Am trying to set up a perimeter alert system for three acres. Must be unnoticed in the daytime. Should be somewhat reasonable in cost. Will have multiple electric sources available. Have considered multiple infared motion detecters with buried signal wires to house, also small dog trained to not bark but instead push switch on house when intruders appear. A single wire that looks like an electric fence tied to a tension switch (with provisions for wind pull). I would appreciate any other suggestions or comments on the above. Heard of one gentleman building homemade claymore mines from pipe collars, nipples, and twenty 12 gauge shotgun shells. Reloadable and cheap. Also illegal as hell now. Should keep away the faint of heart though. Can anyone steer me to a reliable ISP. Mine works sometimes, sometimes doesn't and could care less. All comments welcome!!

-- Looking For (Who's_that@the.window), March 04, 1999

Answers

Geese work well, as long as it's warm enough for them to be outside, same with guinea fowl (which I dislike) and peacocks (which I can't stand).

If you're covering three acres in a rural area, I hope you don't have too many deer or other large critters of that nature, 'cause you'll be up all night checking on false alarms if you try to completely automate your system.

Arlin

-- Arlin H. Adams (ahadams@ix.netcom.com), March 04, 1999.

Go to the "Frugal Squirrel" site, it's a survival forum, very knowledgeable people there.

-- bearit (bearit@bearit.com), March 04, 1999.

I can appreciate low cost, low tech perimeter alert devices. We will be considering same shortly.

But I have to strongly advise against any kind of 'booby trap'. There's simply too much danger of hurting the wrong person. Even if you don't kill yourself setting it up, if it is left unattended then it poses a risk to everyone, not just those who would threaten your life. Such devices have no brains and they kill and injure indiscriminantly.

Do not allow your fear of a potential danger push you to do something extraordinarily stupid.

How would you feel if you ended up killing your neighbor's 7 year old daughter? ("But she wasn't supposed to be there! We told her stay away from there!").

Using appropriate force against real threats to the life of you and your family is one thing. It is quite another to kill when no such threat really exists.

Don't do it.

-- Arnie Rimmer (Arnie_Rimmer@usa.net), March 04, 1999.

Arlin and Arnie,

Again, wise counsel on personal defense.

(BTW, I've read the whole, damn Senate Report. Now, I'm beginning to question why I would stay in a populated area without a highly publicized plan for public safety. Wilmington is not one of the "Big Rocks" (120 cities) to be protected by trained troops ...)

Waaaahhh!!! I want my mommy...

~C~

-- Critt Jarvis (critt@critt.com), March 05, 1999.

Dear Looking For and others:

You have to realize that almost all really effective defense measures are illegal. I say "almost all" because those that are still legal and effective have just not yet been recongnized by legislators and included in the laws as illegal.

The object of our Federal Government and its state and local franchises is a helpless, docile, ignorant, apathetic populace, so as to more easily gain and maintain power.

To that end, in the area of defense, all the niggers on the government plantation (you, me, others, regardless of race) are to be disarmed and made helpless. Government will provide all the protection you "need." Problem is, your definition of "need" will be likely different from government's.

Also, keep in mind that the corrupt government court system has handed down several decisions that the government has no duty to protect individuals, but only the "public."

Any of you think otherwise? Moo-oo.

BTW, check out the synopsis and reviews of "Unintended Consequences" by John Ross, on Amazon.com

-- a (A@AisA.com), March 05, 1999.

Just some free association here....

If you don't have anything to steal out at the edges of your property, move your perimeter in nearer to the house.

Install solar powered (or electric if you will have it) motion detection lights.

Fishing line strung with noise makers like bells across natural egress points at several different heights.

Build a fence around the house area. Get a big noisy dog.

If things get bad, (looting, civil unrest, etc.) set up a night watch.

Sounds ridiculous but big piles of dog crap (at least ankle deep) near a frequently vandalized area did the trick for a friend a few years ago.

Maybe tension lines strung with New Years " fire poppers" or noisemakers. The line gets pulled tight and bang! Not harmful but would scare the begeebbers out of someone trying to sneak around.

Perhaps a few good sized holes dug here and there at strategic points where it's likely to see foot travel. Not too deep, maybe a foot but enough to put intruders on their face.

Except for very high tech methods needing power sources it's not easy to guard property without patrols. The idea of geese and other noisy birds is an excellent notion as they are very territorial, the downside is that they are somewhat vulnerable to coyotes, wild dogs etc. Good luck.

-- Cautious (protect_your@ssets.safely), March 05, 1999.

Sorry. but we just don't have the troops to cover 120 cities. Before the troop reduction following the Gulf War we had at best less than 100,000 "trigger pullers," and they will most likely be fully occupied elsewhere. Heck, today we can't fully keep our warships fully manned and pilots in the cockpit. Both World Wars taught us just how many soldiers it really took to control any urban area. In a large city, a division of light infantry could only really control several city blocks, even less if they had to fight to control any of the ground.

Back to the original question about early warning.... The military often relies upon geese at military sites in Europe. They tend to recognize those familiar to them, won't spook at a rabbit, skunk, raccoon, deer, etc., but will raise a ruckus at the sight of an intruder. Also, a great meal if the need arises. Other low cost possibilities include remote solar motion detectors, that turn on by themselves automatically when someome turns into a driveway or approaches usually < $25. A well trained dog that will alert you to someones presence by any number of ways is also a great choice. No system is foolproof, so don't spend a lot of money. Simple is best! Flares and other gee whiz devices usually just start fires or backfire on the inexperienced handler. Good luck!

-- (snowleopard6@webtv.net), March 05, 1999.

Um...you guys....don't look now, but I think you've just been baited into a "Paranoia Showcase"

unless 'Looking For' was really serious...then I'd say you ALL have problems

-- Chicken Little (panic@forthebirds.net), March 05, 1999.

Plueeez dude!! You are going to kill people without discretion. Do you really want to do that or do you just want to know when someone is approaching?

Sujest a good review of what Arlin, Arnie, and --cautious posted.

Glad your not my neighbor!!

-- R. Wright (blaklodg@aol.com), March 05, 1999.

Get the motion detect. Wire onto one of the socket feeds. Run wire to door bell transformer. Run wires from transformer into house and hook up to a cheap buzzer. It will blast you out of bed. If you want noise ouside, hook wires up to a siren. Works very well.

-- Scotty (BLehman202@aol.com), March 05, 1999.

So what are the 120 cities that will be protected? Site? Thanx!

-- have q's (answer@here.com), March 05, 1999.

Me? I got my 2 dogs, hell they bark when a leaf blows through the yard but they'll be great alarms. They're both kinda big too. Never mind that they would probably lick you to death, at least they look dangerous. Neighbor on the North is a hunter and has lots of firepower in the house. Don't know about neighbor on the south. Across the street we have a cop and on either side of him is a hunter and a gun collector. If things get bad (but i don't think they will) We can block both ends of our street, hell we can control access to the whole development if necessary, it's not very big. And I know there are plenty of hunters living here. We will organize 24/7 patrols and keep us all safe. I forgot to mention, wife, son, and I are currently taking handgun training, with rifles to start next week. I haven't bought guns yet (currently using the instructors) but when we finish up and get our certification we're goin' shopin'! This spring and summer will see us at the range a lot, practising for whatever. I feel pretty safe.

-- Ricky (I'mset@home.house), March 05, 1999.

I looked into using outdoor motion detectors rigged to alarm buzzers, but the models that I have looked into (and have) are nowhere near reliable enough. They false alarm several times a night, and that's unacceptable when an alarm means that I get up from a sound sleep, grab vest, helmet, and rifle/ammo and check the area out.

I found that it'd cost at least $1000 per detector to get ones reliable enough. Also found that neither fence-contacts or buried body capacitance systems are affordable ($10k plus).

I am looking into taking a few IR motion detectors and aiming them at areas that are relatively sheltered (doors), and hope that this placement will reduce the false alarms. Have to weatherproof them too, and that's a bit of work.

I can see some use for pull-string noisemakers attached to fishing line to make noise if someone hits them. I carry them for camping purposes.

Otherwise, I'm not having much luck in coming up with ideas for home perimeter detection that aren't dangerous or illegal (that may not matter if things get bad enough).

-- Bill (billclo@hotmail.com), March 05, 1999.

I'm with Arlin. You won't find a better solution than a "watchgoose". If you get a gander too, you can have a gaggle of goslings and then you'll truly have "Mother Goose" to look out for you! Even Navy SEALS couldn't get through that defense!

-- Hardliner (searcher@internet.com), March 05, 1999.

Get rid of the shotgun-shells in your trip-wire devices. For perimeter applications, use twelve-gauge "bird bomb" rounds that are similar to "flash-bang" grenades or twelve-gauge flares. These would serve as deterrent to any intruder well as being either a loud alarm or visual signal for you.

A bird-bomb is about like an M-80 that's launched couple hundred feet before it goes off. These would either scare off any intruders or start a fire-fight for sure. But if they're pointed upward, when they are tripped, they won't be set to kill or maim. A twelve-gauge marine flare is the old stand-by for illuminating an area or for signaling.

And if things really go all to Mad Max-land, you can always load with buckshot.

WW

-- Wildweasel (vtmldm@epix.net), March 05, 1999.

WW, Heck with Y2K, I fight a battle with deer around here all the time. Tell me more about those bird bombs - like where would I find them and how much will they set me back. Sounds like I could use them to condition the deer to keep away. Thanks. jh

-- john hebert (jt_hebert@hotmail.com), March 05, 1999.

Here's my .02 cents worth ... My daughter raised a duck, which lived below the bedroom window in a small box , with fence. That drake heard everything that tried to come near my house and I would wake me from a sound sleep even to a VERY low " quack, quack ". They are not stupid creatures. You would only get the one warning as I remember, and then it remained quiet for self preservation ( it was ALWAYS alone, but never lost the instinct to " warn the flock". ) Eagle

-- Harold Walker (e999eagle@freewwweb.com), March 05, 1999.

On the ISP: I moved from AOL to Mindspring some long time back and have always gotten good results, even when having funky connect probs.

On the perimeter guard: Try Dakota Alert for battery powered motion/heat detectors. The sending units are battery and the receivers can also be (~9V for each piece). Prices are fairly high (~$220 or so) and they're available from the manufacturer or places like Northern.

Also, try the DWA-120 Driveway Alarm, available for ~$90 from various electronics places (do a Web search). The sending unit housing is cheaper, but the electronics are much nicer w/ test modes, LED indicators, varying alarms, etc. Like the other unit, both components can be battery powered.

Have been using them for 1+ year and don't get false alarms.

Good luck.

-- Hunh (hewiggins@mindspring.com), August 05, 1999.