Want to build outdoor ice climbing tower at resort

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Hi-

My name is Kirsten Keller and I live and work at a mountain resort in Snowshoe, West Virginia. This year we are implementing a new outdoor adventure program, complete with ropes courses, a rock climbing wall, BMX track, and about 20 other things that we are really excited about. The reason I am writing you is that we have been tossing around the idea of constructing an outdoor ice climbing tower this winter and offering instruction. Rock climbing is excellent in our area, but nobody around here assists with or offers ice climbing that we are aware of. As you are a resource that specializes in this area, we were wondering if you had any leads you could offer us for companies that have either constructed their own ice towers, or that could give us some guidance on how and if we can persue this exciting project. I can be reached at kkeller@snowshoemtn.com or by phone at (304) 572-6731. My mailing address is : Kirsten Keller Snowshoe Mountain P.O. Box 10 Snowshoe, WV 26209

Thanks so much for your help!! -Kirsten

-- Kirsten Keller (kkeller@snowshoemtn.com), April 23, 1999

Answers

Kristen,

I have never built an ice wall, much less a climbing wall, but I can tell you how to do the ice wall part. As far as the anchors for the top ropes, you should check into the advertisements in either Rock & Ice or Climbing magazines for companies which specialize in building rock climbing walls. There are also several books available on building rock walls, but for engineering reasons, these books do not discuss building top-rope anchors. For the ice wall, I would select either a less than vertical or vertical (much harder) wall constructed of concrete or waterproofed and heavily reinforced wood. The design of this will be more difficult than a rock climbing wall because the wall has to support the heavy load of the ice (one gallon of water or ice weighs 8.4 pounds). To hold the ice to the wall once the ice has formed, you will need to mount eyebolts on a regular pattern, say 2' x 2'. The ice will form around the eyebolts to attach the ice to the wall. When the temperature is low enough, allow water to drip slowly across the top of the wall (a drip irrigation system should work). You will probably have to insulate the water pipes until the water flows out of the nozzles. The flowrate of water should be adjustable so you can regulate the ice formation according to the temperature.

-- Mark A. Fletcher (mfletche@turnerdesigns.com), August 13, 1999.


Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 16:12:25 -0700 To: dwight yachuk Hi Kirsten,

The Boniface section of the Alpine club of Canada has built a free standing 70 foot tower using hydro poles. It was designed by a mechanical engineer? and although I haven't seen it, it gets good reviews.

You should contact Nancy Hansen or Andre Mahe for more info.

I'm looking to water down the side of a quarry. Any info to share?

-- dwight yachuk (dyachuk@yahoo.com), November 25, 1999.


for constructing the wall use 3/4" waterproof underlayment that is generally used for floors. i have used it for many unprotected horizontal outdoor projects for the past three years. we used it to deck a porch that is exposed to the elements 2.5 years ago and it still looks brand new. build the wall at about a 80 degree angle which will form near vertical ice. the eye bolt idea seems to be good. when boulder canyon was hosed several years ago we used hand held sprinkler heads to disperse the water but most modern ice parks use bathroom shower heads to supply the water. if you get this project done please let me know and i'll post it on my website at www.coolclimbing.com. michael

-- michael crowder (biners@crowderinc.com), April 15, 2003.

For the last 7 years we have run water over a less than vertical cliff on our property. The cliff is a mixture of rock and dirt. Here is what we have learned. Vertical ice forms fastest, low angle ice takes much longer to form. A stream of water even from a 3mm hole will make holes in the ice. Simulating seeping water works best. All pipes have to be heat lined because or the system will freeze solid. The best ice is make overnight at temps within the range of minus 20 to minus 30 celsius. Day time temps should be around the minus 10 celsius or colder. This year we are moving to a pole system and are going to be forming the ice around fencing. I know of two other camps that use fencing and one that uses chicken wire. We are planning to use a solid piece of wood or pole between the poles to act as a compression member. Imagine two poles with a large heavy icecle hanging between them suspended from a cable. Now imagine the two poles coming together and the whole thing collapsing. We are installing the poles using standards set by the Association for challenge course technology. I am planning to use 3 poles set about 20 feet apart in an "L" shape, I am still working through the water system. One place I know uses a 10 gallon pail with a hole in the middle into which a water hose is run. There are holes near the top of the pail and the water flows into the pail and seeps out the holes. Not likely to work for us as we will be doing a long curtain of ice not just a vertical tower. I also know that rock and river a guiding service in the Adirondacks has a ice wall that is on poles. Actually it looks like they built it on their ropes course.

You can contact me directly at michael@medeba.com for further questions

-- michael bryant (michael@medeba.com), July 04, 2003.


We built a wall 2 years ago in Goose Bay, Canada. We used 4 telephone poles in a y shape. Everything is tied together and to the ground with wires. We use chainlink between the post. We found that chicken wire on a large wall in not sturdy enough. We are unfortunately working on a sprinkler system. If anybody comes up with a good idea, please drop me a line. Thanks

-- Claude Montreuil (saritis@hvgb.net), September 12, 2003.


Here is how i have done my wall for the past few years. We hung a large treated 4X4 or a tree trunk about that size inbetween two LARGE trees. We used cable and bolts we had left over from our hig ropes course. Then hung two sheeets of chain link fence all the way to the ground. Then ran a hose out to the location and conected it to a sprinkler head and just ran it overnight on the wall. We rigged it up on a big ladder that we use to set ropes up on the top of the wall when we use it. A large step ladder would work depending on how high your wall is. We have a 30' high wall, which seems to be tall enough for everyone. The one thing is you have to only run the water on the wall when it is VERY cold out, your wall will melt away if it isn't cold enough.

-- Jon Lundwall (jonlunwall@hotmial.com), November 14, 2003.

We built a 34' ice tower in Caronport, SK about 18km outside of Moose-Jaw. My brother in law and my self have built walls all over Canada, the US and a few international areas. We looked at several design ideas for ice walls and didn't find any that seemed to work well. Most people use chicken wire (or some other form of wire). The problem with this is that when you use it, it flexes the ice to much and weakens it. You loose a lot of ice to this. Also, it tends to have to be very cold to freeze this way. Also, a steel structure is the way to go. Ice and poles are a bad combination as far as stress loads go (look at the Canadian ice storm of '98). We made our main structure out of part of an old mobile home (the steel roof supports made out of box steel) then we welded chanel iron across eight feet wide and every four feet on center. Then we attached 3/4 plywood to this. Over top of the plywood we were given a load of old bowling alley carpet which we connected to the plywood by useing straping and then stples. We did this to both sides. One side was flat and the other was bumpy because of the channel iron. The whole structure was tied down via eight guy lines. We made a drip pipe last year out of hose and an eight foot section of pvc pipe. This year we are useing Pex-pipeing that is insulated with a strand of heat tape running up with it. Last year we could freeze ice at well at only -5. The trick is to only run your water at night. We maintaned about 2 feet of ice on each side of the wall at all times. If you have any questions or if you want pictures email me.

-- Josh DuBois (duboisjn@hotmail.com), November 20, 2003.

Sweet, glad I ran across this. Sounds like you all have built some really nice stuff. I'm setting out to do my own wall in Vermont. I asked for advice on Usenet (rec.climbing) at http://groups.google.com/groups?dq=&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&group=rec.climbing&selm=af54826d.0312260857.12ddb6db%40posting.google.com You might check in there to see if anyone chimes in.

-- Jase (usenet@jaseroberts.net), December 26, 2003.

As per my previous post I have started running water on our pole- chicken-wire structure. We were climbing it on Jan 13, 2 weeks after starting water. You can see our creation at http://www.medeba.com/NewIceWall.html cut and paste the address to take you to the site if it does not do it automatically. Still having some issues with the sprinkling system and water not going quite where we want it to but it is forming

-- Michael Bryant (michael.bryant@sympatico.ca), January 14, 2004.

For the 88 Olympics in Calgary, we built an 60 foot ice pole on Princes Island Park. We started w a wooden power pole anchored securely in the ground. The day time temp was avg -20C and the nights about 10 deg colder. At first the fire department volunteered to come out and water down the pole on hourly intervals. At best we acheived a 1mm thickness per app and often the new app would remove the old layer. As the olympics were fast approaching we had to adopt other methods.

We built a rectangular form (mold) out of 4 sheets of plywood which was reinforced on the outside w 2x4s for strength. Dimensions resulted in an 8 foot tall, 4x4 box w open top and bottom. One corner was hinged and the other had a fastening system to allow the box to be opened and closed. This was nessecary to allow the box to be opened and placed around the pole.

W the box placed around the pole and centred, we filled the box w snow, tamping and compacting it every few feet (1 person in the box jumping and stamping on the snow) and also pouring 1, 5 gallon pail of water for about every 3 feet of snow fill. For cosmetic reasons, use clean white snow.

When the box was filled to the top, we pulled the pins and allowed the box to open, which revealed an excellent, extreemly hard square ice shape. Next, with a small crane, we moved our form up 8 feet and again filled it w snow in the same way. We used the crane and garbage bin on a rope to get the snow up to pour it in the form. This process was so successfull that a crew of 5 of us working for 12 hours produced an extremly solid stable, 60 foot tower ready for ice climbing the next day. (Olympics Official Opening). Finishing touches included the fire dept lightly spraying it w water to change the look from a square ice post to a frozen water fall suspended in space. We added a rap anchor to the top of the pole which was hidden by the ice.

I was a crowd pleaser to be sure. During the day and into the evening till about 10pm we demonstrated ice climbing about every 15 minutes. Every early AM the fire dept would come by and put a fresh coat of ice on our pole and we would start fresh the next day. By day 5 the temperature warmed above freezing. We were unable to add to our pole w the fire dept but it still lasted till the end of the Olympics (5 more days) w/o additional ice and climbing on it every day.

Guest Appearances included Marc Twight and Randy Racliffe.

Good Luck

Bill

-- Bill Betts (bbetts@shaw.ca), February 12, 2004.



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