Pope's Head Piecegreenspun.com : LUSENET : Catholic : One Thread
What is the name of Pope John Paul's head piece?
-- Amy Campbell (AmyC@worldaccessnet.com), April 20, 1998
Pope John Paul II calls his head piece Fred.
Noooooo, I am kidding you! I just could not resist the temptation to answer it in a silly way.
The name of the head piece he wears is called a MITRE
-- Connie Ostlund (email@example.com), April 23, 1998.
And it signifies his office as Bishop of Rome. There are also other "head pieces" used by the Pope as Sucessor of Peter and head of the Universal Church. One is the Triple Crown called the Tiara another is the white Zucchetto and only the Pope's is white.
Rich Pohlman S.F.O.
-- Rich Pohlman S.F.O. (REPSFO@Prodigy.net), April 26, 1998.
My sister told me today the the Pope's head set has the numbers 666 in it. I have never heard that, is there any truth to it?
-- becky (firstname.lastname@example.org), November 07, 1998.
-- Br. Rich S.F.O. (REPSFO@Prodigy.net), November 07, 1998.
I to have heard that the head piece of the Pope has inscription inside that add up to the number 666. Could somone please tell me exactly what is in the Pope's hat ? Please describe it in detail.
-- Joy Dean (email@example.com), August 20, 2002.
There is nothing written on the various items that the pope wears on his head. Go to the archives of this forum, Joy. You'll find other threads that will give you a longer answer, debunking the 666 nonsense too. Sane people don't have time to waste on this anti-Catholic horse manure.
-- (_@_._), August 21, 2002.
i guess the mitre says 'vicarius filii dei' across the front of it meaning vicar the son of god. but the letters add up in roman numerals to 666. there is alot of facts that people link from the bible about the antichrist to the pope. it is really interesting check into it and decide what _you_ think about it.
-- sarah (firstname.lastname@example.org), October 08, 2002.
Let's say there are a lot of stupid things people want to link from the Bible to the Pope as anti- Christ. None of them are FACTS.
-- eugene c. chavez (email@example.com), October 08, 2002.
Try this http://members.aol.com/LarryPahl/666.htm
-- Bob (AmyC@worldaccessnet.com)), December 31, 2002.
Thank you for giving us the link to Larry Pahl's website. I have a little to add. Did you know that Larry is the devil? It's true. I can show that his name is a hidden reference to the devil. Here are the letters, along with the ancient Hebrew numbers associated with each:
So, Larry Pahl's name is:
L+A+R+R+Y = 20+2+200+200+200 = 622
P+A+H+L = 20+2+2+20 = 44
622 + 44 = 666
Larry Pahl is the devil! Ahhhhhhh!!!!!! No wonder he isn't Catholic...
Mateo el Feo
-- (MattElFeo@netscape.net), December 31, 2002.
"Vicarius Filii Dei" - "Vicar of the Son of God" - has never been used by the Catholic Church as an official title for the Pope; therefore why would it appear on his miter or tiara? In fact, the title does not appear in any Catholic document throughout the entire history of the Church. His true title is "Vicarius Christi" - "Vicar of Christ". The term "Vicarius Filii Dei" is a total fabrication by anti-Catholic bigots, specifically designed to yield the desired total in Roman numerical equivalents - 666. In any case, the Pope's miter has no inscription whatsoever on it.
One curious (and rather amusing) sideline to this silly claim ... Seventh Day Adventists are among the most belligerent critics of Catholicism, and publish many nasty anti-Catholic tracts - including a tract describing this supposed Papal inscription. While the Papal inscription they claim is entirely fictional, there are, not surprisingly, some people whose names do in fact yield the number 666 when this numerical system is applied. One such person just happens to be Ellen Harmon White - the founder of the Seventh Day Adventist church! :-)
-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), January 02, 2003.
In Lucius Ferraris' Prompta Bibliotheca, 1858 Paris edition, a Catholic theological encyclopedia, the title Vicarius Filii Dei appears in volume 5, column 1828, under 'Papa,' article 2.Prompta Bibliotheca, according to the 1913 Catholic Encyclopedia, is 'a veritable encyclopedia of religious knowledge,' and 'will ever remain a precious mine of information' and is quoted frequently as an authoritative Catholic source. Vicarius Filii Dei also appeared repeatedly in Catholic canon law for hundreds of years Anselm's, Cardinal Deusdedit's, and Gratian's Decretum, also known as Concordia Discordantium Canonum, in quotes of the Donation of Constantine, which contained the title and was considered authentic by the Church for many hundreds of years, having been cited by as many as 10 popes as proof of their temporal authority. One 1879 edition of Corpus Juris Canonici contains Vicarius Filii Dei. In Our Sunday Visitor on April 18, 1915, the editor made this confession: "The letters inscribed on the pope's mitre are these: Vicarius Filii Dei, which is Latin for, Vicar of the Son of God" "To Whom It May Concern: This is to certify that I was born in Bavaria in 1828, was educated in Munich, and was reared a Roman Catholic. In 1844 and 1845 I was a student for the priesthood in the Jesuit College in Rome. During the Easter service of 1845 Pope Gregory XVI. wore a triple crown, upon which was the inscription, in jewels, Vicarius Filii Dei. We were told that there were one hundred diamonds in the word Dei; the other words were of some other kind of precious stones of a darker colour. There was one word upon each crown, and not all, on the same line. I was present at the service, and saw the crown distinctly, and noted it carefully", Mr. De Latti, former roman catholic priest. As far as the mitre having no inscription on it whatsoever, that may or may not be, but the pope's tiara does. An inscribed tiara of Pius IX will begin a museum tour of the U. S. in March of 2003, bearing the title christi vicario terra regum. This can be viewed at http://biblelight.net/claims.htm#INSCRIBED.
-- Dayton Neil Boswell (firstname.lastname@example.org), February 14, 2003.
HO HUM, here we go again. More idiotic nonsense from Chick Publications. Dear Moderator, please remove this post of mine when you remove the post above.
-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), February 14, 2003.
The Pope's official title, Vicarius Christi means "In place of Christ" The Latin word Anti, part of the name given to the Beast, or Anti- Christ, also translates exactly to "In place of". So the title claimed by the Pope is "Anti Christi", or "Antichrist".
-- Andrew (mohican@*yahoo*.*co.*uk), May 27, 2003.
We could care even less what you think, ''Andrew''. You're a heretic. You descend from the ones who killed saints on Tyburn. We are sorry for you, Sir. Born to hate the faith of the Apostles. A sad fate!
-- eugene c. chavez (email@example.com), May 27, 2003.
Better sign up for Latin 101. "Vicarius" means "representative", "deputy" or "proxy". "Anti" means "opposing" or "against". As such, the two terms are virtually opposite in meaning.
-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), May 27, 2003.
If we could speak reason with heretics, they'd let the light of the Holy Spirit come into their lives.
It's because I see this that I never hope for their expulsion from this site. We are that light, the Catholic Church and her members-- which Christ said must not be hidden under a bushel. He said we should shine it from the highest mountain. Shout the truth from the housetops. Just as you have done here; blowing down the presumption of a heretic.
If this forum weren't open to heretics, schismatics, atheists, antiCatholics and other LOST SOULS,
Then where would they see light again? Not in their ''Bibles''. It's a foregone conclusion, they would only continue in their misapprehension and distorted readings. They would cull out all truth and embrace every satanical error. Because the Holy Spirit is gone from their midst. He is here, however. Amongst true believers and faithful!
We provide a glimpse of the Catholic faith here; which otherwise these lost souls would never get to know. Even during their obstinate and contumacious fury arguing here with us, the faithful-- a slight breech is opened into their minds. The light seeps through, ever so dimly. For this we thank Him. The Holy Spirit; who gives us grace. I have not met ONE, SINGLE, antiCatholic here who was able to withstand the clear messages I've sent him/her. They squealed, they resisted, but they had no answers. For this no one should credit me-- or you. It's the Holy Spirit who enlightens us on the spot; in moments of rare insight, to keep the faith shining! Holy is His NAME! Everlasting in the Trinity of the Father and the Son; One God within this House of Grace. Amen!
-- eugene c. chavez (firstname.lastname@example.org), May 27, 2003.
Andrew is correct, Paul. Let's take this matter one piece at a time. The official title of the Pope is "Vicarious Christi". If you look in "Webster's Third New International Dictionary and Seven Language Dictionary" the meaning of "vicarious", you will get: "representing or taking the place of something or someone primary or original" ... "SUBSTITUTIONARY". These meanings mean "taking place of". That's pretty clear. Now, Paul says that "Anti" means against or opposed to. You're correct Paul but it also means, according to "www.dictionary.com" AND "Webster's Third New International Dictionary and Seven Language Dictionary" this: "of the same kind but situated opposite..." (from Webster), "...or in place of" (www.dictionary.com). So if "vicarious" and "anti" ultimately mean "in place of", then the the Pope's official title translates into "Anti Christ".
This also is clearly seen on the Pope's tiara. There are words inscribed on the tiara that read "Vicariovs Fili Dei" which is Latin for "Vicar of the Son of God". If you take each letter from "Vicariovs Fili Dei" which represent Latin numerals and add them together, they come out to "666". We all know that "666" is the number of the beast as stated in the last book of the Holy Bible, Revelation.
V = 5 F = 0 D = 500 I = 1 I = 1 E = 0 C = 100 L = 50 I = 1 A = 0 I = 1 ------------ R = 0 I = 1 501 V = 5 --------- S = 0 53 -------- 112
112 + 53 + 501 = 666
Now Catholics will say something like "Well I know a name that when translated into Latin numerals and added together add up '666'. And they're certainly not the 'beast' nor 'anti-Christ'". Yeah, that's nice. But here's what it says in the Holy Bible: "And I saw a beast rising out of the sea, with ten horns and seven heads, with ten diadems upon its horns and a blasphemous name upon its heads." Revelations 13:1. So we know that there will be a beast among us. In that verse not only does it tell us what it will look like but who it is. Of course, it literally will NOT be a beast. Who is this "beast" that bears a blasphemous name? In Revelations 13:17, 18: "...so that no one can buy or sell unless he has the mark, that is, the name of the beast or the number of its name. This calls for wisdom: let him who has understanding reckon the number of the beast, for it is a human number, its number is six hundred and sixty-six." So this "beast" will bear a blasphemous name which has a number; the number is "666". This "beast" is clearly seen to be the POPE. Why? Allow me to explain. There are hundreds, even millions, of people on earth with names that when translated into Latin numerals and added will add up to "666". Yes, this is true. But Revelations 13:1, 17 and 18 tells us WHAT KIND OF NAME the "beast" has. It is a BLASPHEMOUS name. So anyone with a name, let's say "Larry Pahl", that adds up to "666" is NOT the "beast" because "Larry Pahl" is not blasphemous. Well, what does "blasphemous" mean? In "Webster's Third New International Dictionary and Seven Language Dictionary" it means: "...indignity offered to God in speaking, writing, or signs..." What does "indignity" mean? According to "www.dictionary.com" it means "A source of offense, as to a person's pride or sense of dignity; an affront." I most certainly think that bearing the title "Vicarious Fili Dei" or "Vicar of the Son of God" is offending to Jesus Christ. Never does it say in the Holy Bible that a man on earth should represent Jesus Christ from up in heaven. Jesus Christ is a perfect man in God's presence; He is a man who has never sinned (this is stated in the Holy Bible). Why would a man on earth (the Pope) who has sinned many times and isn't even as close to being Christ REPRESENT Christ? Basically the Catholics are selecting someone imperfect to represent someone perfect. Let's put it this way: what if a religion (non-Catholic, of course) represented the Pope with a, let's say, murderer. The Pope is more perfect compared to a murderer. Do you think Pope will be offended? Most certainly! Just like Christ is offended by being represented by an imperfect man.
-- The Magic man (email@example.com), May 28, 2003.
You are in fantasyland. The inscription "vicarius filii dei" has never appeared on anything that any Pope has worn, nor has it ever appeared in any official document of the Catholic Church. Why would it? It is not and never has been a title of the Pope. Of course I know where you got this fable from. The publications of Jack Chick are spiritual pornography. He is a tool of Satan, and the fruit of his work demonstrates that fact. People who read the trash he publishes fall into two categories - those who laught at it in utter amazement that anyone could be so ignorant; and those who are not sufficiently knowledgeable to recognize ignorance and bigotry when they see it, and who are therefore drawn away from truth and away from Christ. You seem to be a member of the latter group. So - where did this spurious phrase - vicarius filii dei - come from? It was fabricated by Lorraine Boettner, of the generation of anti-Catholic bigots prior to Mister Chick. For what purpose? Obviously, to yield a roman numeric eqivalent of 666, a number which neither he nor Chick nor you have any real understanding of. But how could you, separated from the biblical pillar and foundation of truth?
Catholics did not choose someone imperfect to represent someone perfect. The One Who is perfect made that choice Himself, when He told the apostle Simon, "thou art Rock, and upon this Rock I will build my Church. Whatsoever you bind on earth is bound in heaven. I give unto you the keys to my kingdom".
One more thing - "vicarius" is a Latin noun. If you want to know its meaning, I suggest you use a Latin dictionary. Looking up the english adjective "vicarious" in an english dictionary, and trying to apply its definition to a Latin noun doesn't make a lot of sense.
-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), May 28, 2003.
first you too might benefit from some Latin revision. Genitive Singular of Filius is filii. And without the added 'i' your peurile little gimic only gets to 665!!
And a gimic it is - used by protestants who are happy to lie to win over vulnerable 'conspiracy theorists' such as yourself. You might also wish to note that 'vicarious' is an English word [already pointed out i note].
You could at least get these right ;-)
included too within the propangda that you have bought hook and line is a complete neglect of something that even a sola scripturist could be expected to get right.
St Peter - our first pope - and all the other apostles abandoned Our Lord. They showed their human qualities - as we all do!! But none of this prevent Our Lord giving the Keys to the Kingdom of Heaven to Cephas. He is the first Pope, and what a sinner he could be.
But at least you have managed to figure out that Jesus was sinless. Well done you!!
now repeat after me: filius, filie, filium, filii, filio, filio; filii, filii, filios, filiorum, filibus, filibus,.....
-- Ian (firstname.lastname@example.org), May 28, 2003.
It gives them pleasure; what a kick they get out of these learned masturbations, as if they'd climbed to Mt Olympus!
When a mere human of no imposing mental powers derives pleasure from smearing someone whom God has exalted, and doing it as a biblical exercise; we can be sure the devil is their master.
And who are the devil's closest friends? Heretical wheeler-dealers, of whom it is written, ''In those times men will be lovers of pleasure!'' They are having such pleasure rejecting their Shepherd. It's their damnation, and it gives them pleasure.
-- eugene c. chavez (email@example.com), May 28, 2003.
-- The Magic Man (firstname.lastname@example.org), May 29, 2003.
i've heard alot about how supposedly the Pope is the anti christ and i've seen the numerical proof and all that stuff but is it right to come onto a forum full of catholic's and preach against what they beleive in? i dont know if its true or not i'm undecided where i stand but all i'm saying is its not right for ppl to come onto this site which someone asked "what the head piece of the pope was called" and tell the catholics that responded that there following the devil if you beleive it to be true then dont follow catholicism and you'll be fine but dont preach about it
-- could be either way (email@example.com), June 12, 2003.
could be either way,
welcome to our forum. if you wish to know what the truth is, the numerical proof is a sham. vicarius filii dei isnt even proper gramar to fit the numerical proofs. but since most people dont know this they fall, all too often, into believing this lie created by the seventh day adventists a LONG time ago.
funny thing is, apply the same numerical proof to the founder of the seventh day adventists and you get the number 666, but nobody is accusing HER of being the anti-christ. BUT the pope has never had the official title, vicarius filii dei, and it has never been inscribed on his mitre.
-- paul (firstname.lastname@example.org), June 13, 2003.
I guess there are a lot of people who allow an ignorant few to lead them astray.A lot of fictitious tales have been said about and against the Holy Roman Church. One of which is this so called 666 supposed to be found in the Holy Father's tiara. Men and women of knowledge will tell us that 666 was a symbolic number describing the evil one. The figure on its own may not be evil and must not be condemned as such.It could be a symbol for satan worshippers, however how evil is it if by mere coincidence it appears on a person? We must take care not to unjustifiably accuse innocent and God loving people of having links with the evil one,satan. Just as the symbol of fish represented christianity (when the early christians for fear of arrest and persecution used the fish as a code or password) it will be wrong to call anyone associated with fish a christian. We have moslem fishermen, have we not? All said there is no evidence that the figure 666 or letters adding up to 666 are on the tiara. Let those who claim this fallacy provided the proof. The Holy Roman Catholic Church has stood trials and false accusations all through these 2000 years, but always came out tops due to the power of the Holy Spirit.666 or no 666, we shall remain strong and powerfull under the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ who personally founded our Church.
-- Daniel Dugan (email@example.com), October 27, 2003.
daniel, perhaps you are unaware that 666 is the mark which will show the beast.
HOWEVER, you are certainly right in one regard... that there is absolutely no evidence of any combination of words that add to 666 on any papal tiarra. in fact, the only tiarra with words on it that i have ever seen is a doubtfull(because it looks a bit phony to me) picture of a tiarra presented by poland as a gift to the pope. the words inscribed, however, do not add up to 666 in any circumstance.
-- paul h (dontSendMeMail@notAnAddress.com), October 27, 2003.
Hey mister magic adventist man. This is what happens when uneducated people apply their sola scripture and sola fide theory for themselves. They start to follow the traditions of men -oops! women like ellen g. white, and not even realize it. You are a lost sheep my friend so why don't you come back to the flock. The One Holy Catholic Aposolic Church.
-- Des Joseph (firstname.lastname@example.org), December 15, 2003.
Is this still an active forum site? I came across it while trying to find a good picture of the Pope's Mitre. I like how you folks responded to the anti-Catholic rhetoric and misinformation and would like to keep this place in my favorites if it is still active. God bless!
-- Doris Olah (email@example.com), March 06, 2004.
Still very much active. Welcome back!
-- Jim Furst (firstname.lastname@example.org), March 06, 2004.
Im only going to say one thing then I will leave this subject alone...The blind will see only what they are told, then will reflect it upon themselves on how it appears...meant for both parties of this discussion
-- Patrick Ward (SickM0R0N@yahoo.com), May 18, 2004.
Right Patrick - and the remedy for such intellectual blindness is reliable information from authoritative sources.
-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), May 18, 2004.