Test My Theory ----- Gov. Plan of Action-----------greenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread
Okay I have come up with a theory (maybe it's not new), now for the test, your opinion.
Let's say our country is going to be vulnerable with a capital "V", and YOU are gov., what do you do?
Do you tell all of your enemies around the world where you are going to be the weakest, and for how long? NOT.
But, you do have citizens who pay taxes, so I guess they're good for somthing. You tell them to prepare for a few days, and hopefully can get your act together enough to provide some assistance. You triage, you contingency plan, you get the Red Cross involved. You rev up the military. You sacrafice a few lives to hopefully save many (or at least gov.).
Whatever you do, you don't ever say say, 'Yes, it sure looks like we're going to lose the entire Eastern portion of the grid.' or reveal too clearly whatever other gory detail of our vulnerability exists. National Security breach 101.
Oh yah, you maybe throw some 'cyber terrorism' propaganda into the mix so you can have a scapegoat & a cause to rally around.
Then you find a nice hidey hole command center far from the action to call the shots & come out when the smoke clears.
Sound like a plan Stan?
-- Deborah (firstname.lastname@example.org), March 08, 1999
We warned you, but we did not think it would be this bad. Sorry!
P.S. Give us your guns, we don't want you to hurt yourselves.
P.P.S. The FDIC insured your deposits to $100K. When we get done printing the $1,000 bills, you can come get a hundred of them, if you can prove you had that in your bank account. Don't want $1,000 bills, then take this electronic debit card (that way we can track your spending).
-- Bill (email@example.com), March 08, 1999.
I think we give the govt. way too much credit. These are the folks who can't even get their own Senate computer systems updated. There are way too many folks in this country for all of them to be "rounded" up and watched. What we seem to fail to take into account is the simple fact that if it really does go South, then why does everyone assume that folks will "follow" the instructions being given by the govt.? Come on here, the last person or persons I will be listening to will be someone from the govt. here to "help" me!!
Govt. works because most folks follow the rules. When enough folks stop following the rules then the house of cards comes down, it's that simple. We all act as if we're all going to continue to "play" by the rules as they currently exist. Get a clue, if the game changes that drasticly then the rules will no longer apply. To believe anything else is only fooling yourself. Everybody seems to think, or want, somebody to be "in charge"!! Well it may not happen or if it does it may be the wrong people in charge, then what are you going to do? I submit that most people will not do anything, they will look for someone to tell them what to do. That seems to be human nature, right or wrong.
Just my .02 worth....
-- freelancer (firstname.lastname@example.org), March 08, 1999.
I think you're hitting pretty near the center of the target here. If one tries to put themselves in the shoes of Bennet et al it's hard to figure out exactly what to do. While I personally think more truth is better, I also recognize that a significant portion of the population of the US today is fairly helpless and terror prone.
You do make an excellent point about information to/for out enemies. Like it or not we are the Great Satan to a significant portion of the world and Capitalists Dogs to a lot of the rest. The world scene is not a pretty picture today. This has to factor in to what they find advisable to say.
As someone else pointed out, Bennet et al have left huge spaces between the lines for the reading enjoyment of those who have the eyes.
--Greybear, who thinks more information is coming between the lines than on them.
-Got Reading Glasses?
-- Greybear (email@example.com), March 08, 1999.
While I think "national security" is an issue, why are we seeing the DOD with a D on the report card (or is it a C now)? I would think the gov would be giving them an A+ to keep our enemies in check, even if it is a bunch of BS. <:)=
-- Sysman (firstname.lastname@example.org), March 08, 1999.
i wanted to add to a few points: 1. the sheeple will be easy to round up because most will not have prepared and can be easily "encouraged" to leave their homes when FEMA, w/ the aid of the national guard (ie @ gunpoint) to go to the shelters FEMA has already admitted to being set up. 2. how about all the reports of increase NATO troops on our soil (not bound by Posse Comitatus, and the German Luftwaffe flying in the southwest is already claiming diplomat ammunity to reports by civilians about too much noise cause by low-level flights) 3. who says very many tax-payers WILL be paying this year?? 2cents
-- sarah (email@example.com), March 08, 1999.
Get on the Train! It will Take you too the feeding station...Everythings going to be all right now!~~ Got Ammo?
-- Caveman (D@Cave.net), March 08, 1999.
IMHO I believe that if our Gov started full scale preparations for the Y2K disaster, it would be perceived as preparation for a first strike. Sagan's winter would be a sure thing. I have been across Russia from one end to the other and I know what I'm talking about. Don't forget Russia and China are crashing. They know it and they would think nothing of taking us with them. So the best our Gov can hope for is low key grass root preparations and the GT's have enough American spirit to help unfortunate neighbors. We will all pull through this together and come out on top. Keep your preparations massive and low key, watch your rhetoric. Despite what some think, the black copters are not training to kill Americans but to repulse potential invaders. If what I think will happen, happens, we will all thank God for the Delta Force. Tom
-- Tom Format (Tom Format @ aol.com), March 08, 1999.
Deborah, Greybear, I think security is part of it. There were a couple of hints in the State Dept. report when the spokesperson said something about making sure the overseas native staff were paid so they didn't become upset (hint, hint!). Now I think about it, the verbiage in the State Dept. report about not revealing the names of certain countries who were appallingly behind in their recognition of (let alone action on) Y2K, so as not to embarrass them or cause them commercial or other harm, could have been just as much of a screen for not miffing borderline countries and/or preserving the security of friendly ones.
And for some reason I keep thinking about the submarine lie re the Falklands War. You remember--the Falklands are SO far away from the UK that it was some weeks before any ships could get down there. However, not long after war broke out, the Brits let it be leaked that they had a sub in the area. It kept Argentinian hostilities down to a bare minimum. (There was no submarine.) Unfortunately, we don't know which is a sub story and which is true, and won't until it's all over.
As for the shelters, during any disaster designated shelters are opened. More will be needed this time because more people may be affected in a given area. (E.g., the gas may go off too.) Additionally, some of those "shelters" are likely to house extra prisoners, from any mayhem that might occur. Haven't we seen where arrested prisoners have been kept temporarily in tent cities when the jail is full or when a certain high-risk activity is in town (like Mardi Gras in New Orleans). There's no way I'm going to a shelter--all those screaming kids running around and strangers just a few feet away from your thin foam bed on the floor!!! Ugh! I shall just say I have TB or something horribly contagious, and start hacking.
-- Old Git (firstname.lastname@example.org), March 08, 1999.
Claiming to have some nasty or communicable disease might put you
in another category -- I don't recommend it.
(Space between lines here....)
-- Tom Carey (email@example.com), March 08, 1999.
Oh. Duh. Thanks.
-- Very Healthy Old Git (firstname.lastname@example.org), March 08, 1999.
For the sake of arguement, let's say that there is 'a disuption to the normal social order" due (at least in part) to Y2K related failures. Let's also say that part of this disruption involves intermittent and recurring shortages (i.e. rolling brown outs) in the eastern and western power grids. Since most of the campaigne functions and election equipment rely on the availability of electricity, it would only be "reasonable" to conclude that the 2000 elections would either result in an unfair advantage to certain candidates or would not be possible in the light of unrliable electrical pwer (if for no other reason than who would be trusted to report the results and how?).
Now, what is a loyal, faithful, and trusted president to do in the face of this problem? Declare a delay in holding the elections and an extension of his term, of course.
And how do you enforce this decree? How about declaring national "martial law" (for the good of the citizens, of course) and calling out the troops to enforce it. (Of course, there may be a slight problem in calling out certain national guard units in, say, s. Texas, because they may show up to pick up their arms and ammunition issue . . . and then head for the hills! :-)
One might note that there have been exercises conducted already with a premise of local authorities requeting assistance from the US Army to quell resistance to the declaration of martial law and there is a scheduled national guard exercise schedule for May 1 . . . hmmmmm, wonder who came up with the idea of a May Day celebration of this sort? (Don't suppose it has anything to do with any national leaders who visited Moscow while in college, do you? :-)
-- Ralph (RDWilson2@yahoo.com), March 08, 1999.
Y2K will make the UN WEAKER, not stronger! The other countries are worse off than we are! Germany will need all their troops to deal with refugees from Russia! So just get that 'UN takeover' bs out of your head!
Just trying to help.
-- Dell Mountain (DelMonte@altavista.com), March 08, 1999.
I'm not surprised to see an interesting variety of responses to my post.
I would like to respond to a few of your comments.
P.S. Give us your guns, we don't want you to hurt yourselves.
LOL, good point, I forgot that one in my simplistic theory. The FDIC is a good point as well. I still think these things are merely one of many concerns at the top.
"I think we give the govt. way too much credit. These are the folks who can't even get their own Senate computer systems updated.."
Yes, but the folks I'm talking about are the ones who wrote the Working White Paper on Cyber Terrorism. After I read that I knew these people know exactly 'what's up', and how to deal with it for that matter.
As to your following statement about gov. coming to round us all up...I think they will have other things to occupy themselves with & didn't mean to imply this was their plan.
"the last person or persons I will be listening to will be someone from the govt. here to "help" me!!"
I think you have a lot of company on this forum. (me included :-)
Great minds think alike.
(hope I didn't scare you) ;-)
P.S. I really need to go get those glasses!!!
Good point. The media seems to be painting a pretty picture though.
The following story from today is about the Navy.
Let us all know when there are tens of thousands of NATO troops here, (or more) okay?
BTW our boys wear NATO uniforms in various parts of the world as we speak. (not that I'm happy about it, or anything)
"who says very many tax-payers WILL be paying this year??"
Good point, for NEXT year. Expect a national sales tax (when the smoke clears).
I will think about Sagan's winter tomorrow. (It is another day)
you're right on target, IMHO.
Shelters, bad. Home good. ;-) Even if my kids are screaming! I still gotta have that bug out bag though, just in case.
Clinton & Presidential elections. Agree there's a possibility. Marshall law may be necessary, I don't think it is a bad thing on it's own, it depends how weird things get.
"One might note that there have been exercises conducted already with a premise of local authorities requesting assistance from the US Army to quell resistance to the declaration of martial law"
If you have seen documentation of this I would be interested in the source. The military excercises in Texas (and Cal.)sound like standard warfare training for the 21st century. I don't like the live fire aspect, but the army doesn't think like civillians, I think it was insensitivity, not intimidation tactics. Again it's just MHO.
You also wrote:
"....Don't suppose it has anything to do with any national leaders who visited Moscow while in college, do you?"
I don't want to think about that today, I'll think about that tomorrow. (kidding) I don't ever hide the fact I don't like the man, but I don't think he has that much power, someone will off him (if he pulls that @#$%#).
Good point, AFTER the dust settles I wouldn't be surprised to see the UN taking a lead role (or some hybrid offspring UN type organization) because of the very point made in this thread several times this is world wide, it's about much more than the USA.
"This is going to have implications for American society, and the world that we can't comprehend." --John Hamre, Deputy Secretary of Defense
-- Deborah (email@example.com), March 08, 1999.
to read more about the presence of UN troops, you may want to look at the following: http://www.devvy.com (in the DangerZone section) http://www.offshorestrategies.com/agitator/rise_of_global_governance.h tm
you may also want to do a search of http://www.worldnetdaily.com as they have had several stories on this type of stuff.
-- sarah (firstname.lastname@example.org), March 10, 1999.