scientists has to say and then you decide if we are getting what we think we are getting when the industry speaks about 'mission critical.'

these are not *MY* words these are the words of David Lochbaum,*senior nuclear safety engineer* for the Union of Concerned Scientists, as he explains that the NRC does not clearly draw a line for safety regarding Y2K.

*HE* also went on to say:

"The temperature of the spent fuel pool water will slowly increase. A watched pot may not boil, but an uncooled spent fuel pool will boil in a few days. A boiling spent fuel pool represents a serious radiation threat to plant workers and the public."

now when you responded with[see below] it was not my opinion that you were disagreeing with but the *SENIOR* nuclear safety engineer for the union of concerned scientists. if you would care to put forth *your* opinion on core physics and the attendant spent fuel pool cooling system that contains the irradiated fuel i will be only to glad to forward your professional opinion to him for his critique.

nucpwr wrote:

Without a drawn out explanation of core physics, emergency equipment is designed to shut down and cool down the reactor. There is no need to worry about the fuel pools for days, if not weeks, depending on the fuel loading of the pool.

when a *SENIOR NUCLEAR SAFETY ENGINEER* that does *NOT* work for the nuclear industry and has nothing to gain by saying so, says that we are in danger... i tend to believe him.

-- Anonymous, June 08, 1999

Reporter: Good one! I hadn't thought of that...

Dave: No.

Marianne: Exactly which part of David Lochbaum's words am I disagreeing with? The fuel pool, untended, will boil at some future time. Knowing that, why would it be left untended? The cooling pumps are a relatively insignificant electrical load, easily carried by emergency diesels. This 'watched pot' will not boil. Quoting the Union of Concerned Scientists opinion on nuclear power is the ultimate *cosmic disconnect*. The person with the most to gain is the nuclear safety engineer whose wife and kids live within an easy commute of the core.

So, get yourselves some water, food, and guns. Then live near a nuclear power plant. If any generating stations are up, mine will be. (shhh... we rolled our clocks forward 3 months ago... don't tell the hardcore end-of-the-world types)

-- Anonymous, June 10, 1999