Don't like taxes? Here's the alternative.. : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread

New Utopia is an independent country, a city-state (like Singapore or Hong Kong) that is presently under construction in the Caribbean. New Utopia will be the most technologically modern city of the world- a haven for industry of all sorts, from computers to media to tourism.

The city is built out of the water, on a low reef where the depth is, at it's deepest point, about twelve feet. The buildings sit on concrete platforms, which rest on piles driven deep into the ground.

Instead of streets, New Utopia has -like Venice- canals, along which all kinds of vessels, including gondolas and water taxis, will move. There are bridges for pedestrians.

Since we are building from scratch, New Utopia has all the latest technological infrastructure. Fiber optic connections in every room, for instance. The city-state was conceived for all of capitalism, but the technological industry will -along with banking and finance, since there are no taxes or transaction duties- be one of the fields most suited to New Utopia.

The city is also one of the most secure in the world. There will be both an effective and efficient police force and an equally effective coast guard to protect the freedom of its' citizens from crime.

In the United States, all new drugs must pass through several years of testing, even if the drug has proven to be perfectly safe and effective in other countries. The testing benefits nobody except the bureaucracy and the medical lobby of competing pharmacists interested in keeping the status quo. In New Utopia, people have the freedom to use any medicine they desire, so long as they and their doctor both agree on it.

New Utopia is a state without income tax, without sales tax, without production tax. A Constitutional state where the individual's right to freedom stands above all else, since that was the purpose of our founding. This is a technological paradise in the Caribbean, a secure, free and beautiful New Utopia.

Welcome to the third millenium.

(Like my ad copy? ;) )

-- Leo (, March 22, 1999


Okay, I'll bite.

How does N.U. pay its police and coast guard? Or are they all-volunteer?

-- No Spam Please (, March 22, 1999.

20% import duty on consumables. Nothing at all compared to the bevy of income taxes, sales taxes, real estate taxes, tariffs, council rates (well, I assume you'd have to pay for your own garbage collection and road maintenance), welfare taxes, transaction duties, capital gains taxes, stamp duties, and so on that you have to pay elsewhere. And if you don't like it..then buy home-grown food ;)


-- Leo (, March 22, 1999.

Actually, the only taxes specified in the U.S. Constitution are excise taxes, which are basically duties on imports... that's how the fedgov was *intended* to be funded...

-- sparks (, March 22, 1999.


Okay -- what's the difference between owing the government $100 for taxes and owing the government $100 for import duties?

Are you saying "duties" are the alternative to "taxes"? What is the substantial difference between the two?

>20% import duty on consumables

Sounds a lot like a 17-18% consumption tax, since N.U. is going to be importing lots of stuff.

-- No Spam Please (, March 22, 1999.

Your so-called utopia has all the necessary seeds of its own destruction. It is in no way laissez faire, and in no way free. The Prince can fire all of the Board of Governors, at whim. The taxes are called "lease payments" or import duties. The "government" licenses professionals. There appears to be a Central Bank (God help them!!). The language of the Constitution is so vague that the Courts could bastardize its meaning, just as the U.S. courts have done (remember the Commerce clause, and its destructive effects?). Etc, Etc, Etc.--need I say more? But good luck!! Especially to those who surrender their $$$ for the "government notes."

-- Dubious Utopias (, March 23, 1999.

Imported consumables. Some food- unless you like fish. Fuel, unless you've got a sailboat or a gondola (the water depth is easily sufficient to allow the use of poles). Computers are not taxed. Neither are electronics, clothes, rent, any of the other stuff. I'm not sure about things like ink and paper, but I'd hesitantly say that they are NOT consumables, they are raw materials.

Consumables are a fraction of consumption. In the United States, a high-income worker -let's say a skilled software designer who makes $100k a year- will lose about a third or two fifths of that to income tax alone. Then there's sales tax. There's land tax. There's vice tax, if he enjoys a drink or a cigarette. If our man has investments that appreciate, he's got capital gains tax. If he wants to save for his retirement in a 401k account and for some reason -like, say, to prepare for a crisis- he wants to get some of that money OUT, he's got to pay a big chunk of THAT to the IRS.

All in all -and this is not a random figure, it's something I've researched- our man will end up paying roughly 50-70% of his money to the IRS. This is absurd, but it's true.

In New Utopia, our $100k-earning software designer will find life a lot easier. His income will be effective tripled. Yes, there IS a small amount being paid to the government. A regressive fraction, that will get smaller with the process of time as New Utopia provides and even exports more and more of the previously-taxed consumables. If there were no government, this man would probably be paying a similar fee to a private security company to keep him safe. That's the proper function of government- security.


-- Leo (, March 23, 1999.

There are corrupters in every community--both new and old. Let's diminish them where we live and fight plunder at home.

-- Watchful (, March 23, 1999.

Utopia? Stuck on an overgrown oil rig with a bunch of merchant bankers???

got Tsunamis?

-- a 3 hour tour, a 3 hour tour.. (, March 23, 1999.

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