"Norms" of the churchgreenspun.com : LUSENET : Catholic Pages Forum : One Thread
In our parish, we currently have a pastor who tells he can do anything he wants because the "norms" of the church allow a pastor do do anything he chooses. He has applied this to changing the Liturgy, the parish council and other parish organizations, denial of sacraments on the basis of no or too little donations by the members seeking the sacraments, refusal to make visits to the sick and dying, etc. Where can I find information on the "norms" in writing or is there anything in writing? I have already researched Canon Law. Thanks for any assistance.
-- Anonymous, June 03, 1998
You say that you have researched Cannon Law. I suggest that you download the GIRM (General Instruction of the Roman Missal) from the EWTN Website
Your pastor sounds like he is in wackyland because he cannot refuse sacraments on the basis of one's donations.
I would also contact the St. Joseph Foundation they are a group of Cannon Lawyers that fight for the rights of the Laity.
Their Address is:
St. Joseph Foundation 11107 Wurzbach, suite 601B San Antonio, TX 78230-2570
-- Anonymous, June 04, 1998
Mr. Gibson, Thank you for the info on the St. Joseph Foundation as well as the EWTN website address. All help is appreciated because if this pastor stays, we won't have a congregation left--they are all leaving. Joan S. Earnshaw email@example.com
-- Anonymous, June 04, 1998
If you read the Constitution on The Sacred Liturgy, you can get a feel for what "Norns" are. Most of the time they do just the opposite and limit by who and under what circumstances things can be change and to what extent they can br changed. For instance Para #22 says that" No other person (other than the Apostolic See or in certain instances the Bishop) , not even if he is a priest, may on his own add, remove, or change anything in the Liturgy" Mostly it is to the Bishop that we look for he is the head of his flock and has most of the power to change or determine how things are done in his Churches. Your Priest may have the power to do things as he sees fit granted to him by your Bishop but I'll bet that there are limits as to what he may do or not do. If your priest bends the General instructions like removing all the kneelers and requires all to stand for the Consecratation then he is breaking the general norms that say that all shall kneel from the Sanctus to the end of Communion. If you are sure that this is the case with first hand knowledge then you should point out this in the documents to him, if that does not do any good then talk with the Bishop. If what you say is true about the Sacraments and you have first hand knowledge of this then point out canon 843 and then to the Bishop. In our parish, we currently have a pastor who tells he can do anything he wants because the "norms" of the church allow a pastor do do anything he chooses. He has applied this to changing the Liturgy, the parish council and other parish organizations, denial of sacraments on the basis of no or too little donations by the members seeking the sacraments, refusal to make visits to the sick and dying, etc. Where can I find information on the "norms" in writing or is there anything in writing? I have already researched Canon Law. Thanks for any assistance.
-- Anonymous, June 05, 1998
Thank you so much for letting me know where I can find info on the norms. As far as pointing out these things to Fr. Luis, many members of the Parish have attempted to do that--the last time was at a "reconciliation" meeting that the Bishop sent one of his deacons to hold with Fr. and Parish members. Father says we are all liars, non-donating people who are not really Parish members. It is very sad and so frustrating. We are trying to hang on and praying that the Bishop will ask him to go to counselling or something! The Bishop is aware that Fr. has done things like leave out the Creed, etc. Also, no one is getting married, buried or baptised!!!! Thanks again for all info. All prayers for the Parish are very much appreciated.
-- Anonymous, June 06, 1998
Praying for you!!!!
Meantime, is there another church in the vicinity you can go to for a proper mass? Where I live, I can easily list over a dozen Catholic churches all within 1 hours drive of home and there are probably more in the phone book which I haven't visited yet. And if a significant portion of the laity goes to another parish, perhaps it would be wise to inform your Bishop of that as well.
I pray everything works out soon. (I still can't believe that's happening!)
Hang in there!
God be with you!
-- Anonymous, June 15, 1998