Where Is Everybody?

greenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread

As a fairly new (3 months) viewer ("lurker"?) of this forum I'd like to thank both those who have offered practical advice as well as the philosophical few who have eloquently explained their reasons for concern. Your minds work well.

My parents emigrated from Europe to Argentina in the mid 30's to escape naziism. No they wern't Jewish. They saw, so very clearly, the danger coming as did many but in retrospect so few acted. Which brings me to my question.

Why are there so few people using these sites? Yourdon's, in my search, seems to be the most active. Denial sites like Dr. Poole's are little more than small clubs for exchanging homegrown humor.

Perhaps I got here too late to catch the crowd. Perhaps those that will do have done and don't need to talk. There must be millions of people on line. Are there lots of "lurkers"? Am assuming the term applys to watchers who don't post.

It's near 11PM PDT. Hoping for some answers tomorrow. Carlos

-- Carlos Mueller (riffraff1@cybertime.net), May 11, 1999



Read, be patient. many of us live in woodwork. We'll come out eventually. to find out about us, try the archives, at the end of the thread list, and look for "what about...." where the "...." might be "you" or "you redux" or "you 2 (or )3".


-- chuck, a Night Driver (rienzoo@en.com), May 11, 1999.


You are precisely correct.

I work in a major data centre, the night mob, and ther are 25-30 of us manning all stations...

3 Brits, 27 Americans (give or take0.

Us 3 Brits ( all in the usa from 20 - 6 years) are absolutely amazed at the apathy/uninterestedness of our co-workors on name any one # Clinton, # Kosovo # Littleton # the China Bombing.......

The list goes on - of apathty and ignorance...

TPTB have done their job VERY well

This forum has as much influence as a fart in a typhoon,

not even funny.

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), May 11, 1999.

Hi Carlos,

Sometimes this place is dead as a doornail this time of night, guess there aren't many West coasters out there tonite. Sometimes this place rocks at nite and you can get slammed by all most everyone.

I get a big kick out of those 5 or 6 guys in de-bunker, cpr talks to him/her self and can get worked up over next to nothing. Dr. polly starts worked up and scales new hights of giberish. It's a shame the site is so deserted, only good for 5-10 minutes of comedy per day.

Cheer up,,,I just looked and it's still 1999 ( ref. Headline News, Preveiw Channel, and a hard copy of my calender),,you still have 4 or 5 months to finish your preps.,,,well I think so. With the Media blitz ( Tom/Motel 6, KIA,( what country makes that car?), and the Daily Show doing Y2k spoofs, the sheep are fast asleep.

Remember,,Being Y2k aware means you are an enemy of the people, your Gov.org will take care of you, we have nothing to fear but fear it's self!!, It's not a tech problem, it's a management problem, Do you know of a good PR firm? Ohh,, High comedy indeed.


-- CT (ct@no.yr), May 11, 1999.

CT - what are you on, I want some!!!

Limited to cold Becks at the moment :)

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), May 11, 1999.

 I was checking out CSY2K today and they were talking about the lack of traffic. Alot of the old posters are out gardening or something :o) There has seemed to be a noticeable decrease in Y2K since the war in Europe and less interest after each notable event lately, storms, shootings at the school, and recently the China Embassy. Maybe people are having their attention diverted by the events in real time. I can't speak for this forum but the Elists that I am on got real quite after the war. Even now I only get 100 every few days rather than 100 in one day last fall. The net in general seems to be in a bit of a lull for anything that is new. Thats going to change in July as all the contingency plans come in an we may see what is going to shut down and what is going to stay up. Actually the problem with y2k is it is all speculation till the big day. The press and the 3 day prep. stuff thou is certianly a factor in the decline. Of course alot of attention has been drawn to the link below. (Eds Request) I think it wieghs in a 200 K and that is the size of a small book. Check it out if you have not already. Great thread.

Need help preparing testimony for Senate Y2K hearing

-- Brian (imager@home.com), May 11, 1999.


Maybe you didn't get my post the other night, again, Isaid you are out there, I value your posts, I just don't agree with your conclusions,,sorry.

Hey, your shoes untied,,gotcha,

-- CT (ct@no.yr), May 11, 1999.

I suspect there actually are more of us 'quiet ones' here than anyone might imagine.

-- Yan (no@no.no), May 11, 1999.

 Since folks are bored tonight I thought I might share this bit. It may be in Canada but this more than likely applys through out the world.  (below)

Health Canada - Y2K - Issues and Responsibilities for Level 3 and 4 Containment Facilities

And then if that doesn't just satisfy your curiosity Cory Hamasaki posted on this topic last summer. The only two times in a year and a half I have been actively checking out Y2K have I seen this topic. There should be consern.

 DN - Level 5 Containment, Y2K HAZMAT, was: Why Don Sco

Office of Biosafety
Laboratory Centre for Disease Control
Tunney's Pasture (#0700A1)
Ottawa, Ontario K1A 0L2
Phone: (613) 957-1779
Fax : (613) 941-0596

January 4, 1999

Level 3 and 4 Health Canada containment facilities either Health Canada inspected and compliant or in the Health Canada inspection process working with human pathogens imported under the Human Pathogens Importation Regulations (SOR/94-558).

Today, biological containment facilities rely heavily on devices that have computer systems, embedded microprocessors and software applications. This equipment may use a date function as part of its operation. An incorrect interpretation of the date can affect the operation of a microprocessor-controlled device. Furthermore, if the incorrect date is fed into other data systems, the original error may cause other systems to malfunction or make incorrect calculations as well.

The consequences of a Year 2000 (Y2K) date error could range from something as innocuous as an incorrect date display to complete failure of a device, leading to breach of containment and release of a pathogen, possibly resulting in human exposure. In this context, the term device includes all laboratory equipment, including biological safety cabinets, critical equipment controls associated with maintaining containment and alarms that signal breaches of containment. Systems that maintain containment include but are not limited to HVAC systems, electrical systems that control door interlocks and dampers, autoclaves and other decontamination processes, and emergency power supplies, including UPS. While the Office of Biosafety is not aware of a report where non-compliance with Y2K could result in exposure or injury to anyone at a given inspected and compliant containment facility, the Office of Biosafety is concerned that non-compliance could put the users of the facility, and possibly the public, at risk.



If a device is not compliant: Please note that to retrofit any device that is in containment and is part of the physical containment strategy of the facility, a facility decontamination must be performed before any work resulting in breach of containment is done.

If there is no means to correct the non-compliant device before December 15, 1999 or if there is no knowledge of the Y2K status of a critical device and no means to safely determine/test Y2K compliance:

Note: If your facility is deemed to be non-Y2K compliant, the facility's Health Canada Level 3 or 4 approval will expire the eve of November 30, 1999 until documentation outlined in l) is reviewed and deemed acceptable by the Office of Biosafety.

Canadian level 3 and 4 facilities are encouraged to visit the Office of Biosafety's web site regularly for any new information regarding Y2K.

-- Brian (imager@home.com), May 11, 1999.

Bloody hell Yan, speak up man, I hope i haven't scared you off???

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), May 11, 1999.

I've been wondering about the containment issue myself. Thanks for posts. Keep us informed.

Ebola anyone?

-- Moore Dinty moore (not@thistime.com), May 11, 1999.

Brian, I think you've hit on a good part of the reason for the lack of posts lately--gardening. Although Taz (blast her!) is enjoying some of the fruits of HER garden, there are those of us further north (like Durham), where the tomatoes are only a week or so past golf-ball size. Then there are those even further up the map who have only skinny little plants in the ground, not even a bud yet. Besides that, there are the usual spring garden chores--pruning spring-flowering shrubs, cutting grass, doing battle with weeds and bugs. And for us in central NC, there's every-other-day watering because it's hot and dry. Okay, you Yanks call it WARM. But for us Brits, 85 degrees F is HOT.

Spring also brings on a blaze of other activities too. There are income tax refunds to be spent, tax bills to be paid by extra work, annual physicals (for man adn beast), looking for or selling houses, regular house maintenance, and that time-honored chore--spring cleaning.

Of course if you live in an apartment or condo, then you don't have to bother about any of this.

-- Old Git (anon@spamproblems.com), May 11, 1999.

Carlos, you missed out on the "heyday" of the "brotherhood of yourdon", never mind, perhaps those days can return

-- dick o' the dale (rdale@coynet.com), May 11, 1999.

It's funny - I was a regular (mostly lurking) for 4 months, but haven't been around here much lately. I now recognize only a handful of people. For me at least, the answer is that once my preparations were completed, I found no use obsessing over y2k. I've done what I can do, and want to enjoy the rest of the year. What happens with it all will happen, and there is nothing I can do about it. I find myself coming here once or twice a week, just to keep up somewhat with the latest news. But really, I'd rather be out playing with my favorite y2k prep....my new motorcycle....lol

-- Online2Much (ready_for_y2k@mindspring.com), May 11, 1999.

Lurkers abound because most of us just don't have time for replies with this treadmill life we are living. I post about once every week on a couple of forums, and that is it...

The preps are almost done... only waiting on the "date-sensitive" commodities and will purchase them in the August time-frame, along with the meds I take on a daily basis. Fortunately, my M.D. is GI.

snoozin' in the floor...

The Dog

-- Dog (desert dog @-sand.com), May 11, 1999.

Yes there are a lot of lurkers, but: remember the people who have computers and can access sites (know how to use the internet) is small, the percentage of those who care about Y2K is very small, the percentage of those that care that have the time or brains to discuss is even smaller --- and so on. So it pays to remember that the people actively engaged in Y2K research or discussion is extremely small --- certainly not "millions".

-- (narnia4@usa.net), May 11, 1999.

Should heat up in the fall, Carlos.

Stay tuned ... prepped and ready.

It was once estimated, last fall, that there were ten lurkers for every poster.

Sir Richard of the Dale ... greetings!


-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), May 11, 1999.

Carlos, It would be very interesting to get an idea of how Ed Yourdon's site and these discussions are doing in terms of priority in the search engines. The web master (Phil) should have a fair idea of where the traffic is coming from, how much, and how often. How about it PHIL? As for everyone else (regulars and lurkers), I encourage you to post thoughts and ideas and/or respond to posts that will help newbies get going in their preparations... improve on the way they are preparing, etc. For example, did you post a response to the MAY RETAILER REPORT? Don't know how to start, yourself? Check out the Preparation Archives.

Year 2000 Preparation Archive

Choose the category you are interested in and press Enter. The link will appear in a new page. Close window to return.

Category < / td>

-- Stan Faryna (info@giglobal.com), May 11, 1999.

From what I gather from Senate references, conferences, etc., I believe the States are about to push some of the cities and counties into deeper consideration of the localized potential for y2k.

So far, what has been done in our general area by government has been technically geared or limited to special infrastructure committees with little publicity. (Government likes to have all its "ducks in a row" so it can come out and say we have taken care of it. This ignores the need for people to become involved in the problem so that they understand and buy into the solution and have the phsychological feeling of control over events - Bureaucrats hate public involvement.)

Although some community meetings were held in Jan.-Feb., they initiated from the grassroots, were of extreme survivalist perspective and repleate with political conspiracy rhetoric - (turned off many moderates and frightened older people.)

I think we may be moving into organized community contingency planning this summer and early fall. This will address health, safety and welfare issues. Perhaps at FY roll-over for CA in July and the GPS roll-over in August, we may have a few more illustrations of glitches that have effected people and that will get their attention.

As for a lull in posters - I know that I am busy using sunlight to do all those outdoor projects. There is reason to the old saying "make hay while the sun shines."

-- marsh (armstrng@sisqtel.net), May 11, 1999.

Good idea Sir Stan, you need to get Phil to put that on the front page.

How, pray tell, do I set it to a "favorites" page mark? (Your selection page list, not the specific threads themselves.)

-- Robert A. Cook, PE (Kennesaw, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), May 11, 1999.


You could bookmark the link below. Bookmarking the individual category pages on the site will not be a good idea as I have to delete the pages and install new ones. I have even been toying with the idea of another that provides information on the Y2K problem. Or one with the "forums" best threads. That would be a big one.

Timebomb 2000 Preparation Archive (with cut lines)


-- Brian (imager@home.com), May 11, 1999.

Carlos: Like you i am mostly a lurker. Have posted only twice. My reasons are quite different . During the day i am caring for my family, getting my husband off to work(who DGI), kids off to school, housechores,and then the real fun begins with the afterschool activities. That brings me to helping with homework ,feeding, and getting the youngest to clean up and get to bed. It's 10p.m. by then and i haven't got but 1 1/2 hrs. to get things in order to role into place for the morning rush before the husband gets home. He like to eat something and check out the sports, and then he wants to be breifed on whats happened during the day.It's now after midnite and i'm finally getting my quiet time. It's time to hit the net. I read what ever new info i can find 1st, and then i usually hit this forum. I read as many of the days postings as time & eyes will permit and then if i don't get some shut eye the mornings is gonna go down the tubes. Time is everything and most of what is mine i use to read. The other factor, for me, is that i am technically challenged(as my nephew puts it) I don't know enough to do very many things with this machine...however there is a wealth of information to be gathered just by listening to what the others have to say. This way i at least can get some idea of how my preps are coming along in reference to what other my informed people preceive the level of the problem to be. A special thanks to chuck for responding to me by email. A extra big thanks to cory for providing enough insider info to scare me into moving further into my preps. And thanks to ed and everyone who posts here for allowing me the oppertunity to "lurk" and learn.

-- kitten (kitten@vcn.net), May 12, 1999.

I'd love to post more and read every single thread, but the year's nearly half over, and I'm busy. Sort of feeling burned out, but moving forward, nevertheless. Aside from getting the garden planted and getting the wood cut, most of the major preparations are out of the way. Working long hours to build up a cushion, now that the debts are paid. I may as well earn as much as I can (thank heaven I'm not on salary, heh heh), for my view as that this boom cannot continue forever.

-- Tim (pixmo@pixelquest.com), May 12, 1999.

Hi Carlos,

actually the population on this board has multiplied rapidly over the last several months, additionally you can figure on a high profile board like this that there are several hundred lurkers for every poster - oh some only check in once a week or so, but they're there all right. Unfortunately the vast majority of the population in this country is pretty much asleep...have been in fact for the last several years.

ah well, How are things going down there in Argentina? What sort of remediation efforts are you seeing and what sorts of y2k related problems are most likely?

just wondering,

Arlin Adams

-- Arlin H. Adams (ahadams@ix.netcom.com), May 12, 1999.

Carlos...welcome aboard. This time of year is very hectic for most people. I routinely put in about 55-70 hours per week at work. When I come home, I have four horses, new chicks, a spoiled potbelly pig, four cats and three dogs all demanding my attention..as well as the wife. Then the unexpected happens...went to a horse auction Saturday and someone gave my wife an ostrich. It came home Sunday and needs a run and shelter. In between, my mother in law is making strawberry jam, preserves and syrup. Which means I have to go uncover the jars, make sure the propane tanks are filled and that she doesn't blow us up with the pressure canner. The fish trap needs emptying again, the garden needs work, the chainsaw just quit and the grass keeps growing. No, I really don't have much time to post and now I see why. OBTW, it's about 1:30 am now. night-night, too tired to stay up. Keep lurking.

-- Lobo (atthelair@yahoo.com), May 12, 1999.

Lobo - if you tie the dogs to the ostrich, they'll both get a workout at the same time........8<)

-- Robert A. Cook, PE (Kennesaw, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), May 12, 1999.


Please, Please, Please for the humanity of it - go find the man who is giving away ostriches and shoot him on the spot. I don't want to even think about him wandering over into Texas and giving us one of those beasts. A friends wife was innocently attending a goat auction had another of these Devils approcah her and give her 15 Emus. Cost them over $500 in fences.

FIND THAT DEMON and stop the chain NOW!


-- Got Baseball Bats?

-- Greybear (greybear@home.com), May 12, 1999.

Heck, Old Git, we can't even PLANT our tomatoes till the end of May. But corn, peas, beans, sunflowers, carrots, lettuce, basil, spinach all peeking through. Ahh, sunshine.

-- Spidey (in@jam.commie), May 12, 1999.


I posted more than 150 articles on the old Gary North forum & its replacement () from Oct. '97 thru July '98. Why was I able to? 'Cause I was stuck in a situation where I could execute almost none of my personal preps. Then I relocated to TN, & later to AL -- working all the time on building my homesteads and 'getting my ducks lined up.' Still doing it. Won't be posting much. Almost all the 'regulars' of those old days don't post any more either. Why? They too busy prepping. THE MORE YOU KNOW, THE LESS TIME YOU WANT TO SPEND POSTING.

So, logically, who should be doing the most posting here? The Pollys of course -- they've got all the time in the world.

What's left of value to lurk on the y2k sites for?:

1) all the archives on specific prep details, both here and on , and Gary North's site (if he's archiving.) On the second site you can do searches>/B>. I don't know about the other two.

2) specific posts which give FACTUALLY based reports on rumored y2k problems. I personally am tracking whether Cory Hamasaki comes up with HARD facts re that MD bank database scramble, and also, any reports based on HARD data about embedded chip fiascos.

Tenga suerte,


-- William J. Schenker, MD (wjs@linkfast.net), May 12, 1999.

I HATE computers .....


-- William J. Schenker, MD (wjs@linkfast.net), May 12, 1999.

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