Hungergreenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread
If it is this bad now, next year will be a nightmare. Hotlink anyone.
-- Mike Lang (firstname.lastname@example.org), February 19, 1999
-- rb (email@example.com), February 19, 1999.
Those poor people, haven't they been through enough? I know a guy who did missionary work in Kasakstan (sp?),former U.S.S.R. The only food they had in winter was whatever was left of what they personally grew during their very short growing season. So, basically dinner was turnip soup. No meat. This was like 2 years ago & it's only gotten worse.
Ugh. This doesn't have to be. This makes me crazy. Their evil gov. did this to them. Power to the strong, let the sheople starve. AAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!!
-- Deborah (firstname.lastname@example.org), February 19, 1999.
Deborah -- Russia doesn't have a government in the sense that we understand it. Since the unbundling of the Empire, effective control of most everything has been taken over by powerful guys who want more power, including lots more money. The government itself is actually quite weak. Troops and coalminers have gone months without pay, district governors are feathering their own nests, what taxes are collected are not spent on government services.
Russia is a shambles now, not an evil empire. 72 years under the so-called "Communist" regime raised a couple of generations of people who really have no sense of what a functioning open society is.
-- Tom Carey (email@example.com), February 19, 1999.
You said: Russia is a shambles now, not an evil empire. 72 years under the so-called "Communist" regime raised a couple of generations of people who really have no sense of what a functioning open society is.
I fully understand this. That is why I was blaming the evil 'commie' gov. I wasn't clear, I should have specified FORMER GOVERNMENT( I can't do italics).
You also said: effective control of most everything has been taken over by powerful guys who want more power, including lots more money.
I agree fully, I would also like to add to that fact it appears that these (power hungry)people have graduated the struggle to using 'laws' to bankrupt businesses, imprison and otherwise attack competitors. The accusations (and probable imprisonment) of/for Treason is a high price to pay for free market success. These strong arm tactics reek of oppression (and a few other things).
You also said: Troops and coalminers have gone months without pay, district governors are feathering their own nests, what taxes are collected are not spent on government services.
This is not new either. Sure, hardline party members have been replaced by district governors (half of them are probably the same people anyway considering they were in the best position to take advantage of the collapse, many opportunities for pennies on the dollar aquisitions) but to my uneducated mind it looks like business as usual, with a healthy dose of chaos thrown into the mix.
Just as it will take time for the working class to figure out how to adjust, I think it will take time (at least a generation) to root out fully old habits of leadership. I only hope the people don't become so discouraged first that they will gladly return to somthing akin to their former form of gov. in exchange for promised food in their bellies.
To repeat my former sentiment, these people have suffered enough. I feel more rage toward Lenin & the Pol Pots of this world than I have EVER felt toward any person. Surely if the idea of a "just war" existed it would be to wipe people like them (Lenin etc.) off the face of this earth forever. The untold grief & human suffering they have caused in this century is staggering. I could go on for years. I will stop now before I have a stroke. ;-)
-- Deborah (firstname.lastname@example.org), February 19, 1999.
Look what I just found on today's AP:
They say their church, which was officially established in 1982 after years operating underground, has been suffering repression reminiscent of the anti-religious drives of the Soviet era.
``For a long time, we believers waited for freedom in Russia. We thought we'd finally have a real opportunity to profess our faith and help people,'' said the church's junior pastor, Alexander Vasilyenko, who was in Moscow to deliver the asylum applications.
``But in a lot of ways, that freedom has turned out to be imaginary,'' said the soft-spoken 26-year-old.
-- Deborah (email@example.com), February 19, 1999.
Here is another snippet:
In December and January, tax police raided the church in the middle of the night and confiscated files, including personal data about the members.
Security officials called congregants in for questioning, and warned some that they would have to choose between their church and their jobs, said Vladimir Ryakhovsky, a lawyer who is representing the church and is co-director of the Slavic Center for Law and Justice, which monitors religious rights violations in Russia.
The court case has been suspended indefinitely.
``This suits the authorities, because each time the church inquires about renting space or other such matters it's told, `We can't do anything until you settle the case,'' Ryakhovsky said. snip
Notice the raiding in the middle of the night part? That was always one of the favorite ways of doing things. First of all in the middle of the night you are not functioning very well. Secondly, the general population never realized just how many people were taken away. Cities full.
Now at least they have lawyers, and are not in jail (who knows maybe some are)
Also, sorry that address didn't work. You can try http:drudgereport.com and click on AP BREAKING.
I hope they get out while the gettin' is good.
-- Deborah (helpthey're@being/opressed.com), February 19, 1999.
I'm sorry I know this is off topic but here's another snippet from the same place:
Students may defy government ban on anti-Khmer Rouge protest
PHNOM PENH, Cambodia (AP) - Cambodian students warned Friday that they might defy a government ban and go through with a demonstration demanding the leaders of the Khmer Rouge's genocidal rule be prosecuted. snip
Yeh! I wonder if I could demonstrate too?
-- Deborah (firstname.lastname@example.org), February 19, 1999.