I have about 5 acres of land that is landlocked.Does anyone know what the law is in NC on landlocked land?Do I have the legal right to cross another persons land to get to my property ,etc.This land was handed down from my great great grand parents to diffent family members and over the years tracts of land has been sold and I've ending up with land that I can't get to without crossing somebodys elses land.How would be the best way to go about getting legal right away to this land?Thanks K Smith

-- K Smith (smith499456@aol.com), April 18, 2002

Answers

In most states if you own landlocked land you are just out of luck unless you have good neighbors who will allow you access to the property out of kindness. Do your neighbors object to you crossing thier property to access the land? If so, the only alternative you have is to offer to purchase roadway rights. Be sure and have an attorney draw up the neccessary agreement. I will need to be recorded at the County Clerk of Court.

-- Karen (mountains_mama2@hotmail.com), April 18, 2002.

In many states there is what is known as an "Easement by Necessity". The exact legalities vary from state to state. Your best bet is to check with a Real Estate Broker or Attorney.

This would be something to look into if you are unable to get an easement from one of the adjacent properties.

Sorry I can't be more helpful.

Mike

-- Mike (mhammer@ix.netcom.com), April 18, 2002.

I use to process mortgage loans here in Alabama. We had a client that was also landlocked. He had been driving thru the neighbors property for years, but didn't have a legal easement. To have a mortgage loan on landlocked property you have to have a legal easement on file at the court house. The neighbor didn't mind him driving on his land, but didn't want to sign a legal easement. Our closing attorney said that in the state of Alabama, if a person is landlocked you HAVE to give them easement to thier property (I didn't believe him, but he said it was true) and that they could take him to court to have the state assign the easement. The neighbor didn't believe the lawyer and called his own attorney. He came in the next day and signed the easement(said his attorney told him the same thing). I would 1.) Check with an attorney that is familiar with the state laws concerning this (a title company should be able to refer an attorney to you). 2.) Are you sure there isn't an old easement on file somewhere? The easement should be good (transferring from owner to owner) 3.)Check with the people who own the land around you. Is there already a road to the property? Would they mind if you crossed thier land? If you can find someone who will let you cross, then make sure you get a legal easement filed at the courthouse (again a closing attorney or title company should be able to prepare this for you). Good luck!!!

-- Lisa B. (J5diecast@aol.com), April 18, 2002.

When I lived in NC I was told that there was no such thing as land locked land. From what I was explained someone had to give an easment to allow access.

-- Emil in TN (eprisco@usit.net), April 18, 2002.

Its true in AL an easement must first come from the seller if he owns adjoining property adjoining a thoughofare, then the property with the least distance to a roadway. The one recourse is that an easement must be along a boundary and cannot go through an established garden.

-- Jay Blair in N. AL (jayblair678@yahoo.com), April 18, 2002.

Get an lawyer, have him check it out, here in Alabama you have to give access but how much and where is questionable. Just got off the phone with the man that owns the land behind me. He would like to subdivide but now needs a bigger access across my property to put in a county approved road that is sixty feet wide. He also wants to run water mains, that means some serious negotiating. A strip of land almost a mile long 60 feet wide out of mine is not a little thing. As he says it would make my land worth a lot more but I am not in the market to divide up my land in five or so acre plots. We have a lot of discussing to do and all with an attorney present to read and check out everything. Don't like attorneys but they are nessasary at times.

-- David in North Al. (bluewaterfarm@mindspring.com), April 19, 2002.

60 feet wide! And how much is this neighbor going to compensate you for all the noise from the traffic going up and down the road day or night? Dave, have you talked to your other neighbors? They may not be so wild about the subdividing either. You may be even able to get some restrictions put in on the properties (owner-occupants only, renting allowed only if you can't sell). Good luck.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), April 19, 2002.

There is also something called ADVERSE POSSESSION which is, if there has been an access used for a certain number of years it is a given thing,in PA it is 21 years, AZ I believe it is only 5, each state has different lengths, In PA, I had a garage leaning over the property line and the neighbor wanted me to cut off the portion that was leaning over, but since it has been doing it for over 21 years advers possession said I owned that piece. Just a thought though. definitly ge a lawyer.

-- Dave in Ohio (dr43147@yahoo.com), April 19, 2002.

It doesn't matter what state you are in, legally our system doesn't allow for landlocked land, you have legal right to get a permanent easement; however it may be costly.

-- CJ (sheep@katahdins.net), April 19, 2002.

Last year we purchased land the we get to via a private road. A few nasties were threatening to keep us from using the road. Can't do it. In Iowa at least, you cannot landlock someone from their property. No purchasing rights or easements, you just can't do it. Didn't cost us a thing. It's the law, as it should be.

-- Stacey (stacey@lakesideinternet.com), April 19, 2002.

Well, now, Stacey, it should have cost you _something_. You have right to access your propery, but you need to compensate the other land owner for using their property too! Perhaps this is an old easement you have, & it was paid for a long time ago. That's fine.

Around here it was common to own a 5 acre plot of 'worthless' woodlands to get wood to heat the house years ago. These were land-locked, but you could go across the fields in winter (when wood is made) no harm no foul.

Now what? All these tiny little plots of land locked behind good cropland, along a creek - folks want them for their 5-10 acre homestead.

Then, there was an old railroad following the creek. The land was taken by the railroad a century ago, with the agreement that it would be given back when not used for rail travel. Well, several buyouts & legal wrangling, and the RR sold the property after abandonment. They couldn't be bothered with all the little sales, so they sold several miles minumum at a time.

The guy that bought the 60' RR property through the woodlands area is all nutz & keeps people off 'his' property. (Yes, he bought it, but was it right for the RR to sell it? Hum.)

Hum.

So, dad has 5 acres in there, land-locked, with the 60' RR easement disecting it. How do we access both sides of the property without stepping on that RR right of way???? (It's not particularly an issue for us, no point to worrying about it at this point.)

So, now, if YOU were the county that had to figure out who owned what, & how to access this & that, what would YOU do? It's just a powder keg of problems for the county to try to sort out.

In general, these easements & landlocked property just becomes a huge problem, where everyone bickers & complains. Think long & hard before getting involved in these situations. Living there for 20 years with hard feelings between neighbors is NOT fun, no matter how wonderful or cheap the property...

--->Paul

-- paul (ramblerplm@hotmail.com), April 19, 2002.

Hello, we have land that is 'land locked' and we had our laywer draw up a "Right of Way" deed. We went to the oowner of the land-which had the shortest route to our property, showed him the deed and he signed it. The road had been there for 80years but there was nothing in writing. We were told that--it is a NC law that they must give you a right of way! They may give you a hard time but it is the law! Check your county agri. agent. He should be able to help. If not go to your county's courthouse records/deeds dept. . Ours was very helpful!

-- Debbie T in N.C. (rdtyner@mindspring.com), April 19, 2002.

I would go nuts if these people behind us on top of a hill 60 acres came back into the picture. At the moment I have paid their taxes and they can't be found. Haven't been found in 15 years that people who before me paid their property taxes. Now if they came into the picture they would want an easment on my property. My property is narrow and deep with 300 acres. They would be driving right by my house and going through creek beds then what build bridges and what kind of road to go straight up a mountain/hill, quite steep to get to their property. I can't take a horse up that hill! it is stickly a hunting type paradise. No, if they ever come back to life they would have annie okley on their hands. If my land looked different and there was a road in existence, plus this was a nice person, maybe...!!

-- debbie in OK (bwolcott@cwis.net), April 19, 2002.

Debbie, chances are the original owners have passed on and the heirs can't be found--the property may in fact have reverted to the state, and they apparantly have not told you that you shouldn't be paying taxes on property you do not own.

Have you talked to your county (and maybe a lawyer) about you getting the property through adverse posession, or at the very least getting a refund (with interest) of all the tax money you've paid out? They're not going to look very hard for an heir if you're happily (grrr) continuing to pay the taxes.

If no one had paid taxes on it all this time, the property would have been sold at auction by now, at least for all the back taxes. The owner before started this bad situation, and too bad it wasn't disclosed to you up front so you could have rescinded the sale. Also, this probably falls under a "defect in title" that your title insurance should be paying for, not you.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), April 19, 2002.

You've talked about this before, Debbie. What you are doing now does _not_ protect you, only costs you money.

You really should get it straightened out properly. Right now you are being taken advantage of.

I'm sure there are many options, depending on state & local county laws. I would find out what those options are. Since the landowners can't be found, you won't be stirring things up by asking questions & finding out what the options are.

If you do not like some of the answers then you can continue being taken advantage of by not stirring the pot. The govt will not stir the pot as long as they get the tax money. It is possible you can or have assumed ownership by paying taxes long enough, or the state owns the land already but no one bothered telling you, or there is a legal easement through someone else's property, or the land will be put up for sale & you can buy it, or...

But at least you would know what is what, and eventually when something does happen you would have a clue as to your options.

Really, really don't think you are doing the right thing for yourself as things are now!

Free advise, worth what it cost you. :)

--->Paul

-- paul (ramblerplm@hotmail.com), April 19, 2002.

I guess the problem is stirring the pot! I wasn't informed of this problem before buying the property. After buying the acres I was told by the realtor that I got an extra 60 acres for nothing, just paying the taxes. What I do wonder if it is possibly Indian Property. There is an awful lot of Indian Territory in this area and they have some strange laws. All most like they have a different Nation or something. The original owners of the land have a Polish last name so I would guess not. I think I will take the situation up with an attorney. The only reason I do pay the taxes is so someone who would buy it at auction for hunting doesn't get to drive on my property. I let people hunt but they must get permission first and the thought of someone of a bunch of hunters crossing and opening all my fence lines possibly letting out animals would be scary to me. The electric company didn't close a fence and I had to chase two horses several miles barefoot on the main road. I sure looked "cute"!

My point is that I don't think it is fair that one can buy landlocked land and think they have the right away across someone elses land then of course, it is not fair to not have access to your land too. Giving access now, is that for the person or persons owning the landlocked land or maybe they're party people and intend on having a love in, do all their vistors have access is the question. I suppose when we do get the facts about OK law and stop paying the taxes I intend on buying the land but there are people out there that would just love a little hunting paradise is what also scares me.

-- Debbie (bwolcott@cwis.net), April 19, 2002.

Debbie, the sad fact is that you can't choose your neighbors--and even when you do have good ones, there's no guarantee they'll stay.

Also, if you let hunters up there, then what's wrong with an easement for neighbors? To me, hunters would be more of a potential problem (stray gunshots) than neighbors. Now, if your future neighbor had UPS delivieries all the time because they were running a home business or had a QVC addiction, you probably would have some cause of action against them for disturbing the peace (but then any "soccer Mom" worth her salt can cause the same amount of traffic driving kids hither and yon :-).

I don't know how liability on easments work, and if you do have to grant an easement, I would try to sell the property outright to the person, just so 1) They have to pay the taxes on it, and 2) anything happens (like a dog bite) they are liable, not you.

You could also look at suing the real estate agent for malpractice as well (provided the statute of limitations on property sales hasn't run out)--either that property is yours or it isn't. If it isn't, you should not be associated with it in any way. What if the hunters you let on the property start a wildfire, and the next day the true owners are found??? Not a headache I would want.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), April 19, 2002.

As to your other question, you can't bar people from coming to visit those in back of you--it is presumed that they are guests of the owner, but of course they would be subject to the same disturbing of the peace laws.

If at all possible, I would put the easement as far to the side of your property as possible, so it doesn't divide it, and that way you can sell it and not have to maintain it (for example if you own trees on both sides you would have to immediately clear the easement if one fell so that emergency vehicles could get up the road).

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), April 19, 2002.

Well hopefully it will never come to that (neighbors). As far as the real estate agent goes, I bought what was for sale and didn't know about the other 60 acres until way after - about the time the tax bills were sent. The tax collector sent it directly to me. I guess in small rural areas everybody knows who is who. So at first it sounded great, getting an extra 60 acres that you didn't pay for. Taxes are rather low on the property in comparsion to my 300 acres. But to put a road through my property would be coming through an area that I have started a Blueberry U-Pick and a Christmass Tree Farm. Frankly this property could only be access buy a 4 wheel drive and if it rains they would never get through the river beds (it look like white water rafting during storms). When they get to the hill they would have to be on foot to get to their 60 acres. So..it would only be bought by hunters. Like I said I do have hunters but I know these guys and they will come early in morning and be out that night. I lock up horses and put cattle in certain pastures at the time. I allow hunting by these individual because they also take down the coyotes which are a big problem here. Thank you for you response, it has made me think. I should do something soon. I guess there are more than one side when it comes to landlock land!! I know that I would never buy a piece of land that was landlock because of what we have all discuss. Suppose the government says okay you have to give access. Do you want to drive on a piece of land knowing the people can't stand the ruling! Then again if one inherits such a piece of land, they want it, I certainly can understand that. Tough issue.

-- debbie (bwolcott@cwis.net), April 19, 2002.