I my first posting, I asked if anyone had considered forming a Band of professional people that would work together to insure each others safty. I feel I should elaberate a bit more as to why I made this first posting. My girlfriend and I live in San Diego,C.A., and while it is not L.A. (Hell. A.) I am very concerned for our saftey. the area we live in is quiet, however; it seem to be anisland in a sea of crime. We are often awakened in the night by Police helicopers looking for some crimal running lose near by. With this in mind, I am sure you can imagine what could happen if the police were unable to patrol this area due to greater need elsewhere, say perhaps a riot a few blocks away. Lets face it if the power grid, and water company goes down then any major city has the possibility of becoming a war zone. It my sound crazy, but look at what happen over Rodney King. For those of you whom my have forgotten, or have lived under a rock. Mr. KIng was the victim of police brutality. His beating was tapedand broadcast to the nation, and the officers involed were aquitted, thus riots broke out in L.a. and some other citys arcoss the country. Now if people are willing to create havoc over the injustice done to some one else, then what will prevent this from happening when food stores begin run low( note: At any given time most supermarkets have only three days worth of food, and that is with power to keep items cold) So, with this in mind I would like to form a group of people who are willing help each other to survive outside the major citys, and if need be form small communitys that will be selfsufficient. The kind of person that I would like to hear from will have simular Ideas, rather than try and blame me for the next civil war(e.g. Scott) If you have any ideas on what I can do ,or whom I can contact please e-mail me Kelly P.S. Please include you e-mail Adress at the end.

-- Kelly (panther19@earthlink.net), August 29, 1998

Answers

You might want to check out this group. They're based in San Diego CONNIRY'S NATIVE SKILLS & WINDERNESS SCHOOL. - Y2K Preparedness & Survival Workshops - City and Urban Survival Workshop Provided to local cities at no charge to residents. Individual workshops are pretty inexpensive. http://members.home.net/shadow-scout/fourth.html#top

This might be a good way to meet like-minded people in your area.

This course, like all those taught at the Wilderness School, is "hands-on." The basic survival techniques, presented in the "sacred order" of shelter, water, fire and food are the same in any environment whether it is in a wilderness setting or in a downtown city.

By adapting wilderness skills, utilizing resources in a person's immediate environment, and through the application of survival priorities, this course provides techniques that could save lives in the event of a natural or man-made disaster. You will learn to create a safe haven at home, office, school or vehicle - anywhere - any environment.

-- Cheryl (Quest@hypercon.com), August 29, 1998.

Oh, so you too are a domestic terrorist/ militiaperson/ survivalist wacko, eh?

And you're RECRUITING OTHERS to JOIN YOUR ORGANIZATION using the INTERNET?

Please wait where you are. A federal officer will be in to see you shortly. Thank you for your cooperation.

Fed

================================================ The Straits Times AUG 27 1998

Paranoia at millennium worries US ------------------------------------------------------------------------ With just 500 days to the year 2000, law-enforcement officials are getting ready to deal with domestic terrorism from those with an apocalyptic vision

PUYALLUP (Washington) -- United States lawenforcement officials are worried that paranoia about the millennium could lead to clashes between the government and domestic terrorist groups.

Fewer than 500 days remain before the year 2000.

"I worry every day that something could happen somewhere," said Mr Robert Blitzer, section chief of the FBI's domestic-terrorism unit.

Recent attacks on US embassies in Africa have raised concerns about foreign terrorism, but the potential for violence from within the US has also increased.

Mr Blitzer said that, at any given time, his agents were working on nearly 1,000 cases of potential domestic-terrorist activity, a workload which has grown as the end of the century nears.

The cases range from a single threatening letter mailed to Washington to the unsolved theft this summer of 25 tonnes of ammonium nitrate from a West Virginia farm-supply business.

The amount of stolen fertiliser is more than 12 times the quantity used in the bombing of the federal building in Oklahoma City in 1995 in which 168 died.

Federal officials have begun working with local police agencies to investigate terrorist activity.

"As we get closer to 2000, we'll probably see more people coming out of the woodwork," Mr Blitzer said.

"Some of these groups have an apocalyptic vision, and they may go violent."

Many have already come out of the shadows.

At a three-day "Preparedness Expo" here to plan for the expected clashes, conventioneers sold books and pamphlets, hawked camping equipment and survivalist gear and offered cans of ammunition, hunting knives and the newest rage -- blowguns that fire poisoned darts.

They say it represents the basic necessities for outlasting the millennium, when many believe the government will attack US citizens.

Others predict that 2000 will see the takeover of the US by a "new world order" of foreign despots.

Still others claim that the projected Y2K, or Year 2000, computer bug is government hokum to enslave the people. -- Los Angeles Times

------------------------------------------------------------------------ Copyright ) 1998 Singapore Press Holdings Ltd. All rights reserved. ==================================================

-- Fed (fed@paranoid.gov), August 29, 1998.

I tend to agree with the FBI guy in that 1/1/00 will be a very vulnerable time everywhere. A cool, calculated terrorist such as the freak of the week in the Middle East or you local militia-McViegh character will no doubt take advantage of that vulnerability.

-- St. Paul (slick@huchemama.com), August 29, 1998.

Well I can see from the resonce that I recieve each time I ask for help that someone inevitably labels me as a terorist,militia whatabe,or what have you. I find this confirming my belief that people will argue, fight, etc, over anything. which is why I do not feel safe in large populated areas (e.g. citys) for those of you whom have offered advice, thank you, and I look foward to your next e-mail. For those of you whom have found me an easy target I wish you all the best of luck, you're going to need it if you feel that the Federal government(AKA big brother)will save you. Kelly

-- Kelly (panther19@earthlink.net), August 30, 1998.

I spent nine hours on Saturday at the Preparedness Expo at the Puyallup Fairgrounds. The newspaper reporter (typically) covered only a very, very small aspect of the presentation...the "sensationalist" type of journalism that causes unnecessary fear. The "militia-type" was represented, but only in a very small part. I'm a great granny and was glad I went! The vendors were kind, helpful people displaying everything from Bibles to water-filtration systems, propane stoves, food storage packages, precious metals investments, army surplus items--things to help us during Y2K shortages, or any such emergency. I was surprised at how many people (friendly, too) were there. At 5:00, a panel presented a one and a half hour program to an audience of probably 1,000 people. That alone was worth the time I spent, and my tired feet!. These Expos are being presented in various locations--last June it was in Atlanta. I received a free tape from that one, as well as several copies of the 47-page August issue of their magazine "Y2KCPR" Those participating in these panels include Ed Yourdon, Tony Keys, Craig Smith, Karen Anderson, Mike Hyatt, Ken Klein, Jim Lord, Paloma O'Riley, and various others. Sure, they might make some money--at least expenses--from these Expos. But I get the impression they are men and women of integrity, trying very hard to help us in every way they can! You can call 1-888-289-2646 and get one free copy of the Atlanta tape, and of the magazine. These are two of the best helps available! We must be willing to prepare, AS COMMUNITIES, to help each other, and to not listen to the scare mongers!

-- Holly Allen (Holly3325@juno.com), August 30, 1998.

I know what you mean Kelly. My kids come to fisticuffs over a plastic replica of spiderman. Adults are pretty well behaved as long as their basic needs are being met. However, given the popularity of pro wrestling, I think that something lies beneath the surface of most adults and it wouldn't take much to bring it out.

Last I heard the utilities in my state had finished assessment, knew what needed replacing, and thought they would be done with the important stuff by next summer. The sense I got was that they were very suprised to find that this affected them but they intended to remedy it. You have to remember it was just a couple months ago that the NERC started breathing down everyone's neck. Up until then, nobody was looking into it. Hang tight, it's not over yet.

-- Amy Leone (aleone@amp.com), August 31, 1998.

IN RE: Kelly's comment, I was not blaming Kelly for starting the next Civil War. I was merely pointing out that preparations need to be on a community level, not through Balkanized militia-like groups. I may have misunderstood her original posting, and for that I apologize. I adamantly believe that forming "units" will in the long run only contribute to the pack mentality that Kelly so accurately described vis-a-vis Rodney King. I know it's difficult to get the general public to pay attention to the Y2K threat, but if we intend to stay civilized, I believe we need to try to anticipate this together. I welcome any comments via e-mail.

scott

-- Scott Albert (scojo@yahoo.com), September 02, 1998.

I live in a small (50,000) city in the Midwest. People here are mostly good, and helpful. A couple of years back we had - what should I call it? - "a disturbance." Some young people in the University area (don't want to call them students) decided to go on a rampage. By the time it was over, they had vandalized and looted many homes and businesses. It wasn't brought under control until they got to Main Street, which is about 8 or 10 blocks from the original source. These people weren't cold or hungry, they were just out to cause trouble. And it wasn't just a couple of kids out raising hell, either - this was a mob. I'm still not sure of their motives. The real problem is that the local law enforcement was caught totally off-guard. I can't blame them for that, since there was no reason to expect that this would happen. We can only hope that the City and County are taking the possibility of Y2K related violence seriously. I have no desire to live in a police state, but we do pay the Police salaries to have them protect us from crime. If any of you think that riots only happen in big cities, you're wrong. This happened in a town where the biggest news is usually something about domestic violence or a big fire. It scares me to think how fine the line is between civilization and anarchy.

If I read this right, what you're talking about is something akin to the neighborhood watch, or MADD. I haven't heard anyone calling those organizations "militia." I understand your fear of what might happen. It may be tough to find a group of people to co-operate in an effort to survive outside the city. If you are serious about getting out of your neighborhood, perhaps moving to another area with less crime would be a possibility. Less crime there now will probably equate to less crime if TSHTF. The problem with your idea is that you're going to be hooking up with people who are currently strangers. Organization could break down pretty easily in such a situation if things get tight. I would suggest trying to set up a plan of co-operation amongst friends, neighbors, family and co-workers. (Unless you feel the need to shoot anyone who steps into your 'compound,' in which case you should buy a howitzer and be prepared to blast away. You don't have to worry about shooting me - I'm planning on staying at home. :-) )

-- Mike (gartner@execpc.com), September 07, 1998.