Y2K Stockpiling Checklist and the Hard-Asset Hierarchygreenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread
Here are two links that I found worth a look and think you may find interesting, and possibly of value.
The first link is an article called "Stockpiling in Preparation for Y2K: Why Bother?" which has two parts. It begins with a discussion of preparation itself, and then provides a "Y2K Stockpiling Checklist". If you are new to Y2K you may want to read this all. If you are already Y2K aware, you may want to check out the list for anything you may have either missed of forgotten about.
The second link also has two parts: The first is a "Commentary on Gary North's Reality Check Issue #32" (from 10/30/1998) and may be interesting to those of you who follow GN. The second is called the "Hard-Asset Hierarchy" and goes from "Food and Consumables" to "Gold Coins". It is this second part I thought might be of general interest to the Forum.
Both links start off with a lot of words before getting to the lists, so if you want you can just skip down and check out theY2K Stockpiling Checklist and the Hard-Asset Hierarchy themselves. Hope this helps, Rob.
-- Rob Michaels (firstname.lastname@example.org), March 14, 1999
I like this link, In a Y2k scenario above a 5 It represents good protection with little risk. (Aside from a slight possibity of a drop in gold price if nothing happens). There are two issues tho which I think do need to be addressed so far which havent been the first is.
1. If your holding this level of cash, how do you protect it. The article gives some ideas, in terms or using small denominations etc, but nothing regarding stashing thousands of dollars in paper and metals safely.
2. Nobodys talking about risks to 401K accounts. You just cant liquidate these things without taking a 30 -40 % tax hit. And in a lot of cases itll be 28% percent up front. Liquidating these is risky very risky.
Id be interested to hear some peoples thoughts on these.
-- nyc (email@example.com), March 14, 1999.
nyc: As far as how to safely stash valuables, there are lots of different opinions and options. Jim Lord has recommended having two safes: One that you keep well hidden (where it would take even you twenty minutes to get to it) and a second safe that you put a few important looking papers into and perhaps some small amount of cash etc., that is relatively easy for someone to find.
Regarding the 401k, from what I have heard the options here are limited to what is in your plan unless you leave your company. One idea though: if you have contributed after-tax money, you should be able to get that portion out (no penalty) via a direct rollover to a new self-directed IRA which invests in just about anything you want (but not in a margin account). You cannot take the money yourself, it must be a direct rollover from your plan to the new IRA directly or you will owe taxes. So if you have after-tax contributions, check with whoever runs your plan to see if you can get the after-tax (with earnings) part out without penalty, while leaving the rest (pre-tax contributions) in the plan with your employer.
-- Rob Michaels (firstname.lastname@example.org), March 14, 1999.
RE: hiding money; see www.captaindave.com. Go to the Survival Guid Section and under Bug Out or Batten Down he has a link to Caching your Goods. I found his webpage to be informative and without a lot of bs.
RE: retirement accounts: best to talk to your accountant about that. Perhaps using some of the loopholes such as gifting money to your kids if you have any. If you don't want to cash in your retirement accounts, be sure to have an accurate up to date hard copy of the pertitent info on your retirement account. It takes a while to get it, so you may want to request the info pretty quick.
-- pamela (email@example.com), March 14, 1999.
No one is going to advise you what to do with your ASSets. The experts lay out different scenarios for you but they won't tell you what to do because THEY don't know what to do. They (the experts) diversify, and remember this, they have been at the "chicken little" game for a long time. Gary North, Howard Ruff, Dr. Ravi Batra and others go way back into the late 70's, the 80's and early 90's sounding TEOTWAWKI call. They sold books, tapes, held seminars, yes, they made big bucks selling beach front property in the desert. These people didn't care whether you were gullible or not, they were in it to make a living, they found an audience and exploited it. Could it be that we are in the same type of scenario? Look at the Y2K industries that are cashing in on our fear and panic? I want to sell you people "solar flare protection garments." Any takers?
-- Adios (AdiosAmeigos@bye.com), March 14, 1999.
1. There are small, fireproof, security boxes that you can get from your local K-mart or wal-mart. They can be hidden or buried anywhere. 2. 7:23 am. went brain dead. Sorry forgot part 2!
-- SCOTTY (BLehman202@aol.com), March 15, 1999.
OK 401k Most 401k's have a fixed asset fund in them. Short of taking a LOAN out on your plan or, pulling it altogether, this is the next best choice IMHO. Brain dead @ tomuchbooze.lastnight
-- SCOTTY (BLehman202@aol.com), March 15, 1999.
That's where our 401K is at.
-- Assetprotect (ASSetprotect@asset.com), March 15, 1999.
I'm more concerned about fire than anything else (other than my 401k). From what I have seen in the small print, the "fireproof" security boxes aren't. They're only good for up to an hour of fire. I bought one, but I don't think I'll use it for money, just important papers.
-- Brooks (firstname.lastname@example.org), March 15, 1999.
THanks for all your responses.
I like the double safe idea. Thats a good one.
As far as 401Ks go, yes I was referring to before tax money. If I wasnt managing my own 401k and had my employer doing it, Id have to go with Scottys idea, The loan, Id forgotten about that one , very good point there. THe only issues with it are you can only borrow half of your vested balance i believe and you gotta pay it back with interest. Even though you the interest goes into your own account. Still tho if you can do it a very viable option.
For me tho , I think I have to go with the diversification. Moving as much as possible out of the growthsector (ie stock and Growth/Balanced) and ito the Fixed income sector (treasuries, Money markets etc. I believe this will insulate a portfolio somewhat from any of the market fluctuations which are possible in most Y2k scenarios.
Once again thanks for all the input
-- nyc (email@example.com), March 15, 1999.
What are you doing with 401K plans and participating in the tax ripoff?
You could cash in the 401K and "worry" about tax consequences later, if there is an IRS to worry about.
Either check out the link below or keep sticking your ass in the air.
-- a (A@AisA.com), March 15, 1999.
Try to store your valuables at a minimum of two physically separated secure sites, the more sites the better, and the further apart, the better. It's a hassle, but if one of your sites is lost to fire, theft, or other hazards, you will have a backup.
Due to the uncertainty of Y2k's effects, diversifying one's assets would seem to be the most reasonable approach. Splitting your holdings among gold, silver, currency, bonds, minimal checking and savings accounts, stocks, short positions, real estate, food, water, and various barter items makes for a LOT of flexibility. As with "regular" investing, you may not make a killing, but you won't be wiped out either should you guess wrong.
If fire hazard is a concern, even with a fire safe, concentrate on precious metals, pre-65 silver coins, and post-65 common clad coins as none of these will burn. Lighten up on currency or consider placing one fire safe inside another. One could also creatively store some currency in a slightly-off-site-but-still-somewhat-secure area, i.e., the garage, the car, the tool shed, or any other spot that could survive a fire to the main structure. Tightly wrap stored currency in plastic bags to avert potential water damage. If bugs are a problem, consider using bug spray on one of the inner bags.
These hidey-holes don't have to be forever, just until you feel the bank is a safe place for your money. "All your eggs in one basket" has always been a fools game, with Y2k even more so, regardless of the relentless media brainwash.
-- Nathan (firstname.lastname@example.org), March 15, 1999.