Greetings All.

In the dark pessimism that is permeating just about everything else in Y2K remediation, some good news. Not only has my bank made great strides in compliancy and contingency planning, they are passing along information in this forum to other banks.

I posted answers to questions you suggested I pose to my bank last week after they hosted a "no snowjob" Y2K seminar, and apparently some big wigs in the KY banking industry are tuning into this forum to keep on top of the situation.

This morning I received a call from Dianne Stubblefield who is the Compliancy Officer for the Bank of Benton & Calvert City, who relayed to me that the post I placed about their seminar on this forum was noticed by officials of the Kentucky Bankers Association, who then sent a copy of my post and your responses to all their member institutions. Dianne called to thank me for making you all aware of their contingency and remediation efforts, and hoped other banks would take their lead in alerting their customers to their own remediation efforts. We can only hope.

I think the Bank of Benton deserves credit for being honest about the problem and the efforts they are making to inform this community of the real possible impact of Y2K. They are leading by example.

But also, I think all of you deserve credit for participating in this forum. It appears that the amount of good you all are all doing is far beyond the scope of just forum posters. It is entirely possible that if officials that have the capacity to make preparations in their communities tune into this forum and glean information from all of you, A self-fulfilling prophecy and panic of a worst-case-scenario could be averted in some places. Doom and gloom posters should know that their fears are prompting some to make ready and take action. You Solution Oriented posters are giving great advice, and even you disciples of Diane J. Squire lay hopeful serenity scenarios to prepare the mind and community. You all provide a well-rounded approach to this coming disaster, and all of this info will make a difference in each of our own abilities to cope with it when it arrives.

Perhaps we should invite the Kentucky Bankers Association to post their efforts to getting their members ready and compliant. Maybe Chase Manhattan, First Chicago or Citibank could learn a few things from them and alleviate a disaster (bank runs) that could preceed Midnight Jan. 1st 2000 by months if they don't assuage the public's fears. At least I am not worried about my local bank, Ms. Stubblefield's presentation did much to calm my fears. Thanks Dianne.

-- INVAR (gundark@aol.com), December 08, 1998

Answers

INVAR,

I would just like to commend you for efforts and for keeping an open mind. You have gone beyond "Prepare for the worst, hope for the best." You have now taken an active role in preventing the worst. Congratulations on the results you have achieved.

Buddy Yingling Washington, DC

-- Buddy (DC) (buddy@bellatlantic.net), December 08, 1998.

INVAR, thank you!

And thank you very much to the Kentucky Bankers Association.

I've had hopes that eventually industry would start to "get it" and understand that a panic about panic isn't the solution. The best thing that can happen is open, honest dialogue. INVAR, this gives me a lot of hope that panic can be averted.

Buddy, you said it very well, "You have now taken an active role in preventing the worst." I think we can all do this if we start now and build those bridges in our respective communities.

We still have time to stay away from something like the "Milne" scenario but time is getting short. Panic will occur if action isn't taken NOW.

Congratulations again INVAR.

Mike ===============================================================

-- Michael Taylor (mtdesign3@aol.com), December 08, 1998.

I am humbled, just mispellin' pixels ma'am.

-- Robert A. Cook, P.E. (Kennesaw, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), December 08, 1998.

As long as you are on a roll, INVAR, see if you can get them to give an informed opinion on this "Know Your Customer" stuff that is due to hit next year (unless stopped by Congress; yeah, right). For all anyone really knows, this new regulation may have absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the Y2K issue, but the appearance of it is that it is designed to "trap" people who decide they want to move large amounts of cash. (Which, in my case, will be OUT of the bank and INTO my stash.) Like it or not, this will only fuel the panic. (Which means I will probably move even earlier than I had intended....)

P.S. Oh, and lest we all forget while we celebrate this wonderful news, didn't those nice KY banking folks promise to give you something in writing?

-- Jack (jsprat@eld.net), December 08, 1998.

Thanks to you all for your kind thanks. I'll keep you all up-to-date with news on this front.

Jack --- that "Know Your Customer" topic was in fact brought up at the seminar. Dianne simply explained the program as it was - I assume - explained to her by the FDIC. I suspect that individual bankers that will be required to implement that program are not aware of whatever sinister intentions may be subtely intended by the government.

As with all programs that are corrupted by this government, the original intentions STATED, are beneficial in description. It's only after implementation (ala Welfare) that those programs are corrupted to serve political intentions. This is not to say that I don't believe that the Administration has unstated sinister intentions with such a program, as I have total distrust of this White House. I've watched our freedoms erode almost daily in a"freedom for security and comfort" trade. Personally I believe this "Know Your Customer" program is dangerous, especially in the hands of the government. I think at this stage that bankers are simply being told what the stated intention of the program is, I don't think they have reasearched the potential misuse of the program by public or private concerns. I would hope that bankers that fear misuse of KYC make their opposition to this plan known. I imagine the work they will all have to do to simply enact this plan is giving them nightmares.

Perhaps a comment on this forum from the Kentucky Bankers Association on their perspective on the program as it relates to Y2K, asuage another fear that we all have in regards to Y2K Federal control.

-- INVAR (gundark@aol.com), December 08, 1998.

Congratulations, Invar, on helping your community and bank, and bringing this forum to the attention of banking professionals. It will help businesses to know what regular people are thinking and feeling about Y2K. Businesses *must* act diligently now and share the truth with people. The upward pressure will help us all survive later.

As for the "profiling" "Know Your Customer," banking personnel must get out of their business go-along space and realize this is a total intrusion of privacy. It is not likely that the masses are laundering money or dealing drugs, or engaging in any suspicious needing-to-be-monitored activities. It is a complete degradation of integrity that businesses amass detailed personal information and then make money analyzing it, distributing it, selling it, and giving the means and impetus for other business scoundrels to further intrude upon our private lives. If this goes into effect without any protests, we will all become KFC.

How will the spysters deal with the results of matching our withdrawals with those nice carded grocery receipts?
Mr. INV has on Dec. 28 made an unusual deviation from normal spending patterns, with $189 going toward toilet paper on sale at CostCo
Ah-Hah! = hordes of illegal aliens stashed in his meth lab in the basement! Investigate, get warrants, find the rolls!

If this profiling goes into effect, I suggest we all embark on a fun campaign of civil disobedience. Withdraw 1 cent, deposit 2. Deposit 10,000 of stashed cash at 2/a, withdraw 10,001 at 4/a. Do not let any patterns become apparent. Sure finance-savvy Asylumers can think up many amusing monkey-wrench ways to confound the profilers! We'd be happy to participate. Just include ways even the money-poor can mess with the banking anal-cysts. ;-)

Ashton & Leska in Cascadia, who have nothing to hide, but have ideals to uphold

xxxxxxx xxx

-- Leska (allaha@earthlink.net), December 08, 1998.

Good job, INVAR!

Both you and Dianne Stubblefield at the Bank of Benton & Calvert City and officials of the Kentucky Bankers Association are to be commended for being part of the solutions, not the problems.

Diane

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), December 08, 1998.

Leska,

Amen. You articulated my concerns about KYC better than I.

I especially liked the suggestion of civil disobedience if the program is implemented.

Now only if the rest of us serfs in flyover country would do the same when it came to other idiotic infringements of our freedoms.

I guess now I just labelled myself as a Right-Wing Nutcase?

Boy, if paranoia of government makes you a dangerous extremist by definition, we would all still be singing "God Bless The Queen" instead of the Star Spangled Banner.

Distrust of government is a good thing. It's American by birthright.

Unless the Privacy concerns about KYC are addressed, I agree with Leska's assesments.

-- INVAR (gundark@aol.com), December 08, 1998.

"When the government is strong, the people become clever."

--- Thoughts of Chairman Mao

Funny how ol' Roly-poly knew the effect of a totalitarian gummint, but put it in place anyway.

The banks' KYC policy may cause us to become very, very clever indeed...

-- Mac (sneak@lurk.com), December 08, 1998.

I'm sooooooo happy the banksters listen to little ol' us!

And I'm so sure they have OUR interests at heart!

THEY RAPE YOU, INVAR.

--Menger

-- Menger (Oro@gold.com), December 08, 1998.

Menger,

Banks are businesses just like any other. Some good, some bad. I would venture to say they do more good in a community than bad as your post suggests. I think the IRS and this government do more to rape the people of this nation than any bank entity.

-- INVAR (gundark@aol.com), December 08, 1998.

INVAR,

Your latest post screams: "I DON"T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE FRACTIONAL RESERVE BANKING SYSTEM."

Here are the basics:

There is a massive wealth transfer from depositors to banksters in the fractional reserve banking system. Banksters extend credit using a fraction of the deposits in their bank. If everyone wants to pull their money out of the bank at the same time, the banks collapse. That's why they need the FDIC. The banks make profits by inflating the number of deposits, and decreasing the purchasing power of each unit (i.e. each dollar). (I recommend that everyone read Murray N. Rothbard's "What Has Government Done to Our Money" and "The Case Against the Fed." They are both available at Amazon.com)

Banksters know if most Americans try to withdraw their money in 1999, its over. The system will collapse. And the FED can't just print more money. There are 3.7 trillion dollars of deposits and only around 250 billion in real cash in the banks.

Nothing personal, INVAR, but banking is not just another business -- its a fradulent system that would collapse without the coercive power of big government.

-- Menger

-- Menger (Oro@gold.com), December 08, 1998.

It's me. I'm the Compliance Officer of the Bank of Benton and Calvert Bank that hosted that now infamous Y2K seminar. Again, I just want to say thanks to INVAR who posed great questions and opened the discussion to a productive exchange of ideas and remediation efforts. To the rest of you, I just wish all of our customers would do the homework you are doing. I want to make everyone aware of the poblem, our continuing efforts, and our "Y2K Contingency Planning Policy" adopted by our Board of Directors to address business continuation following Y2K related failures. I hope to continue the seminars into 1999. Regarding "Know Your Customer", yes it will REQUIRE bankers to monitor banking activity more diligently than current practice. I just want to remind everyone that KYC is still in the proposal stage only - subject to comment and change. KYC has been a looming regulation proposed some four or five years ago at least. While the appearance of a connection to Y2K is understandable, we as bankers have been warned about new rules for some time now. I just hope you will remember that banks are subject to many laws, many carrying monitary and civil penalties for noncompliance. IF KYC becomes reality, you may be insulted, appauled, even encouraged to pull your deposits. But noncompliance with whatever rule evolves is not an option for us. We will be examined and exceptions will be noted, maybe even penalized. That doesn't make you feel better, but it may help you to divert your anger from your community bank teller or lending officer to the politicians that draft the laws. Thanks for listening.

-- Diana Stubblefield (dstubblefield@ldd.net), December 08, 1998.

Guess what, Diana? It's kind of hard to tell where big government ends and big banking begins.

The banking system is a cartel enforced by the federal government. And your both happy with the cozy, Cozy, COZY relationship.

Will there be bank holidays in late 1999, Diana?

--Menger

-- Menger (Oro@gold.com), December 08, 1998.

I understand you views completely. And I don't intend to try to change your mind. It's your money - and your decision.

Holidays? Our holidays are selected by the Federal Reserve System and sent to us during the fourth quarter of each year. According to the most recent holiday schedule I have received, holidays will be scheduled as normal (ie. Christmas, New Year's Day, etc.)

Thanks.

-- Diana Stubblefield (dstubblefield@ldd.net), December 08, 1998.

I realize that the fractional reserve banking system is not everyone's favorite, and there is at least one thread going recently where people were going all out, attacking its cons, defending its pros, etc., etc. Can we all just sensibly agree that it is

1) a very fragile system that depends on the confidence of the people
2) Y2K problems will cause people to lose that confidence
3) Once confidence is lost, everyone will want to withdraw their money, all of it, in cash
4) This action will constitute the dreaded bank runs that will cause the banking system to collapse.

Personally, I have no gripe with the fractional reserve banking system, per se, its always worked for me. But, Y2K is going to kill it, and I plan on getting all of my money out ahead of time.

-- Jack (jsprat@eld.net), December 08, 1998.

Diana,

If you understood my views completely then you are really saying: "Yes, I earn a living by serving a banking industry that makes profits by transfering wealth from depositors to the bank owners."

At least lawyers only charge a flat fee.

--Menger

P.S. The holidays I am talking about, Diana, are of the kind that FDR ordered during the Great Depression when Americans started the runs on the banks. Another way to ask my question: Do you think you will have a job after Jan. 1, 2000?

-- Menger (Oro@gold.com), December 08, 1998.

"If KYC becomes reality, you may be apalled, insulted, even encouraged to withdraw your deposits. But noncompliance with whatever rule is not an' option for us."

Please take note of the quote by Diane Stubblefield, Compliance Officer: Bank of Benton and Bank of Calvert.

"We have an obligation to obey just laws, we have a moral obligation to disobey unjust laws. Sometimes a law is just on its face, but unjust in its application. " -Martin Luther King

Civil Disobedience is the answer.

Peace

-MC

-- M.C. Davey (UFOskyBLUE@Aol.com), December 08, 1998.

Menger

Give the nice lady a break, will ya? She is trying to be helpful, and so far as I know, she is the first banker with the baler..guts to post here.

PS, Maybe Im goofy (yes) but I think she got your point about the Holidays.

Ahh, Mr. Morely, you make a yoke  Katie, the farmers daughter.

-- Uncle Deedah (oncebitten@twiceshy.com), December 08, 1998.

Okay, okay. Last posting. Let's see... (1) yes I believe I will have a job on 01-01-2000. That's because I am a part of the sixteen member task force responsible for remediation at my bank and I know where our efforts stand. (2) no my bank is not a non-profit organization - actually, we are one of a deminishing group of local community banks and we are employee owned (our ESOP retirement plans owns controlling interest in the bank). (3) I don't have the right to decide which laws are "good" laws and which ones are "bad" laws. I have only the right to elect individuals that will make the laws. Your views may differ but that's what makes our country so great - the freedom to disagree and express our disagreement. Consider the alternative.

-- Diana Stubblefield (dstubblefield@ldd.net), December 08, 1998.

Diana Stubblefield, major kudos to you for having the fortitude and normalcy to post here! Please do not let our apprehesion with "the system" deter you from expressing your viewpoints. I think it will be very healthy for us to have some "establishment types," job-wise, sharing this spendid cybergathering of ideas and Y2K concerns. Balance, opposing realities, even propaganda dissecting can only better inform all of us. It can get hairy in here but never take it personally!

Please visit us often, post away merrily, and also read some other threads. It is good that your bank is taking Y2K seriously. It is so cool to see your ability to respond here!

Ashton & Leska in Cascadia, who are noticing that several professional sorta establishment types are suddenly becoming aware of this forum.

xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxx

-- Leska (allaha@earthlink.net), December 08, 1998.

Thanks for the feedback INVAR.

Diana, thanks for posting.

Menger has got it right - banking is the biggest and oldest con game going. I only bacame aware of quite how evil this sytem is in the last year or two. You're all bored silly with me but I'll say it one more time - the best expose of the game and the duplicity of the elite banking families, the FED, the FDIC, The Bank Of England, the IRS etc. read these two books by David Icke - "The Robot's Rebellion", and "The Truth Shall set You Free". Both available from www.amazon.com.

They made such an impact on me that I resigned from a well paid job at VISA, not wanting to be part of the system that shackles people in debt throughout their lives.

Good luck with the job in 2000 Diana(!) - is your conscience Y2K compliant?

-- Andy (andy_rowland@msn.com), December 09, 1998.

I must admit I'm surprised and delighted that the banking industry is tuning in on the forum. I wonder what they are getting out of it.

BTW Andy what is the alternative to the fractional reserve system, a more conservative version, a larger reserve, hoarding gold.

If Mr Icke would remove references to supposed 4th dimension aliens or whatever perhaps his books would have more credibility, some of his deductions do make sense however.

-- Richard Dale (rdale@figroup.co.uk), December 09, 1998.

I would not trust anyone from the banking system at this time. I think INVAR has been sucked into a scheme. The only thing this Stubblefield person is doing is trying to prevent bank runs.

Don't be so easily conned.

-- Paranoid (Trust@verify.com), December 09, 1998.

Hey Paranoid,

Your assesment is what I first thought BEFORE I went to their seminar. If all they were concerned about was preventing bank runs, they wouldn't have informed the townsfolk that major disruptions in electricity, food, water and heat were possible, and that they should prepare for it! They would have said what so many other agencies have said: "Don't worry, be happy, it will be fixed. We EXPECT compliancy in...." Diane didn't even remotely suggest that in her presentation.

The manual contingency plans the Bank of Benton has adopted went a long way towards my belief THEY are members of the GI's.

At this bank, there's no scheme I can sniff. At least they were honest about the problem - and of course they're going to say all they can to calm fears and prevent a bank run. It's their business on the line! Would you prematurely kill your own business, or try to save it? It's employee owned - they are to be commended for alerting the community to the threat Y2K poses. Has YOUR town bank done that???

-- INVAR (gundark@aol.com), December 09, 1998.

And some of you folks wonder why companies and institutions don't want to talk to us? "Oh Hi! Thanks for listening to us....YOU LYING WEASEL! EVERYTHING YOU SAY IS A LIE! Compliance?!? HA! Have you considered the wind will be blowing from the North that day! Ha! Your contigency plans are flawed!"

Give the nice woman a break.

Yeesh Rick

-- Rick Tansun (ricktansun@hotmail.com), December 09, 1998.

Thank you for your input to this forum. I do have a question for you, though. I read (perhaps in this forum, maybe on the FRB web site) that a bank isn't supposed to disclose details about its Y2K remediation efforts with its customers and that's why people were having a difficult time getting information - other than legalistic platitudes - out of their banks. Do you know anything about this?

-- Diana (gieriscm@hotmail.com), December 09, 1998.

Rick's post made me laugh in agrreement. Not that many people "in the know" seem to be willing to be candid about their operation's Y2K situation or to take the time to hold seminars,etc. on preparedness. Let's give them some credit and not just assume all like Diana are part of some plot.

-- Dennis Wales (DELRINACO @ aol.com), December 09, 1998.

" Beware of wolves in Sheeples clothing "

-- Mickey (Mickey@homestead.com), December 10, 1998.