I thought that a few perspectives on this subject might be revealing.

I personally agree with the last one, from the ex-pilot, this whole situation is downright eerie.

Perspective One "The next time you're in Walmart or the grocery store or the gas station or even your church or social group, just look around and ask yourself, "How many of these people are aware of" and fill in the blank. How many of them could name their U.S. Senators? Congressmen? # of amendments to the constitution? % of income tax they pay? What FDIC is/means? What the Federal Reserve does? What the NSA is? How a lightbulb works?

People are generally ignorant of many things (and remember, ignorant is not necessarily a pejorative; it just means that you don't know something. Granted, some things you _should_ know, and therefore should feel bad about not knowing.) There is no clear and present danger for people to latch onto. And even then, look at how stupidly people act: excessive drinking, cigarette smoking, driving without seatbelts, unsafe sex, listening to Rush Limbaugh, etc. All of these things are bad for you. Yet people do them by the millions. Even with incontrovertible evidence right before their faces, they pile on the deathage. (A new word; not quite sure it works.) The reason there are so few rich and so many middle class, lower middle class, etc., is that the not-rich don't think or plan ahead. Who was it who said, the rich thing two generations ahead, the poor think about Saturday night? When I was in college and making ends meet with loans/grants/scholarships/work study and a part-time job, I would ocassionally save up a few bucks and buy a little bitty steak for $3 or $4. Invariably some roommate or friend would see me at the supermarket and stand there, with a twelve-pack under his arm, and ask me how I could afford a steak. Those same people are now buying BMWs and $4000 stereo systems and scoffing at all this Y2K blather.

95% of the people will not prepare or begin to prepare until two jumbo jets collide over Chicago, or a nuclear power plant has to suddenly shut down, or Clinton comes on tv during the Super Bowl (My guess is it won't happen until Thanksgiving next year; the earliest would be late Spring, early Summer).

I know that I have to keep urging myself on to buy more supplies, do more reading, keep focused on job/family/church/writing in the midst of all this. My wife is perturbed with me for the dehydrated food we received on Monday, all $3000 worth. I just shrug and point to our two small children. If I didn't do this, based on what I discern from what I've read and heard, then she shouldn't be entrusting them to me, as I would be remiss as a father.

I will spend on Y2K preparations what we, as a family, have spent on health/car/life/home insurance the past two years. We got robbed last month and that was the first claim we've made on any of these policies in nearly ten years, not counting two childbirths and an achilles rupture repair. If we don't use our Y2K insurance, I'll be dancing a jig. Maybe that's a way of trying to convince people to prepare. Tell them that they can take out insurance against Y2K death and misery for less than it costs them to insure their other mission critical systems (hey, catchy!) for two years. And this for an event that they will know the outcome of one way or the other in thirteen months. Sounds like a pretty good deal, eh?

But folks won't listen. They won't prepare. Sigh."

Perspective Two

"Unemployment system crashes in 1/1999, the media coverage, and people telling people about their checks not happening should provide the first inkling to the herd that SOMETHING is going on that affects them."

Perspective Three

"It's just too abstract and difficult to understand, much less believe. It will take a major system failure before the herd even stirs. And *then* the failure will have to be irrefutably pinned to a y2k failure. And *then* the talking heads on teevee will have to explain what happened

And *then* the full implications of actual, drop-dead y2k-day would have to be explained. Nah, I don't think even 10% of the populace will have the vaguest inkling what hit them."

Perspective Four

"Kenyon and I have been waiting for an event for over a year now and still we haven't seen anything to get everyone's attention. I'm still convinced we will need to see something that has a major effect on people's lives. So far, we haven't seen it."

Perspective Five

"In my 52 years on this planet including service as a military officer and pilot, health care administrator and small business entrepreneur, I have yet to observe a circumstance in which the general population took a proactive stance about anything. And this thing is invisible. Doesn't have a face. It can't be touched, smelled, felt, heard or seen, except by those who are working on the problem.....and that's only a very small percentage of the population.

No, I'm sorry to say that this thing will happen in the magnitude of Biblical proportions. Sort of like the great flood. Everybody carrying on like nothing was happening. Then the rain began to fall................."

Cheers, Andy

-- Andy (andy_rowland@msn.com), November 27, 1998

Answers

Excellent post to this forum. I think I saw it on c.s.y2k as well. It articulates my feeling about the herd. They will snort, they will move this way and that way..skittish at the unseen danger, and unable to leave their familiar life patterns even as the rain begins to fall hard upon their backs. I truly want SOMETHING catastrophic soon. Not because I need proof. No, I want my fellow, self absorbed, pathetically vulnerable citizens to realize the danger. I don't want them to die. I don't want them to suffer. And yet I feel this is inevitable unless massive preparatory action occurs soon. We are a fabulously wealthy country. There IS enough food and water and shelter if we just organize. But I am pessimistic. The herd will not get its snout out of immediate pleasure and routine long enough to see the coming Flood.

-- RD. ->H (drherr@erols.com), November 27, 1998.

" I have yet to observe a circumstance in which the general population took a proactive stance about anything. And this thing is invisible".

Andy: Another great post. Perhaps the poor "think about Saturday night" because they lack the money, time, and most sadly, the inclination to do otherwise. When you have a choice between worrying about where the next meal is coming from or Y2K the answer's clear. Besides, a stance of any kind requires thought. Thinking is work. People like to be entertained. Human Nature.

When people figure out that there is even a small chance that their money may not be safe, the herd will stampede into the already falling rain, into the 'deluges of history'.

-- Rob Michaels (sonofdust@net.com), November 27, 1998.

Andy, You're an ass.

The fact you state that people acting stupidly include listeners to Rush Limbaugh negates any validity to what you wrote in my mind, and proves what an imbecile you yourself are. It otherwise may have been a brilliant post, but you like a moron had to insult those of us that might have agreed with you by attacking those of us that enjoy listening to what I consider the last vestage of common sense in the media.

How is listening to him bad for you?

Never mind, don't answer that. I've heard enough of the mindless liberal diatribe as to why he's "dangerous" to listen to. I personally am sick and tired of being labelled by you idiots just because of our convictions. I'm tired of being labelled and passive anymore. You want to fight? Let's fight and get it over with!

Think for a moment: How would you like to have the post you just made classified as "DANGEROUS" and "HARMFUL"? That folks that read your posts are "acting stupidly" and that reading posts from Andy is "bad for you", even by those who haven't read any or all of your posts simply because they disagree with your views about Y2K??

Think you idiot! To build a coalition of people that have the view of personal survival, respect for others and love for decency even in the face of incredible adversity, you don't insult 20 million people that could potentially be your allies.

The Y2K wake-up call will come soon enough for the general Public. Personally I would feel safer working with listeners to Rush than a bunch of whinning, arguing, selfish, rude and indifferent liberal urbanites that turn to government for their wants, and label those they disagree with politically as "dangerous" or "stupid" as you did.

You obviously don't know what you're talking about.

Otherwise you wouldn't have made such an idiotic comment.

-- INVAR (gundark@aol.com), November 27, 1998.

INVAR - my apologies - I don't think I explained my post very well.

These are five different perspectives, written by *different* Y2K- aware people, on how they perceive how their fellow citizens will or will not react to the potential threat, real or imagined, of Y2K.

I think that they all had much in common, and perhaps may give each of us more of a take on what may happen to the populace over the next 13 months or so.

As for Rush Limbaugh, some of what he says I agree with, some I don't. Maybe you should e-mail or call Rush and get him to pontificate on the Y2K situation; unfortunately, I think he's already come out and said publicly that Y2K is going to be a non-event, just a load of hype. If this is the case it's a real shame as he is almost as big as Oprah (pun inteneded - good diets, good diets:-)))

Sorry to have upped the old heart rate INVAR:-)

-- Andy (andy_rowland@msn.com), November 27, 1998.

INVAR If you had read the post from the start, you would have noticed that Andy had simply repeated perspectives, and teh one HE agreed with was the LAST one. If you have a problem with a Rush basher, go find the perspective author and have it out. However, even Rush suggests that a sense of humor is needed most of the time.

Plus, a sense of humor is:

a) CHEAP

b) INEXHAUSTABLE

c) Y2K COMPLIANT

d) REQUIRED FOR SURVIVAL POST Y2K

(I'll even ship it for nothin, just send the $19.95 US)

-- SENSA Yuma FER SALE (not@this.time), November 27, 1998.

Perspective One: I ask myself How many of these people could find out about Y2K, and prepare, if motivated?

Perspective Two: When SOMETHING goes on that directly affects them, they will get it and so will the media.

Perspective Three: "It's just too abstract and difficult to understand... Then make it easy to understand and prepare for.

Perspective Four: We will need to see something that has a major effect on people's lives. So far, we haven't seen it." Stay tuned to 1999.

Perspective Five: I have yet to observe a circumstance in which the general population took a proactive stance about anything. Thats why we need to help the media, et. al., help the general population to take a creating community stance.

Diane, an optimist, who sees people as people, not herds.

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), November 27, 1998.

"Diane, an optimist, who sees people as people, not herds."

Me too Diane - however you can't escape the fact that this rather insulting term *is* in use (herd mentality?), and I'm quite sure that the elite, the powers that be, refer to the masses as "the herd" or "useless eaters" (Kissenger?) or worse. Fact of life.

If "they" thought more benevolently about the people then TPTB, the Government, Clinton and Gore, would make this issue the absolute top priority and make damn sure everyone was aware and preparing. Over 75% of computer CIO's recently polled said that Clinton should immediately set up a disaster task force to address this problem. We do have a year left don't we?

So whatt happens - absolute, deafening silence. If not silence then active lies as reported in USA today by the Pentagon. Again, it's evident that "they" plan on thinning the herd a little. What other conclusion can you come to that makes any sense?

Sunday's 60 minutes will be a start but I'm not holding my breath. By the time something really serious happens it may be too late for most people waking up to the problem to do much of anything useful...

-- Andy (andy_rowland@msn.com), November 27, 1998.

A pessimist is an optimist with experience.

-- Rob Michaels (sonofdust@net.com), November 27, 1998.

Andy,

Apology accepted. Actually I owe you one, I mistook your second paragraph under Perpective One as your commentary on perspective one. Disagreeing with Rush is one thing, but the constant mantra I hear that those who listen to him are stupid and dangerous, has pissed me off to the point of not taking it anymore. I get the same thing on Y2K.

As for Rush's perspective on Y2K, he believes it's a doomsayer- pessimist thing. First of all he's a Mac user (as am I) so he doesn't see the problem. He believes if we can put a man on the moon, we can fix a simple digital problem. You have to understand he's a fatal eternal optimist in Americans, well at least he was before this summer. I think the dose of apathy he's been getting from his listeners has broken his heart, as it has many of us conservatives. The connection that the general public is as apathetic about the country as they are Y2K probably hasn't hit him yet.

Rush hates conspiracy kooks by instinct. Unfortunately those of us that understand the implications of Y2K on our fragile infrastructure that have been talking and warning of this problem have been labelled kooks and conspiracy nuts that hate government and the NWO. Folks that are prepping for Y2K and dispise Rush and his listeners for political reasons are just beginning to get a taste of what it's like to be a conservative in today's America.

Rush has an instant visceral reaction to anyone bringing Y2K up. It's a shame, I know. But know this, he doesn't trust this government as far as Clinton keeps it zipped-up, so once the Feds start making claims the Y2K bug is "solved", is when Rush might believe that it really is going to be a big problem.

Let's hope it's soon.

-- INVAR (gundark@aol.com), November 27, 1998.

Thanks Invar, no problemo.

Now if we could only get Rush to start chipping away (as he is so good at) the Y2K BS that we are all enduring from the gubb'mint then we may to be able to start turning the tide of awareness at least.

It still won't get fixed, far far too late for that, just not enough time left.

But at least thinking people could adapt psycholically, well in advance, and do some basic preparation.

-- Andy (andy_rowland@msn.com), November 27, 1998.

INVAR, don't be a kneejerk conservative :)

-- Max Dixon (Ogden, Utah USA) (Max.Dixon@gte.net), November 28, 1998.

Herd Mentality

Its a fact of life, whether you like it or not. Mankind has relied on it for thousands of years, for the sake of survival. It was a lot better to have 14 cavemen fighting the T-Rex, than for one caveguy to fight it by himself.

As our society grows ever more complex we are subjected to a tremendous amount of information coming at us from all of our senses. To cope, we (our brains) cheat by blocking much of it off, filtering it before it reaches our conscience mind. This helps us maintain our sanity in a crazy world, but it comes with a downside, inattention.

To cope with our inattention, we (our brains) cheat again by relying on what others are doing and thinking, and following along. The human species does this to a high degree, Monkey see monkey do comes to mind. Birds of a feather is another clichi that speaks volumes about human behavior. Again, most of the time this type of behavior can have a positive effect on our daily lives. Nobody likes the feeling of not fitting in.

The problem is when something is outside of the radar of The Herd, and nobody inside the herd is getting it. Those who do get it before the herd, have never been treated well by the herd. History is full of visionaries who have been laughed at and scorned, ex-communicated, jailed, hanged, and crucified.

So stop wasting your breath on those who do not want to hear, they will get it along with the rest of the herd.

But be sure youre out of their way when they finally do.

Now, on to other business.

Andy

Normally I like your posts, but when you pick on guys with a twelve pack under their arm, you Sir, have, IMHO, gone too far. In the words of INVAR:

The fact you state that people acting stupidly include (Guys with a twelve pack under their arm) negates any validity to what you wrote in my mind, and proves what an imbecile you yourself are. It otherwise may have been a brilliant post, but you like a moron had to insult those of us that might have agreed with you by attacking those of us that enjoy (Beer) to what I consider the last vestage of common sense in the (Brewery).

END QUOTE

You Sir, are a scalawag!

-- Uncle Deedah (oncebitten@twiceshy.com), November 28, 1998.

Uncle D,

The fossil records indicates that man and T-Rex were not contemporaries.

-- Nathan (nospam@all.com), November 28, 1998.

OK

What about Brontosaurs and cavemen?

I'm pretty sure I saw a movie that had both in it.

-- Uncle Deedah (oncebitten@twiceshy.com), November 28, 1998.

PS I shall try in the future to use emoticons to help those who are sarcastically challenged.

-- Uncle Deedah (oncebitten@twiceshy.com), November 28, 1998.

Uncle D,

I would accept cavemen and mastodons. :o)

-- Nathan (nospam@all.com), November 28, 1998.

Done!

-- Uncle Deedah (oncebitten@twiceshy.com), November 28, 1998.

Ooooops!

Done! ;-)

-- Uncle Deedah (oncebitten@twiceshy.com), November 28, 1998.

Andy, What other conclusion can you come to that makes any sense? Take the governments silence out of their hands and into the hands of the medias investigative journalists and TV luminaries. IF we, by default, allow the mass population to continue to think they can rely on the government, then weve missed an opportunity for helping ourselves and others.

Uncle, how about we the people and the governments computer dinosaurs?

Also ... Monkey see monkey do comes to mind. Birds of a feather is another clichi that speaks volumes about human behavior. Again, most of the time this type of behavior can have a positive effect on our daily lives. Nobody likes the feeling of not fitting in.

So SHOW them, on the mass media, a human behavior that plays on the psychological desire to fit in by creating community. IF they see that everywhere, they just might choose to do it!

Diane

(Robert, an optimist in one who was once an experienced pessimist, turned optimist again when they figured out pessimism doesn't work).

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), November 28, 1998.

Personally, I quit listening to Limbaugh when he quit being a conservative and became a Republican. They are two very different things - a good half to two-thirds of the current Republican policy calls for increases in govt. spending and/or increases in the size of the Federal govt. Identifying Republicans with conservatives is just piffle. And trying to pretend that Religous conservatives are Political conservatives is even worse.

-- Paul Davis (davisp1953@yahoo.com), November 28, 1998.

Uncle - I quite like being called a scally, reminds me of home:-)

"Andy

Normally I like your posts, but when you pick on guys with a twelve pack under their arm, you Sir, have, IMHO, gone too far. In the words of INVAR:

The fact you state that people acting stupidly include (Guys with a twelve pack under their arm) negates any validity to what you wrote in my mind, and proves what an imbecile you yourself are. It otherwise may have been a brilliant post, but you like a moron had to insult those of us that might have agreed with you by attacking those of us that enjoy (Beer) to what I consider the last vestage of common sense in the (Brewery).

END QUOTE

You Sir, are a scalawag!"

Uncle - I'll say this one more time so as not to piss off everyone,

I DID NOT WRITE ANY OF THESE BLEEDIN' PERSPECTIVES:-)

Personally I like a good old piss-up, a little rumpy-pumpy never goes amiss, and I ride a very fast big Triumph motorcycle without a seatbelt, very much like Lawrence of Arabia (Peter O'Toole):-))

"His 12-pack is no match for my FIRKIN!!!"

-- Andy (andy_rowland@msn.com), November 28, 1998.

Wellll, Andy, T H Lawrence rode (and died riding) a Brough Superior.

Hallyx

"The basis of optimism is sheer terror." ---Oscar Wilde (The Picture of Dorian Gray)

-- Hallyx (Hallyx@aol.com), November 28, 1998.

Poetic licence old chap:-)

For any bike/ T.E. Lawrence freaks, read on:o)

Brough Motorcycles

George Brough, whose father also made cars and motorcycles, started building Brough Superiors in 1921 in Nottingham, England. Although Broughs are still called the Rolls-Royce of motorcycles, they are more similar to Bentleys. Bentleys and Broughs had enormous performance for their day. About 3,000 were built before the company closed in 1939 - roughly the same number as pre-war Bentleys. About 1,000 Broughs survive.

The majority of Broughs - and all early ones - were fitted with JAP engines supplied by J. A. Prestwick of Tottenham. The less powerful SS80 was fitted with a sidevalve engine; the SS100 had a 998cc overhead valve engine.

Brough Superiors were expensive. All were handmade, even the nuts and bolts. You have only to look at the fittings and compare them with pieces under the hood of a modern car to see the quality. the quality, performance and rarity explain why a Brough Superior is worth $30,000 to $100,000.

The most famous Brough owner was T.E. Lawrence, "Lawrence of Arabia". Lawrence owned eight Broughs, the first being called George I, the second George II, and so on. The last, George VIII, was never delivered. It was on George VII that Lawrence had his fatal accident on May 13, 1935.

The 1934 model was known as the Alpine Grand Sport or the "Two-of- Everything. It was the last, and the most powerful, J.A.P. Brough Superior SS-100 built. It featured an 8/75 (seventy-five horsepower) overhead valve engine with two magnetos and two oil pumps. Only six Two-of-Everything machines were built, mostly as racers. The other A.G.S.(touring) model was ordered by T.E. Lawrence."

-- Andy (andy_rowland@msn.com), November 28, 1998.

Hallyx flames... 8-)

-- Kevin (mixesmusic@worldnet.att.net), November 28, 1998.

I'm not fond of the terms "herd" or "herd mentality" either, howeber,...the first time I ever "heard" of either was in a book either by Victor Frankl or Eric Fromm,...both who wrote extensively on tendencies in human behavior. Then there was my dad who waxed philosophical often on how he learned about humans when he was a kid herding sheep. I think sometimes each and every one of us might take exception to the terms, especially when we're not clear on when we become conformists, or the go-along-to-get-along types. There is never a mirror handy when we need one. :-)

Hey, Unc,...save me a beer.

-- Donna Barthuley (moment@pacbell.net), November 28, 1998.

We have to be careful about this "we get it - but the HERD doesn't" mentality. Everybody is unbelievably skeptical about EVERTHING EXCEPT what hits their own emotional buttons, then all the skepticism is right out the window.

Remember the Heaven's Gate folks thought they "got it" when the herd was missing the chance to hitch a ride on that comet (and leave all this y2k madness behind).

-RC

"The second amendment is no more about duck hunting than the first is about Scrabble" - John Ross

-- Runway Cat (runway_cat@hotmail.com), November 28, 1998.

The difference is that THOSE people were crazy, however, WE the Y2K aware, are the canaries dropping dead in the mineshaft.

(Is it just me, or is it getting hard to breathe in here?)

-- Uncle Deedah (oncebitten@twiceshy.com), November 28, 1998.

So hard not to develop a closed system thought process..."Us against them". However, that mindset has been the cause of all humans problems on our lovely planet...and (as Heinlein syas) "if this goes on"...post Y2K rebuilding is but a vaporous chimeral dream We all inhabit this Lifeboat Earth...soil not thy nest or bite thy littermates...

Deedah...fly little bird...you can see the light at the top of the tunnel.

Dang! See what happens to me on a rainy day in S. California where it never rains?

-- Donna Barthuley (moment@pacbell.net), November 28, 1998.

As for Rush's perspective on Y2K, he believes it's a doomsayer- pessimist thing. First of all he's a Mac user (as am I) so he doesn't see the problem.

INVAR,

That about sums up Rush Lamebrain. He doesn't know shit. The slob never did an ounce of research in his life. He is nothing but Hot Air.

-- Anti-chainsaw (Tree@hugger.com), November 28, 1998.

* Again, it's evident that "they" plan on thinning the herd a little. What other conclusion can you come to that makes any sense? *

Several years ago, the Wall St Journal. had an article about a Scandinavian "philosopher" (Didn't know they still existed). He proposed that the human herd had to be severely reducted, whether by war, pestilence, starvation or other neat methods. He did not voluteer to be the first. Does anyone know hoo he is? His qualifications, premise or delusions?

Is the herd so clueless because they are on drugs, legal or illegal?

Does our prez grease cigars because he knows it's all over, and should we do the same?

-- fly . (.@...), November 28, 1998.

How about everyone offering a definition of themselves separate from Y2K denial....How are you not herd-ish in your daily life?

That or start talking about "Y2K Denial Herd" or TEOTWAWKI Denial Herd"

-- Donna Barthuley (moment@pacbell.net), November 28, 1998.

Paul Davis,

Per your reply; Agreed.

Anti-Chainsaw; You obviously never listened to Limbaugh in your life. But coming from your alias I can understand why you're such an idiot to make assumptions. By the way, I plan to KILL lots of trees for my Y2K homestead, burn lots of them for heat and cooking. Yes, alot of lovely beautiful trees will be sacrificed for my shelter, my fire and my tools.

I will bet that you will drop your nonsensical environmental ideology the moment power's out, you are freezing and there's no way to warm yourself. If you don't...then you'll die. Simple.

We'll see whether the population that will turn to nature for it's survival post Y2K will replant the trees they harvest as the timber industry does today.

Ahhh the sound of a fallen oak tree....more fuel for the fire, more toothpicks for the venison jerky.

-- INVAR (gundark@aol.com), November 28, 1998.

Donna, I don't know about coming up with a definition, but I will supply a very real life example. As I am sure we all can relate to, Y2K awareness has certainly changed my life, so perhaps that is why I am ever examining "the herd" (for lack of a better description) in a Y2K context.

Earlier this evening, I went to the local McDonalds for din-din. It was an interesting scene. Behind the counter, they were having problems: two employees were not seeing eye-to-eye on something, and this was having a definite affect on food production. The manager was zipping up and down and all around, politely telling his people Can't We All Just Get Along, and at the same time apologizing profusely and telling those on the other side of the counter, Just a Few More Minutes Folks, We're Doing Our Very Best.

The herd was very unhappy with this. Exasperation. Looks of disappointment, head shaking, milling, sighing, muttering. Meanwhile, as I took all this in, I noted all the usual gimicky deals that were advertised -- you know, buy a Biggie Whatever and you can get another Big Biggie for only fifty cents more, etc., etc.

I thought of how things changed back in the 1970s when gas became scarce. Suddenly, the gas pumpers no longer had to sing and dance for their business. They could become quite choosey on when they wanted to open, how much gas they would sell you, along with a surly attitude. (I remember reading about lady who managed to get a fill-up when everyone else was limited to only a couple of gallons. But, she had to get two fill-ups, if you catch my drift.) And of course, if you actually knew someone in the gas pumping biz, and perhaps were even friends, well lucky you.

With Y2K, the day may cometh such that it will be the people on my side of the counter who will be apologizing, explaining, excusing, wishing to please. And the people on the other side will be like gods.

-- Jack (jsprat@eld.net), November 28, 1998.

I think to crow about how you are different from the "herd" without some sort of external validation, it doesn't quite work. If you just "think" you are different from the "herd" there is no way to be sure you really are.

The only validation I have in my life that I was "different" from everyone else was that at my high school graduation, the vice-principal walked up to me and said "Well guess I can tell you know, God am I glad to see you leaving" When I asked him why that was, although I had a pretty good idea, he replied "Because no one is quite as loud as you in questioning us"

That would be the one time I think I can point to that says I was different. Most of my difference came from the fact that I realized, the school really has no power to dictate some of the rules they do, such as no swearing or if your shirt could advertise alcohol, to name a few. For a long time in high school I wore a button that said "Plea$e $ave Oral Robert$"(this was during his "I'm being called home" phase). Several students took offense at it and reported me to the school. The school staff WANTED to punish me, but I informed them it was within my right to free speech...they backed down. From that point on I was hell on wheels:)

Rick

-- Rick Tansun (ricktansun@hotmail.com), November 29, 1998.

INVAR,

Why don't you just invite Rush over? The hot air he blows will keep you warm for a thousand years. hahaha

-- Anti-chainsaw (Tree@hugger.com), November 29, 1998.

INVAR, I suggest you dont plan to clear cut those trees, or your nonsensical environmental ideology will drop you the moment the power's out and a good rain storm hits.

Rick, I think my High School was glad to see me go too. I was one of four student organizers for the first High School strike ever, when we entered Cambodia during the Vietnam war. It was a very peace-filled demonstration, even though the local police cars had all their windows duct taped. Went around collecting community signatures on a petition too, and sent it to Washington. Much later, got an M.B.A., go figure. Now I balance metaphysics with living in the real/unreal world. And actually, worldwide, thats not so different, just unusual for some, standard practice for others.

Diane

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), November 29, 1998.

And the Communists are still in Vietnam and Cambodia.

And now 1600 Penn Ave; own CNN; and CBS, ABC, and NBC, ....

-- Robert A. Cook, P.E. (Kennesaw, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), November 29, 1998.

WE the Y2K aware, are the canaries dropping dead in the mineshaft.

I think we're more like hawks with gas-masks, picks and shovels.

-- Richard Dale (rdale@figroup.co.uk), November 30, 1998.

...even though the local police cars had all their windows duct taped.

Does everyone use this duck tape stuff, anyone use it on ducks to keep their traps (beaks) shut, noisy creatures.

-- Richard Dale (rdale@figroup.co.uk), November 30, 1998.

Richard, your British wit, is needed down here. Come to think of it, up there also. Keep up the good work. Charon.

-- Charon (Thatplce@below.com), November 30, 1998.

Charon, the mind boggles about the location of "that place below", are you an inspector of non-compliant oil rigs, are you a troglodite, a potholer, a corporation sewer inspector (I hope not!), maintenance crew on the "Chunnel" or more sinisterly from the ultimate place down below surfacing only in people's psyches and now the internet, with the emphasis on the "inter".

-- Richard Dale (rdale@figroup.co.uk), November 30, 1998.

Rick.........

Could it also be said that Mr. Roberts' administrative assistants are

Oral secs??

-- Craig (craig@ccinet.ab.ca), November 30, 1998.

Richard, I am a poor imitator of your last and most accurate sentence! Though being in SW Fla., USA , in July, even I get, shall we say "Flamed". Is it possible for the potential shades up above, to consider the alternative to preparing? Would an old fashioned "pitch fork" stimulate movement? I so appreciate the enormous effort put forth by Milne, and the sparks he causes to fly. My neighbor, up in Ga., R. Cook, has the mental capacity to challenge even you, Richard. There are also so many others, that I fear to name, who have put the phrase: "Cognito ergo sum" into superior use here on this forum, that I , hesitate, to add my inferior contribution. But know that I , Charon, wait with baited (hot) breath.

-- Charon (Thatplce@below.com), November 30, 1998.

"But know that I , Charon, wait with baited (hot) breath."

Pause for "Carry On" thoughts to enter cranium...

"You can join my herd anytime (fnar fnar!)"

-- Andy (andy_rowland@msn.com), November 30, 1998.

Charon

Has the price of the boat ride gone up yet? How's your doggy? Is he still the Manny, Moe, and Jack of the K-9 world?

-- Uncle Deedah (oncebitten@twiceshy.com), November 30, 1998.

Charon row the boat ashore....

I'm betting it ain't anything like anybody thinks it is...I am not afeared!

Is there a bar with beer on tap on that boat?

-- Donna Barthuley (moment@pacbell.net), November 30, 1998.

Charon -

It's "bated", old son, not "baited." As in "reduced" or "held". As in "Holding one's breath while waiting for the event in question."

I'm surprised that "Gayla the Grammar Hammer" didn't smacked your knuckles with a ruler. Be forewarned.

Yours for a more literate millennium,

Mac

-- Mac (sneak@lurk.com), November 30, 1998.

Mac, I've reformed! Really! (Except for Infomagic's deers- but like Rob, I sometimes get weak!!!) :-)

-- Gayla Dunbar (privacy@please.com), November 30, 1998.

"Gayla the Grammar Hammer" - good, good, I like it.

"Hallyx the Gramma Mamma" too?

-- Robert A. Cook, P.E. (Kennesaw, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), November 30, 1998.

Mac..how wonderful...I see you took the hook! Lovely Donna ... I only have a little "Dingy" My one and only Uncle...just a penny on each lid. Funny you should ask about Cerberus. since Y2k he just stares and stares and stares. Andy..join your herd of "Sheeple"? Do you supply restraining boots?

-- Charon (Thatplce@below.com), November 30, 1998.

R. Cook, has the mental capacity to challenge even you, Richard.

Yes and surpass usually.

Thanks for the compliment, you know how vain I am.

-- Richard Dale (rdale@figroup.co.uk), December 01, 1998.