This is from Charlie Register's column at Westergaard today. I have shared similar sentiments about this forum here myself (although I have no idea what reporter is talking about). Would that more people paid attention:

**Even with increased coverage by traditional media outlets, the Internet will continue to play the most vital role of Y2K information and news gathering, along with discussion on preparations, recovery, and the possible outcome of Y2K.

**But be mindful of this. During a recent discussion with a reporter assigned to write about Y2K for a major metro daily, the reporter said, "I used to frequent discussion forums on Y2K websites to search for story ideas and see what people were saying about Y2K."

**"But you know," he continued, "There was a time when constructive disagreement about the severity of Y2K ruled the day. Now, what you see are threads that simply attempt to shred an opposing point of view. Don't these people realize the disservice in this?"

**These "shred threads" aren't productive. People can still be positively influenced by what they read on these sites. There's valuable information and genuine concern emanating from Y2K discussion forums daily. But a renewed sense of civility is called for here. For where is a civilization without civility?

-- Drew Parkhill/CBN News (y2k@cbn.org), May 17, 1999

Answers

Oh, BTW, here's url:

Y2K Tidbits and Constructive Disagreement

-- Drew Parkhill/CBN News (y2k@cbn.org), May 17, 1999.

Wasn't it Goldwater who said, "civility in defense of vice is no virtue." ;-)

Civility IS desirable.

But when the intellectual terrorists torch the village because their avowed purpose is to "cleanse" it ethnically (you know, get rid of the "meme virus"), you have to respond vigorously. As you responded, Drew, when your reputation was being torched.

If reporters in general aren't smart enough to separate the wheat from the chaff, their Y2K reporting won't be worth a da$*%n anyway.

-- BigDog (BigDog@duffer.com), May 17, 1999.

Hey Drew, here's some civility for ya. Go stick your head back up Pat's a$$ and lick his gonads. As an employee of the World's biggest pharisee and two-faced snake you hold as much credibility as those on the other side like CPR and Poole. How many end of the world BS scams has Patty tried to get rich on? Tell him to go have a three way with Van Impe and Linsdy.

-- Larry South (LarryS@tyler.com), May 17, 1999.

About 2 years ago, I started following the C.S.Y2K newsgroup. About 6 months ago I stopped because it was digressing into name-calling, brutal personal attacks (even for c.s.y2k standards) and a lot of profanity.

So, I started watching this forum. When I first started, it was a great place to watch people actually respect others opinions -- even if they were different than their own. There were civil discussions and a lot of good information was available.

Over the last couple of months, I've started to see the same trend I saw in c.s.y2k -- a lot of profanity, name calling, personal attacks, etc. It's very difficult to sift through this to pick out the really useful information.

I remember a little while back (9-fingers I believe it was) made a great post about the US Postal service. There ensued a very informative and useful debate on the issue. I've not seen many like that since.

I realize that there are some generally disruptive people out there, but you could almost make the case that this is an orchestrated disruption of information sharing.

My 2 cents worth.

Dave

-- Dave (dave@nospam.pls), May 17, 1999.

Hey Dave, stick your two cents up Drew's ass and see if you can find it with on of those little lighted miner hats.

-- Larry South (LarryS@tyler.com), May 17, 1999.

BBBWWWAAHHAAAHHAAA

-- yuk (yuk_yuk@you.com), May 17, 1999.

Again - let me politely point out who is responsible for the incivility and crass remarks.....Drew - email me separately, I've found some links you may find interesting, before they disappear.

-- Robert A. Cook, PE (Kennesaw, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), May 17, 1999.

And who would that be Robert?

-- Bingo1 (howe9@pop.shentel.net), May 17, 1999.

It's JBD! The crazy one.

-- Lisa (lisa@work.now), May 17, 1999.

Big Dog,

"Reputation being torched" - yeah, that's a nice way of putting it :) But one can reply by vigorously (or whatever) pointing out what's true and what's not.

It's just been that I've noticed the downward trend- it causes one to wade through a lot of "are too!" "are not!" stuff to find any real intelligent debate or discussion. It's a bummer, and, after a while, counterproductive. Which is too bad, because there are some very good people here.

-- Drew Parkhill/CBN News (y2k@cbn.org), May 17, 1999.

Larry,

If we are on the same side then I'm dropping out!

-- Johnny (jljtm@bellsouth.net), May 17, 1999.

I knew I'd see BigDog jump in here as soon as possible to vigorously defend himself against his indefensible tantrums and outbursts.

-- urahipocrite (future@no.big.deal), May 17, 1999.

Lisa, after reading Drew's post I immediately thought of the regular posters who more & more offer up inflammatory trash. These are the people who I consider to be the 'shredders'. It's relatively easy to ignore the truly crude stuff. Sure, it's possible JBD may still be around. Where's E. when you need him?!

-- Bingo1 (howe9@pop.shentel.net), May 17, 1999.

Drew,

Truly hoping this is a passing phase. The forum's still in it's "terrible teens," with evidence of digital litterbugs abounding.

As a group we can agree, to disagree, intelligently ... or not.

It's up to us all, collectively, since this is an unmoderated forum. Hope the civil persistence of some, will soon become the example for many.

Our Yourdon garden needs weeding, so the flowers can grow again.

Diane

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), May 17, 1999.

Boo hoo! Sob, sniff! What about "the children"?

-- A (A@AisA.com), May 17, 1999.

Diane,

Well, unfortunately, Y2K has become an emotional, divisive issue for many people (I would be tempted to call it a "religious" issue, although not in the religious sense). Of course, if you treat it that way, as opposed to handling it as a potential crisis which must be approached as factually as possible (not always easy), you won't be able to adapt, as it were, as credible new information comes along.

Anyway, you do good work. Hang in there.

-- Drew Parkhill/CBN News (y2k@cbn.org), May 17, 1999.

To Larry South:

Gutter language denotes a lack of vocabulary with which to state your opinions clearly and concisely and adds nothing to this forum. It just might also denote a mentality to match the lack of vocabulary.

-- El Wynn (el@yahoo.com), May 17, 1999.

-- (fixer@fixxxxxxit.com), May 17, 1999.

For a variety of reasons I spend a fair amount of time staying involved in y2k discussion forums. The issues brought forth in these forums tend to attract somewhat of a higher life form than do other discussion groups that deal with more casual subjects. However, all of the discussion forums have the same problem unless closely monitored. They are a beacon in the night for the disturbed masses to vent their spleens without recourse. In some respect this may be a blessing as these mutants will stay inside and not mingle with the general population. I'll stop now before I venture into that darkness of spitefull thought that seems to have permeated every other posting.

-- Barry Jaynes (bchbear@earthlink.net), May 17, 1999.

Drew: While there are some areas I don't always agree on with CBN, I regret the attitude of some on this forum. I personally look back with nostagia to the days where helpful information, positive support and insightful comment were the norm. Why did I have to use the word "norm" ? Sorry ! Anyway, thanks for your efforts to share current and important info on this board. God knows, we need all the help we can get.

-- reed moore (reed_moore@postmaster.co.uk), May 17, 1999.

"A whoreson jackanapes takes me up for swearing, as if I borowed mine oaths of him, and might not spend them at my pleasure." Shakespeare from Cymbeline

I'll put my my vocabulary up against yours any day Mr. W.

"He is no less than a stuffed man." Shakespeare from Much Ado About Nothing

-- gilda (jess@!listbot.com), May 17, 1999.

It seems to me that name-calling always results when people can't take the heat from having their opinions challenged. As for gutter language, who gives a sh*+?

-- Buddy (.@...), May 17, 1999.

Mutha,

No, I don't advocate anyone getting all their Y2K info from *any* one place or person. I've always encouraged multiple sources of information. However, if something truly is misinformation, one should be able to counteract it with facts, or at least better information/interpretation, rather than yelling, etc. Unfortunately, like I said to Diane, Y2K has become a "religious" issue (like the Windows vs Mac vs Linux OS wars). Bummer.

Reed,

Thanks. Heaven knows I (and others) are trying :)

-- Drew Parkhill/CBN News (y2k@cbn.org), May 17, 1999.

I'd like to know if that Pat Robertson guy is for real. I mean....

He giggles like he is half baked. Even during serious discussions he giggles. Is this like a twitch, OR WHAT?

I dont' mean to dis anyone here but is that guy for real????

Hopping away now....

-- HippityHop (bible@thumper.com), May 17, 1999.

All of the above is true, but also I sometimes just burst into laughter while reading these threads- doesn't matter whether or not I agree with the poster. perhaps we can ride this wave by sharpening our tongues? Developing a skill, an esthetic of invective, as it were? sPEw!!?!!

-- Ms. Chatty Cathy (cc@doll.world.nice), May 18, 1999.

Drew, BD, Diane, etc:

you can tell you've struck home with the y2k kiddie trolls by how loudly they're screaming on this thread.

Arlin

-- Arlin H. Adams (ahadams@ix.netcom.com), May 18, 1999.

As an analogy from Tolkien's "Lord of the Rings" --

There may have a few elves here -- very few. We sure as anything have several orcs. Possibly a wizard or two, of unknown affiliation. But most here are just hobbits. With all their limitations.

-- Silent (reader@library~.edu), May 18, 1999.

"you can tell you've struck home with the y2k kiddie trolls by how loudly they're screaming on this thread." -- AHA

Above statement from a grown man who asks for y2k compliant wedding gifts and had a "reputable source" verify the Caddy Hoax!

ROTF!

-- CT (idiotdave@infi..net), May 18, 1999.

drew, that reporter is too thinskinned to last as a reporter. i have never had a problem on this forum, ever. i try not to flame anyone and have been treated very civilly in return. but if someone does criticise me, i can ignore it and forget it.

-- jocelyne slough (jonslough@tln.net), May 18, 1999.

Joycelyne,

Actually, I don't know if that reporter was even participating in the forum. I would just guess that he/she just got tired of wading through the incessant name-calling & personal wrangling, as opposed to reading factual debate. So I don't think it skin thickness issue, since I don't know if he/she was actually involved very much. But that's just a guess.

-- Drew Parkhill/CBN News (y2k@cbn.org), May 18, 1999.

Silent ... LOL ... love the hobbit analogy!

Diane, hippity hopping along

Go Drew! And others ...

ZAP!!! From now on ... we will all remain ... "on Y2K topic."

(Chuckles. It's this typical Y2K remediation?)

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), May 18, 1999.

Diane,

Extreme coolness :)

-- Drew Parkhill/CBN News (y2k@cbn.org), May 18, 1999.