Greek Daily Paper Says NATO Has Lost 88 Men And 32 Aircraft

4-10-99

Athens (Tanjug)- The NATO generals in Brussels cannot hide their anger and deep concern with the losses the alliance has sustained in its war operations against Yugoslavia, the Greek daily Athinaiki writes Wednesday.

The daily said it had obtained top secret information according to which 88 NATO troops had been reported missing. About half of them are Americans, 11 are German, 8 French, 7 British, and 18 are from other NATO member-states.

The NATO believes its missing soldiers are not dead, the daily writes.

According to the same sources, the NATO has so far also lost 32 aircraft in its operations against Yugoslavia.

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), April 11, 1999

Answers

Lets hope this is a case of too much Retsina...

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), April 11, 1999.

Athanaika is a taboid. According to the following Serbian source, the report originated with Macedonian customs officials.

http://www.serbia-info.com/news/1999-04/04/10496.html

The first 19 bodies of the American soldiers transported home April 04, 1999

Athens, April 3 (Tanjug - abridged) - The first 19 bodies of the American soldiers are secretly transported from Macedonia to Thessalonika from where are being transported to their homes in America at the metal coffins, Greek paper ''Athinaiki'' says.

The coffins were discovered accidently in a routine check by Macedonian Customs.

The newspaper from Athens says at its first page that the bodies went through Skoplje and reached the Military Hospital number 424 in Thessalonika completely secretly and in the exhort of the officers where are prepared for the further transportation.

''Athinaiki'' stresses that the bodies of 12 American soldiers arrived in Thessalonika on Wednesday first and that they have already transported to the USA. The next seven bodies was transported to the Greek harbor on Thursday from where they should be transported across the ocean today.

Stressing that the Greek authorities claim that they do not know a thing considering this case ''Athinaiki'' says that the USA are bond to the ''law of silence'' as in the Whitman and Iraq and that they will announce their losts later on when it is the most adequate to themselves.

Skoplje, April 4 - Macedonian customs officials said on Sunday that 19 coffins with bodies of U.S. soldiers killed in NATO's criminal aggression on Yugoslavia had passed through Macedonia en route to Greece.

The report in the Greek newspaper Athinaiki is true, "because we personally saw the bodies of dead soldiers in the coffins," said Macedonian customs officials, speaking on condition of anonymity.

They added that they saw the bodies when they opened the coffins in line with the regulations at one of the border crossings to Greece, whose name was not disclosed for obvious reasons.

They could give no more details, saying only that there were two shipments - of 12 and 7 coffins, respectively - escorted by a number of U.S. officers.

The customs officials could not say which route the vehicles carrying the coffins had taken through Macedonia before reaching the border crossing to Greece.

They said, however, that the "coffins were in containers" and that they were "taken over by Greek policemen" on the Greek side of the border.

The dates mentioned in the Greek newspaper are also true, because they were the dates the coffins crossed the Macedonian-Greek border, the customs officials said.

-- Old Git (anon@spamproblems.com), April 11, 1999.

So, what you are saying is that a Greek tabloid is better informed than CNN. Oh, I forgot. Ted Turner is in kahoots with Clinton...

Andy, if this is how your mind works, maybe the dangers of y2k you've spouted are way overblown after all.

-- a (a@a.a), April 11, 1999.

On the other hand, if war is hell, police actions are at least yucky. I suppose truth is the first casualty of police actions as well.

-- Flint (flintc@mindspring.com), April 11, 1999.

The bodies of dead military personell are NEVER shipped directly to their homes in America, and how long would family members keep quiet about deas family members coming home? The statement "U.S. soldiers killed in NATO's !!!criminal aggression on Yugoslavia!!!" should tip you off to the poor attempt at propaganda.

some people will believe anything......

-- Cherri (sams@brigadoon.com), April 11, 1999.

"In war, the first casualty is truth." You can't believe either side. Undoubtedly the Serb government is a criminal organization. And I KNOW that the U.S. government is. And the NATO country governments.

-- A (A@AisA.com), April 11, 1999.

'a' is right. During a war, you can't find out what either side is really doing. After the war, you can found out what the winners said the losers did.

-- Flint (flintc@mindspring.com), April 11, 1999.

Get a grip a,

I did say it was probably propaganda - keep your mind open and eyes and ears peeled - CNN alias the Clinton News Network IS good up to a point - personally I am gonna continue to listen to other sources as well as Reuters and the BBC, you do know know how the Media works don't you... :)

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), April 11, 1999.

Cherri,

"The statement "U.S. soldiers killed in NATO's !!!criminal aggression on Yugoslavia!!!" should tip you off to the poor attempt at propaganda. some people will believe anything......"

As I said, probably propaganda, are you telling me that casualties are not going to occur? The borders out there are "fluid", these guys have been fighting on their own turf for a long time, newbie NATO forces are gonna get their asses kicked initially. Please untangle your panties, do not blame the messenger :)

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), April 11, 1999.

Don't be angry at wee Andy, he believes anything people tell him - as long as it's BAD news.

psst, Andy lad, I heard they were flying the bodies home in Black Helicopters...

-- Y2K Pro (2@641.com), April 11, 1999.

You know y2k prole I am wetting myself laughing,

why is it that you NEVER post anything remotely sensible, why is it that you always have to post something negative and attack people personally.

You must be a sad unhappy person.

Look after yourself - hope you get better.

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), April 11, 1999.

Andy,

From past experience, I'd divide by a factor of 10, and then start looking for some answers...(yeah, I know that gives you 3.2 aircraft, but you get the idea). Also, debriefing of combat troops, including air defense troops tends to radically inflate the numbers of aircraft killed, since there are usually several different positions /weapons systems which may all be attempting to shoot down an aircraft simultaneously, and the human thing to do is for *all* of the crews to claim that they "got it" even if they didn't actually see the a/c go down.

oh well, Arlin

-- Arlin H. Adams (ahadams@ix.netcom.com), April 11, 1999.

Andy,

"The statement "U.S. soldiers killed in NATO's !!!criminal aggression on Yugoslavia!!!" should tip you off to the poor attempt at propaganda. some people will believe anything......"

As I said, probably propaganda, are you telling me that casualties are not going to occur?

Am I telling you that casualties are not going to occur...um duh I said what was printed was BS. I did not claim in any way to predict the future. As for whipping their asses, *sigh* ..never mind.."talking to you is like talking to a drunk (Hhhmmm??) They repeat the same old stuff and are incapeable of comprehending what is said to them.

-- Cherri (sams@brigadoon.com), April 12, 1999.

Cherri,

"Disturbing if true... (may be propaganda) - NATO losing men, aircraft..."

Further qualified by...

"Lets hope this is a case of too much Retsina..."

To which you replied and added...

"some people will believe anything......"

To which I reiterated my original POINT about propaganda

"As I said, probably propaganda, are you telling me that casualties are not going to occur..."

To which you replied...

"I said what was printed was BS. I did not claim in any way to predict the future. As for whipping their asses, *sigh* ..never mind.."talking to you is like talking to a drunk (Hhhmmm??) They repeat the same old stuff and are incapeable of comprehending what is said to them."

1. I'm not drunk.

2. I emphasised several times the propaganda aspect.

3. The whipping of asses is going to happen. I take no delight in that. Gimme a break.

4. Sure I hear you and undersand what you are saying. Talking to you Cherris is very frustrating however as you seem so angry. As I said, untangle the panties, don't blame the messenger. Or would you rather not hear what another country's press are saying about the situation?

5. One last thing Cherri.

How do you KNOW that the report is BS? Do you have other sources or is it just wishful thinking? We MAY or may not find out in due course. The original post was intended to show what the Greeks were thinking - nothing more, nothing less.

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), April 12, 1999.

Whoever Thinks That Ted Turner Is Not In "Cahoots" With "Slick",

I would suggest that you peruse the mainstream media of your choice for photographs of "Teddy" & "Billy" together in their high dollar tuxedoes either at the White House or at some "celebrity bash".

It is also highly likely that "Slick" has seen Barbarella and would either love to or has already gotten his hands on "Hanoi Jane".

How Orwell knew, I'll never know, but the pigs are surely in the farmer's house and wearing his clothes and eating his food.

I wonder of Turner was ever a chicken farmer. . .

-- Hardliner (searcher@internet.com), April 12, 1999.

Ha ha! Good one, hardliner! I agree with you! :)

-- Crono (Crono@timesend.com), April 12, 1999.

Two points......

Firstly, it's ludicrous to think that the Gov. would be able to hide dead bodies from the public. Obviously, the families would have the news out to CNN etc. within minutes!! (Okay, which of you black helicopter folks will be the first to claim that the feds had the gray aliens produce duplicates of the dead soldiers in order that they could claim no casualties?)

Secondly, although casualties are tragic indeed, it is pathetic that this mindset exists in the west that we can somehow go to war and expect everyone to come back alive. That is why all we have so far is some sporadic bombing done from long distance. Even though it is perfectly clear that Milosevic cannot be beaten by these silly tactics, and ground troops are necessary in order to accomplish the goals, Clinton knows that the American public don't want to pay the price that naturally comes with a ground war.

I have mixed feelings whether NATO should have even become involved in this in the first place. However, as we are, I am sickened by the stupid political gamesmanship b*llshite that treats the citizens like idiots and has to lie and manipulate them until it can claim it has public support for the next step. The lack of true leadership is tragic indeed. Before entering this war, Clinton should have told the truth about the true costs in lives and how many soldiers it would actually take to accomplish the goals.

I expect that, in order to save face, Clinton will send ground troops but will put a spin on it by calling them something else. Perhaps something like, they're not ground troops......they're multi-terrain military persuasion consultants or perhaps camouflaged arbitration engineers.

Uh........it depends on what the definition of 'troops' is.

-- Craig (craig@ccinet.ab.ca), April 12, 1999.

Unless his controls want a ground war, I think Slick will declare victory in 30 more days of bombing and back off.

If Nato bombs can come close to destroying what's left of Kosovo's rather antiquated infrastructure, it will provide a good reason for why the refugees can't "really" go back to Kosovo for, say, a couple of years or so.

So, Slick can claim he punished Milosevic, can return to embargoes and can escape the necessity to bring the refugees back (which is simply impossible apart from 250,000 ground troops stationed semi-permanently).

-- BigDog (BigDog@duffer.com), April 12, 1999.

Ted Turner no longer owns CNN. It's owned by Time-Warner, has been for some time.

-- tvhound (cable@channels.com), April 12, 1999.

...but TV Hound, what you say is a fact! Gloomers don't like facts. Gloomers like rumours...

-- Y2K pro (2@641.com), April 12, 1999.

we were never told the truth about the Gulf War, why should they start now

-- dick of the dale (rdale@coynet.com), April 12, 1999.