On another thread, Prepared said:

Russia, China and radical Islam are tighter than ever because of this. I think global elites want to "have a bloodbath and get it over with." That is, they see world war with these enemies as inevitable, and want to provoke them and draw them into conflict while we still have the upper hand; to seize the intitiative and control the situation. It's very Reichstag, very Gulf of Tonkin. We are clearly preparing for terrorist attacks (invasion of Monteray, etc., etc.); we're preparing to deal with an attack on U.S. soil, and excuse we'll use to hit back in the open. But we need to have a context for making a decisive end to terrorist nations. We know we can't take the forecast of being whittled away by terrorist actions; we have to have an excuse to fight in the open, and thereby preempt such attacks. We also WANT to have ground troops "stuck" in Yugoslavia, because the immediate goal is to control and patrol the oilfields of the Caspian Sea, and the pipelines. This mess also obscures Chinagate, which involves hundreds of traitors, apparently, not just WJC. Lots of well-connected asses being covered = WWIII.

This is the only way this could make sense to me.

-- Prepared (thinking@nuketarget.com), March 29, 1999.

This idea seems to warrant further discussion. Comments?

-- a (a@a.a), March 31, 1999

Answers

Kosovo a Y2K-relevant issue ? Uhuh.

This forum doesnt get any more intelligent, but it sure gets funnyer.

I guess Meme-stage-9 has arrived . . aka "Fear of one's own shadow". (Black helicopters everywhere, strange vapor trails, alien abductions and planetary alignments notwithstanding).

Fear is a strage thing. I wonder what you'll all latch on to when Y2K is over and the world's still there, essentially unchanged.

Got Ebola ?

-- Seeing_enemies_behind_every_rock (paranoid@dysfunctional.com), March 31, 1999.

What's all this 'meme' stuff? Trolls keep repeating it like a mantra. As far as Kosovo being Y2K related--there's no better diversion from domestic problems than a war. Every night the agitpropheads ante it up: last night they showed US forward observers watching a bomb run across the border in Kosovo. Then cut to U.S. troops marching while voice over talked about the war being unwinnable (from the air). Cut to refugees. Cut to missile launch. Cut to infant crying. Cut to stealth/wealth bomber. Cut to pensive old woman in cart. Cut to Saddam Hus...I mean Slobodan. It's like watching 'Triumph of the Will.' As perfectly orchestrated as anything John Williams ever did with the Boston Pops. They will start deploying the initial 200,000 (mostly US) troops by mid April. First, a softening up campaign: after the slack-jawed public watches sufficient refugee footage, then, like a growing zombie chorus, we will all chant 'send in the troops...send in the troops.' And it's rally 'round the flag, boys, and never mind that collapsing equities market and those dead ATMs. Hell, boy, this is WAR! (Can you say petrol coupons?)

-- Spidey (in@jam.com), March 31, 1999.

"Prepared"'s comments make more sense than Dan Blather, but I guess we will never really know. The only think I'm convinced of is that our attack on Yugoslavia has nothing to do with "Ethnic Cleansing", although this is being used to "sell" the American Public.

Can anyone identify a war where ethnic/racial/religious differences was not an issue (seriously, I'm a computer geek, not an historian)? The US Civil War comes close, but I think even in this case there were historical European ethnic differences.

Any historians out there?

-- Anonymous99 (Anonymous99@Anonymous99.xxx), March 31, 1999.

There were black helicopters flying all day on Tuesday over us. We live in Westren Ky. I am seeing more of them.

Not paranoid, just letting it be known,that we are seeing them also.

-- Linda A. (adahi@muhlon.com), March 31, 1999.

I guess the American Revolutionary War qualifies. No religious, racial or ethnic divide--just money and autonomy.

-- Spidey (in@jam.com), March 31, 1999.

In answer to Spidey's question (were it genuine) . . try these sites for more information on memetics generally . .

http://www.physics.wisc.edu/~shalizi/hyper-weird/memetics.html

and specifically the virulent strain of meme which affects most of this forum's regulars . .

http://www.mcs.net/~aaron/tmc.htm

youre welcome.

-- glad_to_be_of_service (helpful@memebusters.org), March 31, 1999.

When you cut through the metaphorical BS, a meme is just a popular or potentially popular idea.

-- Blue Himalayan (bh@k2.y), March 31, 1999.

BH

thats like saying . .

"when you cut through all the metaphorical BS, the politics of international diplomacy is just a bunch of guys in suits sitting in a room chatting"

Exactly the kind of meme-fed simplistic self-serving rubbish weve come to expect from this forum. Well done for proving the point.

-- good_analogy_NOT!!! (youre@beyondsaving.com), March 31, 1999.

yeah you're right...some of them are in robes and turbans. :)

-- a (a@a.a), March 31, 1999.

This mess also obscures Chinagate, which involves hundreds of traitors,

This is the number one reason for it, in my opinion. The Rapist's motives always stem from trying to save his own butt first. This insane bombing campaign succeeded in getting treason and Juanita Broaddrick off the front pages, so it was a success in that respect. It also gave Boy Clinton a chance to play with some real neat toys - he got to fire some great big missiles against that mean ol' bully over there in that country that he had never heard of until he started reading up on it. While the boy rapist is going through our cruise missiles like a kid working on his Halloween candy, our nation is becoming progressively more vulnerable to a nuclear first strike. This is due both to treason, and to the fact that cruise missiles are an important part of our nuclear deterrence network, that are not easily replaceable. But who cares about that, we are having great fun playing with our bombs. Kaboom!!

-- Tom Knepper (thomas_knepper@intuit.com), March 31, 1999.

War (crimes) also have a way of "unifying" disparate forces.

Maybe "the end game" isn't what you think it is.

Diane

30 March 1999

TEXT: UN SEC-GEN ON SERB'S ETHNIC CLEANSING IN KOSOVO MARCH 30

(Annan says he is "profoundly outraged" by Serb activity) (370)

http://www.usia.gov/current/news/ latest/99033010.tlt.html?/products/washfile/newsitem.shtml

United Nations -- UN Secretary-General Kofi Annan said March 30 that he is "profoundly outraged" by the vicious and systematic campaign of ethnic cleansing being conducted by Serb military and paramilitary forces in Kosovo.

In a statement issued at UN headquarters, the Secretary-General said that civilians "must never come under indiscriminate and deliberate attack" because of unresolved political disputes. Such actions, he pointed out, "are in flagrant violation of established humanitarian law."

Following is the UN text:

(begin text)

STATEMENT BY THE SECRETARY-GENERAL

30 March, 1999

I am profoundly outraged by reports of a vicious and systematic campaign of 'ethnic cleansing' conducted by Serbian military and paramilitary forces in the province of Kosovo. Concern about what is happening there can only be heightened by the fact that all independent international observers, including even the International Committee of the Red Cross, have now been obliged to withdraw.

Once again, a civilian population is being made to pay the price for an unresolved political dispute. Civilian populations must never come under indiscriminate and deliberate attack. Such actions are in flagrant violation of established humanitarian law.

The United Nations is doing everything possible to alleviate the suffering of displaced persons and refugees who are fleeing Kosovo by the thousands every day. I have designated the High Commissioner for Refugees as the lead agency to coordinate all United Nations relief activities in the region. I appeal to all of Kosovo's neighbours to give shelter and comfort to the helpless civilians who have been driven from their homes. Borders must be kept open. Safety and protection must be given to those in need. I call upon the international community to give immediate financial, material and logistical support to the authorities in all countries where the refugees are arriving, particularly in Albania, in the former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, and in the Republic of Montenegro (Federal Republic of Yugoslavia). Any solution to the conflict must allow these unfortunate people to return voluntarily to their homes in full security and dignity.

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), March 31, 1999.

Hey Paranoid, get the documentary Waco: The Rules of Engagement and come back and tell us there are no black helicopters. They are painted the darkest green and "pock-marked" for the purpose of evading radar.

-- KoFE (your@town.USA), March 31, 1999.

>>From alert@stratfor.com Tue Mar 30 19:19:07 1999 >Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 19:04:40 -0600 (CST) >From: alert@stratfor.com >To: alert@stratfor.com >Subject: Russia/Iraq/Yugoslavia > >______________________________________ > >Stratfor's FREE Kosovo Crisis Center - >http://www.stratfor.com/kosovo/crisis/ >The most comprehensive coverage of the >Kosovo Crisis anywhere on the Internet >______________________________________ > > >STRATFOR's >Global Intelligence Update >March 31, 1999 > >Russia Helping Iraq Upgrade Air Defenses > >Summary: > >Intelligence officials now admit that Serb and Iraqi defense >officials have met and collaborated in recent months on anti- >aircraft operations. Russia is now supplying sophisticated radar >systems to Iraq. The possibility of a second front is >increasing. > >Analysis: > >One of the critical issues in the Kosovo war is the intention and >capabilities of Iraq. It must be remembered that many of the >same nations that are currently engaged in the Kosovo air >campaign are also, simultaneously, engaged in an air war in Iraq. >As NATO intensifies the air war over Kosovo, the possibility of >an intensification of the air war over Iraq poses an important >strategic challenge by diverting aircraft and logistical support. > >Recent reports emerging in the press tend to confirm Stratfor's >long-standing view that Yugoslavia and Iraq collaborated in the >run-up to the current conflict. According to the Associated >Press, for example, U.S. intelligence now has evidence that >Yugoslav technicians met with Iraqi specialists in Baghdad in >February to help prepare Yugoslavia for an air war. Since both >sides have similar equipment and are facing similar aircraft, the >Yugoslav military quite rationally wanted to learn whatever >lessons the Iraqis had to teach them. > >It is obviously in the interest of both countries to cooperate >strategically as well as technically. Anything that forces the >United States to divide its scarce air campaign resources >benefits both. Thus, a report from the IBC from Baghdad, >claiming that Iraq is distributing advanced radar guidance >systems for the SAM-6 surface-to-air missile system, is >particularly significant. According to the report, Iraq is >intensely engaged in upgrading its anti-air missile grid. Abed >Hameed Hmoud, special secretary to Saddam and a member of the >Presidential Council, is said to be personally supervising the >installations of the systems at the Presidential Palaces, air >bases and other critical installations. The article further >states that both the Northern and Southern Corps of the >Republican Guards are receiving new computing equipment and >small, advanced Russian-made radar units as well as technicians. > >If these reports are true, and we think that to be likely, the >Russians are now engaged in a dramatic re-supply of equipment to >the Iraqis. There have been numerous reports from sources in >Russia about such a re-supply, and the IBC report is merely >confirming the arrival and deployment of this equipment. The >upgrading of the Iraqi air defense grid has the potential of >posing serious problems for allied pilots on missions in Iraq, >particularly if new systems have been distributed inside the no- >fly zones where routine air patrols are carried out. We note, >however, that we can find no evidence of any U.S. or allied air >strikes in Iraq at this time. This indicates that both sides are >lying low for the moment. > >The new systems increase the ability of the Iraqis to engage U.S. >and allied pilots on missions in this area. The standard U.S. >response to such an engagement is first to target the radar and >missile sites. By substantially increasing the number of such >sites, Iraq is able to dictate a quickened tempo of allied air >operations. Even if they lose some of their equipment, if the >Russians have provided equipment in sufficient numbers to provide >redundancy, Iraq will be able to dictate the level of allied >operations. At a time when U.S. logistical capabilities required >to support air operations will be heavily tilted toward Serbia, >increased air operations over Iraq might pose a serious burden. >If, on one hand, the U.S. declines to increase its air >operations, it opens a window of opportunity for Saddam. If, on >the other hand, the U.S. does increase air operations in Iraq, it >could, over the long haul, degrade its logistical capabilities. > >Two front wars are the traditional fear of any power. There is >no question but that the U.S. can handle one intense and one low- >grade air war. There is some question whether the U.S. has the >supplies and transport systems needed to sustain two simultaneous >high-intensity air campaigns. There is no doubt but that Saddam >and Milosevic understand that they may have an opportunity to >pose serious problems for the United States. Milosevic, of >course, has done his part. Now the question is whether Saddam >will up the ante. > >It is not certain that there is any clear comprehensive >warfighting agreement between Yugoslavia and Iraq, nor that if >there were, the Iraqis would honor it. But there is a real >window of opportunity available to Iraq and some indication that >it is preparing to exploit it, with Russian help. When we factor >in the unknown North Korean factor, we can see that there are >some important reasons why the United States, in particular, will >want to conclude the Kosovo air operation as quickly as possible. > >___________________________________________________ > >To receive free daily Global Intelligence Updates, >sign up on the web at: >http://www.stratfor.com/services/giu/subscribe.asp >or send your name, organization, position, mailing >address, phone number, and e-mail address to >alert@stratfor.com >___________________________________________________ > >STRATFOR, Inc. >504 Lavaca, Suite 1100 >Austin, TX 78701 >Phone: 512-583-5000 >Fax: 512-583-5025 >Internet: http://www.stratfor.com/ >Email: info@stratfor.com

-- Arlin H. Adams (ahadams@ix.netcom.com), March 31, 1999.

Boy. What a time to run out of air launched cruise missles.

-- a (a@a.a), March 31, 1999.

I saw a black helicopter last night. Seeing them more and more. Sent by Klinton no doubt. This thing in Kosovo is all to get our minds off these black helicopters and the coming New World Order. Join me. I'm buying guns and I intend to use them to kill every liberal I can find.

God told me to act. So I am acting. Y2K is the signal.

-- billybob (billybob@nfosd.com), April 01, 1999.

Billy Bob a.k.a. Randy Weaver. Original.

-- Mike Johnson (thefeds@wako.troll), April 02, 1999.