Here's a snip from the y2k brochure that I received in my merchant account statement this month (here it is April....) ***snip*** A common misconception exists that a point-of-sale terminal that accepts cards with "00" expiration dates is fully ready for the new millennium. While the terminal can presently read the magnetic stripe on these cards, the terminal itself may not function properly in 2000. ALL point-of-sale terminals must be tested and potentially reprogrammed or replacd to ensure proper functioning in 2000 and beyond. This pamphlet includes suggested steps to help you start preparing all your bankcard functions for the date transition. ***end snip***

Now....this is from a HUGE company that didn't issue any replacement software for us "computer payment entry" people that do not use POS terminals until we asked for it. They have practiced FOF so far with all us merchants.

Do any of you polly's STILL believe the banks when they say they are y2k "ready"??? If you do, I feel very, very sorry for you and your families.

Mr. K
***holds a bank statement in one hand saying "you're money is safe, we are ready!!!" and holds in the other hand the pamphlet saying "A common misconception exists that a point-of-sale terminal that accepts cards with "00" expiration dates is fully ready for the new millennium."**** Oh, Mr. Banker, which is it that is the TRUTH?

-- Mr. Kennedy (Mr.K@home.tonight), May 08, 1999

Answers

I just wanted to add that as far as I know most POS terminals are Y2K compliant. I worked for a company called "POS SYSTEMS" back in '94, which later merged with VISA to become "VISA MAC" (Merchant Assistance Center) and we did MAJOR projects re-programming the terminals. I'm no expert by any means but I thought I'd tell what I know.

-- Julie Stansbery (flyer@primenet.com), May 08, 1999.

Merchant Services are contracted for by banks. I.E. my company has a novus terminal that has NOTHING to do with my bank. They just deposit the funds in whatever account I tell them.

I doubt very much your terminal has anything to do with your bank.

-- Owner Of A Business (businessowner@mycompany.com), May 08, 1999.

Point is, the terminal has embedded chips. Point is, they must be tested to asure they do not fail on rollover. Point is, some IBM terminals, (and others) will crash if not repaired or replaced. Point is, the info can't get to the bank if the terminal is DEAD.

-- FLAME AWAY (BLehman202@aol.com), May 08, 1999.

Point is I had to test my terminals a long time ago or face huge fines. (and they know I tested them because I had to transfer data to them on each of the terminals so they could mark me off as done)So guess what, speaking for my terminals, THEY ARE COMPLIANT!

And yes, I am one of those mythical "small enterprises" that is so often reported to just be sitting on my ass. Yeah, that's why I have spent so much time over the last 6 months testing and retesting everything.

-- Owner Of A Business (businessowner@mycompany.com), May 08, 1999.

You write: "Point is I had to test my terminals a long time ago or face huge fines. "

It is good that your bank or merchant service required positive action.

MY point is,
1. My merchant service is one of the largest in the country
2. They didn't and don't "require" ANY action to demonstrate compliance on any level
3. It took over a week for me to get the software to load on my computer that would take year ending 2000 cards when I couldn't key in a 2000 ending card about 8 months ago.
4.Did I say 8 months ago? Yes, I did. Since this merchant service controls all of the bank related terminal leases and software, they are indeed very much a part of the banking system and are indeed very negligent.

It seems that the main focus of this paragraph is being missed. Read it again. It indicated that even if the POS terminal seems to process cards normally, they still have to be tested. This is the FIRST notification of this type from the merchant services.

With over 200 terminals reporting year ending 2000 keying or scanning problems daily so far, there is little time left to correct this particular banking problem.

It is known that steps by the banks to correct this type of problem began several years ago. It is apparent that there are still major problems.

Merchant Services are contracted for by banks. I.E. my company has a novus terminal that has NOTHING to do with my bank. They just deposit the funds in whatever account I tell them.

I doubt very much your terminal has anything to do with your bank.

-- Owner Of A Business

Are you sure you are the owner of a business? True, merchant services are not "banks", but the business they engage in impact hundreds of thousands of "banking accounts". As a merchant, I can see how corrupted credit card transaction data is going to be a major problem for banks all by itself, not to mention the other bank functions that are going to be affected. It is idiotic to say that merchant services services has NOTHING to do with the banks. That's all they do! My merchant services handles the terminals and software FOR the banks. If that POS terminal or software in non-compliant, what does it affect? Merchant services account? (bzzzzzt - WRONG!) Banking Accounts? DING DING DING DING! Mr. K

-- Mr. Kennedy (Mr.K@home.today), May 08, 1999.

"1. My merchant service is one of the largest in the country"

Novus (my Merchant Service) is not exactly small potatos

"2. They didn't and don't "require" ANY action to demonstrate compliance on any level 3. It took over a week for me to get the software to load on my computer that would take year ending 2000 cards when I couldn't key in a 2000 ending card about 8 months ago. 4.Did I say 8 months ago? Yes, I did. Since this merchant service controls all of the bank related terminal leases and software, they are indeed very much a part of the banking system and are indeed very negligent."

Then guess what you do...YOU SWITCH COMPANIES. If youa re in a multi year contract, that is your fault for not looking ahead before you signed on to it. There a lot of folks who would love to have your business. Why stick with one who is obvioussly behind the times.

"It seems that the main focus of this paragraph is being missed. Read it again. It indicated that even if the POS terminal seems to process cards normally, they still have to be tested. This is the FIRST notification of this type from the merchant services. "

Your merchant services, not mine. I had to do a lot more than test 00 card dates.

"With over 200 terminals reporting year ending 2000 keying or scanning problems daily so far, there is little time left to correct this particular banking problem."

200 terminals a day? Are you speaking for your own company has 200 problems a day or everywhere? If you are speaking everywhere, that is a drop in the bucket. Are they transactions that are never completed or have one failure attempt? Where did your stat come from? How old is it?

"It is known that steps by the banks to correct this type of problem began several years ago. It is apparent that there are still major problems. "

Your opinion and mine differ greatly here

"Are you sure you are the owner of a business?"

Yes I am sure and I was willing to keep this at a mature level, guess your not.

"True, merchant services are not "banks", but the business they engage in impact hundreds of thousands of "banking accounts"."

You and are not seeing eye to eye on definitions here is the problem. Merchant services move money from one place to another...THAT'S IT. Our terminals take the info, we batch it to the Service, they gather it and send it on to the bank. It does not go straight from the terminal to the bank. It has to go through the services computers first. Let's say I do 3 batches in a day, my service does not do 3 depostis to me bank. They do one added together deposit. They don't tell my bank anything but the amount. That's it...no more info. If there is a problem with your terminal, it will be caught at the service before it ever passes to the bank.

"As a merchant, I can see how corrupted credit card transaction data is going to be a major problem for banks all by itself, not to mention the other bank functions that are going to be affected."

I don't know about your service, but my supplier also provided me with , yes...wait for it...MANUAL CARD MACHINES. (GASP) If you have a problem with your terminal then I run it through by hand. I know...what a shock. Guess what...I still use them occasionally just to stay in practice. No corrupted data. On a serious note, you should look into this. yes it is slower, but if you have no choice than you use what's ya gots!

"It is idiotic to say that merchant services services has NOTHING to do with the banks. That's all they do! My merchant services handles the terminals and software FOR the banks."

Then your merchant service is very different than mine. The "idiotic" comment was uncalled for.

"If that POS terminal or software in non-compliant, what does it affect? Merchant services account? (bzzzzzt - WRONG!) Banking Accounts? DING DING DING DING! Mr. K "

In my case, it would be my Merchant Service account so "bzzzzzt" right back at you.

-- Owner Of A Business (businessowner@mycompany.com), May 09, 1999.

He buddy you forgot the "e" in "potatos".

POETATOS dumb-nuts.

Al Gore

-- Al Gore (2000EOD@prodigy.net), May 09, 1999.

As an ex-VISA employee and programmer I prefer AMEX, and of course, CASH :)

The numb-nuts at VISA were the laughing stock of the industry for ALLOWING 00+ cards to be issued by the issuers - total balls-up - I was on duty when we started getting the calls, uh, getting mass declines in Hong Kong, cards expire in 00, HKG Bank S/W not set-up to cope (VISA was, natch)...

Now this is a MAJOR company with plenty of time to get things right, no pressure to send these cards out but they still did it.

What does that tell you about 2000?

You know it makes sense. No POS problems with cash. No 00 expiry date problems. No power problems. Just bypass the banks and use cash.

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), May 09, 1999.

What does that tell me about 2000?

It tells me that you're talking about past history; the problem cropped up, they fixed it, they know about it. So what.

***

HahahahaEOD (End Of Discussion)

-- Hahahaha (Andys@stuckinthepast.com), May 09, 1999.

It tells me that you're talking about past history; the problem cropped up, they fixed it, they know about it. So what.

***

HahahahaEOD (End Of Discussion)

They didn't "fix it." There are still major problems.

And "owner of a business", you've opened your mouth and removed all doubt.
I don't know about your service, but my supplier also provided me with , yes...wait for it...MANUAL CARD MACHINES. (GASP) If you have a problem with your terminal then I run it through by hand.
Now, on that "mature note", we do mail order. No physical card presence. Wanna' drive down to NC to swipe your card?

Then guess what you do...YOU SWITCH COMPANIES. If youa re in a multi year contract, that is your fault for not looking ahead before you signed on to it. There a lot of folks who would love to have your business. Why stick with one who is obvioussly behind the times.
Why blame the merchant for problems caused by world wide industry? Why try to "blame" at all? I am trying to point out that
1. The bank statements sent out to consumers stating Y2K "readiness" is at best misleading; at worst - a big fat lie.
2. The "industry" that serves the banking and merchant sectors are acting negligently by not addressing the problems in a timely manner.

It's okay. You are obviously content with your business preparations and that is to be applauded. Hope you have business to do with others that have had the same support from their banks/merchant services, or else all your preparations will have been for naught.

You know it makes sense. No POS problems with cash. No 00 expiry date problems. No power problems. Just bypass the banks and use cash.

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net),

Yep, Andy, it's the way to go. Our company DOES take cash, no problem! ;-)

Mr. K

-- Mr. Kennedy (Mr.K@work.today), May 10, 1999.

Resubmitted with formatting to help distinguish quoted text.

It tells me that you're talking about past history; the problem cropped up, they fixed it, they know about it. So what.

***

HahahahaEOD (End Of Discussion)

They didn't "fix it." There are still major problems.

And "owner of a business", you've opened your mouth and removed all doubt.
I don't know about your service, but my supplier also provided me with , yes...wait for it...MANUAL CARD MACHINES. (GASP) If you have a problem with your terminal then I run it through by hand.
Now, on that "mature note", our company does mail order. No physical card presence. Wanna' drive down to NC to swipe your card?

Then guess what you do...YOU SWITCH COMPANIES. If youa re in a multi year contract, that is your fault for not looking ahead before you signed on to it. There a lot of folks who would love to have your business. Why stick with one who is obvioussly behind the times.
Why blame the merchant for problems caused by world wide industry? Why try to "blame" at all? I am trying to point out that
1. The bank statements sent out to consumers stating Y2K "readiness" is at best misleading; at worst - a big fat lie.
2. The "industry" that serves the banking and merchant sectors are acting negligently by not addressing the problems in a timely manner.

It's okay. You are obviously content with your business preparations and that is to be applauded. Hope you have business to do with others that have had the same support from their banks/merchant services, or else all your preparations will have been for naught.

You know it makes sense. No POS problems with cash. No 00 expiry date problems. No power problems. Just bypass the banks and use cash.

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net),

Yep, Andy, it's the way to go. Our company DOES take cash, no problem! ;-)

Mr. K

-- Mr. Kennedy (Mr.K@work.today), May 10, 1999.

ah, don't worry with the butthole MrK. He ain't worth savin' if he don't get it by now. hehehe, Novus is gonna' save the world, don't-cha-know?

-- chez (chez@clue.less), May 10, 1999.

Andy - thanks for the reformatting of that one post. I couldn't make heads nor tails of it in its original form. As for your comment about taking cash, hey, I ALWAYS prefer cash. Is nice to have when I am out personally and want a soda from the conveniance store next door:) (Hey, I own the place, I am allowed to "short the drawer";)

"Now, on that "mature note", our company does mail order. No physical card presence. Wanna' drive down to NC to swipe your card?"

I did mail order with my company for several years without a POS. We wrote the numbers in by hand on the slips and ran them through that way. Clearing houses prefer an imprint, but they will take it anyway they can get it. So using the old manual machines is still not a problem.

"Why blame the merchant for problems caused by world wide industry? Why try to "blame" at all? I am trying to point out that "

I only blamed the merchants if you had entered a multiyear contract. That is the only blame I laid.

"1. The bank statements sent out to consumers stating Y2K "readiness" is at best misleading; at worst - a big fat lie."

How so? Based on this terminal issue? This has no effect on a banks internal operations. The bank, in-of-itself, may be compliant, the merchant service usually (I am stressing the word usually here) is an indpendant firm. Not a part of the bank.

"2. The "industry" that serves the banking and merchant sectors are acting negligently by not addressing the problems in a timely manner."

And as I have shown you numerous times in this thread, my merchant services DID take care of all this in a timely fashion. This was nearly two years ago that I got threatened with the fines if I did not test my machines. So it is NOT the entire industry. Just like any other industry, there are laggards, but you can not say it is the industry as a whole.

"It's okay. You are obviously content with your business preparations and that is to be applauded. Hope you have business to do with others that have had the same support from their banks/merchant services, or else all your preparations will have been for naught."

I am very happy with my personal preparation and I am aactively checking with all my suppliers to see where they are at. I have spent many years building up personal relationships with my sales people who have never lied to me in the past (even if it came to them losing money...helps when you send them Christmas gifts every year...you know, butter them up), so I have no reason to question them now. I am concerned about *one* of my suppliers and he and I are trying to get things worked out.

btw...ever gonna answer all the questions I have asked you in this thread?

Chez - "ah, don't worry with the butthole MrK. He ain't worth savin' if he don't get it by now. hehehe, Novus is gonna' save the world, don't-cha-know? "

Is there something wrong with me asking Mr. K some questions about his statement? So what if I am happy with the way Novus has handled this, isn't it nice to see a company that is on top of this problem? As for if I "get it", I have my water and food storage thank you very much. See, that's what I find so amusing here. I am a "GI", but because I dare question something that makes me not worth saving? Gee...thanks

-- Owner Of A Business (businessowner@mycompany.com), May 10, 1999.

Andy - thanks for the reformatting of that one post. I couldn't make heads nor tails of it in its original form.

You're welcome. I reformatted it, not Andy.

I'm afraid that you are too constricted in your views. You seem to fail to see that the "laggards" will cause your compliant or seemingly compliant merchant services/banks to have problems just by osmosis.

Take care now.

Mr. K

-- Mr. Kennedy (Mr.K@home.tonight), May 11, 1999.

Thanks guys,

I call this a "hands off" post :)

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), May 11, 1999.

Mr. K - Sorry for giving Andy credit, got confusing up in that area of the page

As to my "constricted views", I do see how problems can arise, but you are also not willing to see that most problems can be worked around. You also have not been able to come up with a rebuttal to any of my points or answer any of my questions. I am glad to see you are concerned with the matter, but just as I see the laggards, people need to see the companies that our making great strides in progress and are fighting to keep things above water.

Oh well, I guess you called the discussion to a close.

-- Owner Of A Business (businessowner@mycompany.com), May 11, 1999.

guys,

This is why us "non-tech" people get so confused. You all sound like you know what your talking about...so how do we figure out which of you is right??????

At present time I'm voting for the lagards messing things up!

-- Moore Dinty moore (not@thistime.com), May 11, 1999.

Moore Dinty,

as an ex-VISA programmer, I really can't make myself more plain.

get your assets, if any, out of digital, and into physical.

simple!!!

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), May 11, 1999.

Andy,

You definately made yourself plain...no problem there. I was just commenting on how confusing it all with the debating back and forth. However, I have followed your posts from eons ago...so no problem with the advise...Think things are going to be bad for more than one reason!! Been looking for stock market to collapse for 5 years...it will happen eventually. Thanks for info

-- Moore Dinty moore (not@thistime.com), May 11, 1999.

Mr Gore---

How interesting, since I am watching you on CNN Live just now, (spooky) talking about how great it is to be a Black American living within 2 bus transfers of a supermarket with a whooping $3,500 of disposable income. How are ya posting at the same time? LOL

By the by- does 2000EOD mean EndOfDemocracy soon?

Oh Oh, got to go

Von Kleenton is talking about visiting our pockets in July

-- spun@lright (mikeymac@uswest.net), May 11, 1999.