Is Your Church Preparing?greenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread
A few have posted, on various discussion pages here, about their churches making Y2K preparations. I would like to request that any churches, temples, mosques, etc., that are doing the same, would post what you are doing to prepare. If you don't want to include the name and exact location, perhaps you would say what city, or state your place of worship is located. I hope that some from Great Britain, New Zealand, Australia, and Canada, who have contributed posts, will also say their churches, etc., are preparing. I am just beginning to "get a foot in the door" at my place of worship. If I could have a printout of this page, in a month or so, that shows a number of "religious" communities are taking Y2K seriously, it would be helpful to convince my spiritual leaders--maybe yours, too! Thank you!
-- Holly Allen (Holly3325@juno.com), August 31, 1998
I have read two "statements" from churches (hardcopy, received from friends); I am on our church's study commission and we hope to formulate a statement soon. Of course, one of the dangers churches see is that their statements are seen as prophetical by outsiders, and obviously there is no common answer on how to address Y2K.
-- Ron Southwick (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 01, 1998.
I belong to a small rural church. I began by bringing the problem to the attention of the pastor. He let me address the congregation. From that point, we have been providing basic literature..... center fold handouts in the program .... every Sunday.
Our first focus is individual preparation. The individual who is prepared is part of the solution, not the problem, and vice versa. We realize that some won't be able to lay aside what's needed, and we realize that our community is larger than our congregation.
Recently we've formed a committee to address the church's response. We're addressing:
1. Emergency response service and backup communications 2. Use of the church as an emergency housing area (requires generator, food storage, water, etc.) 3. Networking, so that the needs of anyone in the community can be met from common resources. This includes emergency food, water, heat, and other basics, and it includes long term recovery. Some have dairy farms......can they provide milk? Do they have separators? Power? (most have PTO driven generators) Where can we get eggs? Beef, lamb chops, etc. Who are the major vegetable growers nearby, and can they supply locally when their crops come in. 4. Establishing community bulk food buying (grains, honey, etc.) through local feed stores. 5. Water distribution to those with wells, but without power. 6. Beginning dialogues with county officials (who are blissfully unaware, in spite of letters).
We realize that we're in an area that relies on 3rd hand power....our company buys and resells, they don't generate. Because our population density is low, we realize that we may be considered expendible if there are major shutdowns in our region. So, we're planning on not having power for a while.
Interesting that the first 3 committee members were the only 3 engineers in the congregation.
We're just begining. I pray that we have enought time.
-- rocky (email@example.com), September 01, 1998.
We aren't preparing, but I had thought about it and it occurs to me that there are lots of churches in our area and that if each church could take responsibility for one area, it would break up the workload and give everyone a chance to contribute. For example, I go to a small church, so perhaps we could focus on water and coffee. A larger church could operate a soup kitchen. A church with generators could provide shelter to the frail, etc. I think this is the advantage of getting everyone on board.
-- Amy Leone (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 01, 1998.
No way. My church of 2200 members is preparing for a new 16 million $ building.
Capital Stewardship Program takes precedence over everything it seems, even visitation.
All leadership is blind to the y2k scene, deaf too.
Pray for us.
-- macajah (email@example.com), September 01, 1998.
Jack Van Impe of TBN is going to do a 1/2 hour show on sept. 14, 10p.m. PST. He is someone I would trust has having good information.
-- Vic (Light_servant@yahoo.com), September 01, 1998.
Hot off the press is our commission's "recommendation" to the church Elders. [Please forgive the length...I copied it for simplicty.] We are a church of about 600 in Central New York.
Another site to visit to get ideas and encouragement is:
Unifying and Preparing Your Church for the Year 2000 http://www.y2kchaos.com/s35p84.htm
Elder's Report: Study Commission on Y2K
September 1, 1998
Preamble: The problem of the computer dating system is a real one. It will pose some problem because of the sheer numbers of data lines that must be fixed, because of the integration of so many systems world wide and because of the fear and insecurity that most people live in.
We believe it is incumbent upon the church leadership to give guidance and perspective to its people because it is becoming a widely discussed topic and because it has the potential of changing our lives as we it today.
Our Approach: The problem is generally understood and accepted by those who do the research but the implications of the problem are widely debated. There is everything from a slight blimp to our lives to long-term, mass chaos. Christians range from seeing this as the judgment of God on a wicked nation and world to a great evangelistic opportunity to, "Hey, whatms all the fuss about!"
We believe we must provide information for wise decision-making. That includes understanding the technical problem, outlining potential implications and providing options for preparing for accepted implications. Each person must have the freedom without condemnation to prepare to whatever levels their conviction leads them to.
Overall, our recommendations will lead us to encourage a SIMPLIFIED life-style. A life-style that moves towards reduced debt, decreasing dependence on modern conveniences and an increase in relational activities. Preparations will be encouraged that enable families to live on less with less as a move toward clearing our lives of things that distract us from God's invitation to join Him in His work. In the process we will be also preparing for any crisis: Y2K, economic downturns, persecution or even small events like major snowstorms. In the event that Y2K does NOT fulfill its chaotic potential we have at worst, saved some money, grown in our relationship with the Lord, built on our family relationships and gained confidence in handling the always-present insecurities of the future.
The recommended timeline: Sunday AM service (As early as September, preferably): *Message calling us to be prepared for action; be self-controlled and set our hope fully on the grace given when Jesus Christ is revealed in 1 Peter 1:13 *This calls us to be holy, to love deeply, to declare His glory, to Submit. *This gives opportunity to briefly explain the current concerns, relate them to God's call on our lives and then invite people to an educational meeting regarding Y2K for the purpose of preparing to live godly lives in the midst of uncertainty. Educational meeting (Held shortly after the Sunday AM): *This is an open meeting. Unsaved neighbors and friends can be invited with a hope to educate them on Y2K and give them the gospel in related terms. *Here we present the problem in greater depth, the various potential implications. This education is so they can come to grips with their level of response. In no way are we working towards mandating an action. Opinions will be expressed but levels of uncertainty to the implications are too great to be definitive. *A list of resources and options for preparedness will be available. *The option of further meetings will be given for more education or for help in preparations in various areas including water gathering/purifying systems, canning, food storage, financial concerns etc. (These will presented as ways to prepare to the level of their conviction, not mandated.) Other Churches: We believe someone (Assistant Pastor?) should be commissioned to personally talk with other pastors to invite them to share in the process. We could bring a meeting to them or they could join us. Etc. Government: We recommend that we begin discussions with the mayor's office regarding their preparations. How can we work together? We want to be positioned to be a part of the solution if crisis develops.
-- Ron Southwick (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 01, 1998.
If your church gets a program together, do you have facilities to store your supplies? Do you have facilities and medical personnel to house the elderly and homeless? What will be your legal and moral obligation to take people in and who not to take in. At what point will your supplies run out and what contingency plan will take place? What about civil unrest and how many congregation members would participate in keeping a crowd in check? How many members would be willing to leave their families at home while they do a night shift watch? What would be the cost to every church member to feed, clothe, and shelter people? At Thanksgiving I always see the soup lines on the news and people lined up for blocks to get a meal. Last year they were pleading with people to donate food because they did not have enough to feed everyone. There's 16 months left, maybe less. It's been my experience when working with these types of scenarios, the biggest obstacle was getting people to do their part and what the financial cost would be.
-- Bardou (email@example.com), September 02, 1998.
Even promoting awareness is expensive, in that you have to pay to get newsletters reproduced. I think awareness is the first step that everyone should try for. Keep in mind that once we were made aware, we made our own preparations. An ounce of prevention may be worth a pound of cure here.
-- Amy Leone (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 02, 1998.
Great questions, Bardou. Can't be answered, so let's just all quit and lie down.
Or huddle in lonliness, doing nothing to be a part of any solution.
-- lurker (email@example.com), September 02, 1998.
I wouldn't lie down and call it quits. However, when you take on such a big undertaking as what is being suggested, the planning and implementation is going to take more than 16 months. Just for my family alone, it has taken me several months to store water, food, clothing, supplies, and the list goes on. If you are talking about taking care of a community of people who have not prepared for anything due to lack of knowledge or finances, then if the church wants to take the burden upon themselves to do it, the biggest factor that weighs heavily upon the congregation will be money and facilities. Take at peek back at all the natural disasters and how even FEMA couldn't be all things to all people. A few supplies trickle in but after a few days your on your own. You can make the public aware, but not everyone listens until it's too late. I suggest people take care of their own family first and if there's anything left donate what you can. By the way, I saw first hand how the Red Cross handled emergency shelters here in California when we had severe flooding. The cops were on sight 24-hours a day. There were drunks, sick adults and children, cramped sleeping quarters, toilets over flowing, crap smeared on walls, vomit on floors, drug use, people angry because they didn't like the food that was served. This is only a minor list of the problems associated with taking care of other people. And, as a volunteer, these people acted like you were there to wait on them hand and foot. I had my eyes opened then, and no thank you, I won't be doing it again!
-- Bardou (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 02, 1998.
I work in an area where I watch world events. the likely severity of the y2k problem became clear to me months ago. I belong to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (Mormons). We believe in self-reliance and in modern day prophecy from God. We believe our leaders from the prophet on down to local Bishops receive inspiration from God an warnings. Last Sunday our Bishop said he has felt the need to re-enforce physical and spiritual preparation to the members. I'm finding this is church wide. The Mormons are moving into high gear.
I,m sure any congragation could contact the local LDS church and receive help with plans for preparation. All are welcome individuals too.
-- tj (email@example.com), September 02, 1998.
Just out of curiosity, are LDS churches prepared to open it's doors to the community with help if and when the time comes? That is, does the LDS church have a storage of food, water and clothing to hand out to those in need? I believe people on this forum are aware of what it takes to get prepared, and there are other sights on the Internet that have a tremendous amount of information on emergency prepardness. If your church in fact has a storehouse of supplies and a place to house people, please share how it's organized, the cost, etc.
-- Bardou (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 02, 1998.
We're looking at this in two ways: Prepare our Families, and Prepare for those who don't prepare.
We're doing obvious things like making sure our well continues to operate, having 55 gal drums for those who don't have wells, storing food and medical supplies, cutting firewood and seasoning it on our property, things like that.
We've sent out a 5 minute survey asking who has CB's, ham radios, pickup trucks, chainsaws, wells, emergency medical training, etc.
We have meetings every two weeks to check in on each other and see how everyone is doing. This really helps keep the momentum going and we can encourage one another. (We all need encouragement, especially those who family members think they're nuts.)
The main thing we stress, however, is that God knows what's going on and will give wisdom to anyone who asks for it. It has certainly helped the prayer life of our church. :)
Blessings to all!
Y2K: Preparing for the Year 2000
-- Pastor Chris (email@example.com), September 03, 1998.
Welcome back Pastor Chris! We missed you! :)
-- Gayla Dunbar (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 03, 1998.
I really appreciate all the info coming in; please continue! This is very helpful! Thank you all!
-- Holly Allen (Holly3325@juno.com), September 03, 1998.
I have been warning and educating over 100 churches in northern california as well as hundreds of christian groups since over a year ago. More and more people are seriously preparing. I have been mailing out an open letter to churches. I have been teaching y2k seminars for churches and other groups. Thank God almost all left persuaded of the gravity of this crises. My new y2k website is www.geocities.com/HotSprings/villa/3388 (still under construction). I just hope I have the time and computer skills to make it more professional and update it.Hope to post my newest article 22 questions for the millenium bug skeptic.Glad to see so many of you are doing what you can! I wish to make time to communicate with more of you like pastor chris.Y2k may well be a blessing in disguise.May many turn from things and technology to God , family and friends!
-- Pastor Ray (email@example.com), September 04, 1998.
Here's an informative site a helpful lady sent directly by Email www.josephproject2000.org
-- Holly Allen (Holly3325@juno.com), September 04, 1998.
I have taken the approach of visiting my members in my church in South Jersey. Most are listening to me as they enter the awareness stage. I have identified members with 'means' that I have spent additional time with to help them turn the corner. My biggest problem is that in this rural community most of my members are not on the internet. I am recommending Michael Hyatt's book to them to read.
The CBN special on the 'church and y2k' inspired me to fast and pray for three days seeking God's will. He impressed me to stay where I am rather than head for the mountains. The Lord has many people who can't relocate and will need my ministry. So I will "Trust in the Lord with all my heart and lean not unto my own understanding and look to Him to direct my paths." Prov.3:6. I also like Nahum 1:7.
This Saturday I will conduct a one hour workshop on y2k on the beach in North Wildwood at a Christian Festival. Pray for me.
My plan is to set my church up with propane, a wood stove, and extra food. I have a member who can dig a shallow well if needbe.
My next step is to inform my ministerium which is clueless. They don't know how to take my warnings. They have agreed to come to a ministerial workshop I will schedule for them soon.
I also plan to use my own money to advertise to the community a y2k meeting at the community firehall to see how many in my area get it.
My aim is to help people to prepare so they will not be part of the problem and be in a position to help others.
God bless, Bob
-- Robert Brown (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 06, 1998.
A gentleman who does survival seminars around the area is going to be teaching 400 members of a church near here. The minister told his people to prepare "like the mormons prepare", so they are trying to do what they can to become self-sufficient. Many people in my area at church are becoming aware that this is NOT about their desktop computer!
-- Laurane (email@example.com), September 06, 1998.
Since I have been telling people about y2k and what to prepare, I have found that while most will eventually believe, they will also procrastinate .Many do not wish to commit the money to buy stuff they may get stuck with. In my seminars, I tell them to at least get the 5 gallon water containers and freeze-dried or whatever food ready.There is a 20% chance a bank run may begin by year end. I have information that indicate a tidal wave of recession and/ or another big stock market plunge may hit our coast in the next few months, even weeks. We are going down with or without y2k! consult a proffessional about getting some gold and silver coins. Camino coins in Burlingame, ca. has a y2k survival coin package, one is recommended by congressman Ron Paul.I have nothing to do with the co. and I do not get commission from it. My web site has more articles and info.now. http://www.geocities.com/Hotsprings/villa/3388. It will have three sections- y2k, alternative medicine and market warning and many y2k links. I will soon post my comprehensive y2k shopping list( including nutritional supplements) and my newest article "22 questions for the millenium Bug skeptic" Since I am also a nutritional consultant, I can tell you that if you take the right supplements, you can probably survive with less food. Hope the info. will help more people. God bless you all!
-- Pastor Ray (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 06, 1998.
I don't know the prices for the y2k pak from Camino Coins so I don't know how good they are. The other "paks" I've seen advertised were *way* overpriced. For modern 1 troy oz gold bullion coins like American Eagles, Canadian Maple Leafs and Austrian Philharmonics the going rate is about $15 over spot. Krugerands sell for a bit less. For silver, Eagles are about $1.25 to $1.50 over spot and Leafs are $.50 to $1.00 over spot. These prices assume quantity (10 or more for gold and 20 or more for silver) and older dates of the dealer's choice. Spot prices change daily, of course and are available at www.kitco.com among others. Kitco's silver spot sometimes gets, umm, "creative" at times so double check. The dealer should know the spot. Also, don't fall for the collector or numismatic coin sales pitch if you want the most metal for your money. Usually they spring the government confiscation ploy to get you to pay the high premiums associated with numismatic coins. If you don't know coin grading...STAY AWAY. One exception to this is common date Peace silver dollars and Franklin halves in VF (very fine) to AU (almost uncirculated) condition. There's still a high 40%-60% premium over spot but that's a lot less than the others. Also, fractional gold coins in 1/2, 1/4 and 1/10 troy oz carry a stiff markup over the 1 oz size. Pick up a copy of CoinAge magazine to get phone numbers of dealers and look for the ads that carry the ANA or PGCS logo to help identify good dealers. I've bought from several including Ramapo and Monex and been very satisfied but a trial run with a small purchase might be wise with anyone you've not dealt with before. With the metals markets as depressed as they are, however, I suspect most of the scam artists left for greener pastures some time ago. Also, few dealers accept credit cards for the modern bullion coins so be prepared to wait a good three to four weeks for check clearing and delivery. Hope this helps!
-- anon (email@example.com), September 07, 1998.
Can't really say that I attend church as I once did, though I still firmly believe the Bible cover to cover, and always will. So I can't say what 'my' church is doing...but here are some good verses to use in the universal Y2K fight...
(Billy Graham's son Franklin is coming to our town Sept. 17 for several days of crusade; please pray for a renewal in our community)
"A prudent man sees danger and hides himself; but the simple go on, and suffer for it." -- Prov. 22:3 (RSV)
"If the trumpet give an uncertain sound, who shall prepare himself to the battle?" -- 1 Cor. 14:8 (KJV)
"Son of man, I have made thee a watchman unto the house of Israel: therefore hear the word at my mouth, and give them warning from me." -- Ezek. 3:17 (KJV)
"Ye can discern the face of the sky; but can ye not discern the signs of the times? -- Matt. 16:3 (KJV) Jesus said that
And this isn't a Bible verse, but it's an absolute truth: Noah didn't wait to see rain before beginning construction on the ark.
-- John Howard (firstname.lastname@example.org), September 10, 1998.
Remember the parable about the virgins awaiting the bridegroom? (He was late, by the way. At least Y2K will be on time.) The "foolish" ones had no spare oil, were left in the dark, and missed the feast when they went to buy more.
Pastor C. Will you get hold of me please?
-- Robert A. Cook, P.E. (email@example.com), September 10, 1998.