Apology from Gloria

greenspun.com : LUSENET : Countryside : One Thread

To all who wrote to me, spammed me, told me i was rude, ignorant, stupid, a blonde, and other stuff: I truly am sorry. I will not be back to such an unkind, unmerciful and unforgiving bunch. I am still upset with what happened. Unbeknownst to me, I upset a lot of people, for this I am truly sorry. I don't know anyone over the age of 10 who didn't need a little mercy, forgiveness, or understanding at one time or another. Don't you think there is enough hate, complaining, bitterness and unforgiveness already in the world? I spoke to chuck last night and i have never posted in your forum and this is the last time I will post. I need some time to recover from all the junk and filth that was thrown at me for 6 postings. If this is what gets people's knickers in a twist, how about expending your energy to get rid of all the true hate and filth that is in our world? I guess it's easier to bash someone like me, so i guess i can take it. thanks again for your informational and generous responses. For the record, out of over 100 responses to me, (wingnut send 30 alone), i only received 2 that were "kind". thanks again for the lesson. I will never make that mistake again, please applaud yourselves for the "lesson" you taught me!

-- gloria (gloria@ivillage.com), March 02, 2002

Answers

WOW, 100 emails,, just for posted in here,, hmmmm,,, someone check under the rugs,,

-- Stan (sopal@net-port.com), March 02, 2002.

I did not get in on the posts Gloria sent. I have so much time and pick and choose. I saw there were alot of them though. I did get into a post that Chuck put up about the mistaken way Gloria had posted.

I do believe it was just that.. a mistake. I am ashamed of the nastiness she received. My gosh..and we are supposed to be the ones who keep our calm when those around us lose theirs? Thats not the behavior I would have expected from this forum, as homesteaders, Christians, Constitutionalist, compassionate, caring people etc.

I, for one, am sorry Gloria..if I try to put myself in your shoes..I am sure I would have been VERY hurt.

-- Sher se Iowa (riverdobbers@webtv.net), March 02, 2002.


While I did not e-mail Gloria personally, I can see why everyone was upset with her. After making her first post advertising her business, everyone wondered what this had to do with homesteading. THEN after her second post, people really got to wondering about Gloria. THEN after the third post, people had had enough of the advertising. THEN the FOURTH and FIFTH posts came from Gloria. By the time Gloria posted her SIXTH post. She was asking for return fire. She does need to apologize to the forum.

-- cowgirlone in OK (cowgirlone47@hotmail.com), March 02, 2002.

Glorias situation is exactly why many of us will not give our real email address. That along with the extra spam one gets when the electronic marketers get a hold of an address force me to use a false address.

By the way, where is Glorias place of business? I missed all the messages she posted probably because I was practicing my form of censorship, i.e., if the heading isn't of interest, I don't open it. Have to admit though, I have been fooled a few times.

-- Mac in AK (nospam@aol.com), March 02, 2002.


I think, because she didn't uncheck the little box and she was using her business address, she got all the wacky stuff people were putting on the threads after there were SIX of them. Then, someone called Misty or Missy, not sure which, responded to a couple of the first ones I posted about this not being the place to post that kind of advertising. Responding to THOSE e-mails, was the only e-mailing I did. I said, "please don't respond to me in my mail box" on one, got another one that was very nasty and responded to that one with "STAY OUT OF MY MAILBOX"!!!!

So, once again I caution you folks, IF you don't have the whole story......could you please give us the benefit of the doubt??

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), March 02, 2002.



Sorry Gloria, but this site doesn't take prisoners.

-- paul (primrose@centex.net), March 02, 2002.

Hello Gloria,

I hope you and the others GROW from this experience. And I mean that in the most sincerest way.

Sincerely

Ernest

-- http://communities.msn.com/livingoffthelandintheozarks (espresso42@hotmail.com), March 02, 2002.


Gloria, I am sorry for all the grief you have suffered from this situation. Everyone makes some mistakes in life. Unfortunately, giving the benefit of doubt doesn't seem to be something done very often on this forum. You do need a rhinocerous hide to participate here sometimes.

I saw the six threads, apparently shortly after they were posted, because there weren't too many comments then. Perhaps in future, some of you would consider merely notifying the moderator. He's the one with the delete key, after all.

I think Diane might be right that Gloria was getting all the messages posted to the board also sent to her inbox. But to anyone who sent her nasty comments directly, I hope you are ashamed of yourselves. Probably not, but I can hope.

-- Joy F {So.Central Wisc.} (CatFlunky@excite.com), March 02, 2002.


Part of the basic rules of starting a business is targeting a market, not sending out advertising anywhere. If Gloria had taken the time to actually read this forum, she would have realized in 10 minutes or less that this was not a good target market.

Further, the one posting was bad enough, though I would have assumed it was a mistake, and let it go. The rest of them, however there was no excuse for.

And, just for business advice, I never support businesses that plead "help me out by supporting me" or other such entreaties. Either you have what I need or you don't.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), March 02, 2002.


Normally, as many of you know, I'm a pretty sympathetic person. This child,Gloria, got exactly what she deserved. She, obviously, didn't read the forum before posting her unfortunate mess. She was rude beyond belief and now she will never come back again! Good riddance!

-- Ardie/WI (ardie54965@hotmail.com), March 02, 2002.


"sigh" i have come home to find my beloved cat being torn to shreds by the neighbors hunting dogs. some how this junk doesnt matter.

-- cody (urbusted@alltel.net), March 02, 2002.

Cody, how awful? Yes, you are so right, these trival things have no meaning when such disaster strikes! Did the dogs kill your beloved cat or can you have the cat put back together? I have had to make the "emergency run" to the nearest vet (once it was a 45 minute drive to the on-call vet, I did it in 20 minutes time) three times now with my barn/house cats being attacked by sometimes my own dogs! I have one dog that has killed two of my cats, one more time and he will be euthanized.

I have since kept the offending dogs on dog runs and are only loose with direct supervision. The pain and frustration you are feeling is terrible, but don't blame the poor dogs responsible, it is their nature to attack cats ( vet told me this over and over, he has had the same problem himself) and the blame lies on the dog's owner. Bring the attack to their attention and ask what they can do to reassure you that this won't be allowed to happen again.

My heart goes out to you, I know and feel that pain and incredible frustration.

-- Annie Miller in SE OH (annie@1st.net), March 02, 2002.


I agree with Diane and Ardie. I don't know where she gets that I sent her 30 e-mails, but I know for a fact it was more than one. I did send six at first to demonstrate how maddening it was, each with the same civil note that this was not an acceptable thing to do in a forum and is considered spam. Anyone knows that, even if it's NOT written anywhere on the forum. My civil tone DID change when I was called a crybaby in one response from "Misty" or whoever she was. Pot-kettle-black.

I would accept an apology if it was sincere, but Gloria's laying the blame on us in the same breath and not telling the entire truth tells me she's not sincere.

-- Wingnut (wingnut@moment.net), March 02, 2002.


Gloria; Sorry about your experience with this forum. It is an interesting group and most are good people, but as in any large group some never learn to accept an apology or extend forgiveness. Too bad all of us can't be as perfect. Come on back an just keep the "back" button handy( or the "delete' in case of email ).

-- charlie (charliesap@pldi.net), March 02, 2002.

I'm glad to see a few conciliatory thoughts in the above posts. Thanks, guys. For the rest of you - and I hesitate to bring this up since I am myself an atheist - are there any among you who are Christians and try to follow the advice of Jesus to "turn the other cheek?" If so, how would you apply that advice in this situation? Does it matter whether or not Gloria's apology is sincere? Is it not incumbent on you to be forgiving, regardless of the feelings of the party who "wronged" you? Or have I misquoted or misunderstood that scriptural tidbit? Mind you, I am not holding anybody to the teachings of the Bible - just offering this for self-reflection and comment.

-- Notforthis (keepingit@secret.com), March 02, 2002.


hi annie, thanks for your nice mail. no, she was not able to go to the vet.i'll put it to you this way, i'm still picking her up.i have spoke to the neighbors before when their dogs have killed my chickens. they let their dogs run loose all the time and we have no leash law. whenn i tell them, they just say, "well, i sure dont know what i'm gonna do with those dogs .just run them off next time." well next time they are getting shot. the other day they took my husband's ax out of the log he was cutting and drug it home and chewed the handle off it. they called my hubby over there to go to the store for them (they are early 70'S )and handed hubby his ax and said"this yours?"their dogs keep getting killed somehow or another and they just get more. they dont do anything with them, just yard dogs. i dont get it. oh well. thanks again ..cody

-- cody (urbusted@alltel.net), March 02, 2002.

Oh cody..........how truly awful. So sorry to hear that. A real heartbreaker. I hope you can find a solution to your neighbor's dogs.

For the rest of you who would judge us by this very contrived letter which was absolutely nothing like what was written last night...oh well. Maybe I have been pretty out spoken, and sometimes not happy with myself afterwards, but this really stinks. I was there, and I know that the others that were there have responded to countless calls for help in a very supportive way. Do I hold anything against gloria or misty?? Not hardly, don't even know them. But, some of you I know and that is going to be the hard part, forgiving you.

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), March 02, 2002.


I agree with wingnut, Gloria's apology does not ring true when it seems like just a vehicle for laying a big guilt trip on us.

-- Debbie in MO (risingwind@socket.net), March 02, 2002.

According to Webster, forgiveness means (in part) "To cease to feel resentment against, on account of wrong committed; to give up claim to retribution upon (an offender)." Done that. Accept an insincere apology? Nope ~ that would do more harm than good. Ever heard of tough love? Accepting an insincere apology would be enabling the person to feel better without them accepting responsibility for and understanding what they've really done ~ might just lead them to do it again and be in the same boat. And the next person may not ignore their second and third nasty e-mails. Forgive? Laws, yes! Enable? Heck, no!

Oh, Cody! I'm so sorry to hear this! Yep, you're right in that if you shoot the dog, the owners will get another. So sad. What's always worked for me in a situation like this is to pepper their butts with buckshot (with a little practice, you can get good enough to just deliver a serious sting) ~ teaches the dog, yet leaves him alive so the owners don't get another that hasn't learned. I truly wish you a solution to this problem soon! Bless your heart!

-- Wingnut (wingnut@moment.net), March 02, 2002.


Well, I was thinking all was well after reading the message from Chuck last night, but this thread has the word 'Apology' in it. Nowhere in Gloria's message did I actually see any kind of an apology. Hum, I hope she learns in the future. I think we all, sometimes, learn from our mistakes. Not always. Seems Gloria didn't quite learn 'the' lesson from this one. Perhaps some of the rest of us are learning some as well. And such is life. :)

I did e-mail Gloria after seeing 4 messages from her. I pretty much said what GT did up above - that 1 spam is often overlooked, but she was really setting herself up for trouble by doing 4 (or 6!) and that she should consider what she wants to accomplish with her messages, and that she may be setting herself up for a lot of problems and actually driving people away from her business. As far as I know I didn't say anything mean, altho I probably was stating things firmly - nicely tho, but firmly.

Gloria (or Misty, or whomever) didn't get the point I tried to make. She was kinda firm back with me also. That's fine.

But it seems she still has some to learn about business, marketing, the internet, and what 'Apology' means.

To the group: I kinda like what happened. We didn't start another 20 threads on the topic, but we did get our point across. Some might have been nice, some might have been rude. But the end result was about right in my book.

As to this being a big deal - it is life, and friends, and how we preceive ourselves & each other.

I have a sick calf laying in the basement, probably dead by morning, darn cold snap. Had a birthday party with my wife & friends planned, but here I sit alone, spent $30 on the calf, probably won't make it. Really bugs me. Not the $30, but that it is feeling miserable in the basement, and all (probably) for nothing.

But you know, this issue of spam on the internet - that's a big deal too, at least to some of us. To those that don't think it is, thanks for passing by our threads & reading what _you_ think is inmportant.

Good days to all, even Gloria. :)

--->Paul

-- paul (ramblerplm@hotmail.com), March 02, 2002.


Well said, all of you! As for Joy, I don't understand why you are even posting here, asking "why we didn't notify the moderator" you must not know what was going on here last night. Chuck was notified, used his delete key, was cheered by all, and he threatened to send a bill for a new delete key to Gloria. I think Gloria's apology will be accepted as soon as she sends one. I'm ready to forgive and forget and go on to more important issues. Best wishes!

-- cowgirlone in OK (cowgirlone47@hotmail.com), March 02, 2002.

I was here for it all, I was not mean, I was sarcastic, there is no excuse for posting 6 advertisements and her "you people....yadda yadda.....tearing down dreams" remarks after she was nicely emailed not to post ads here. [which was before they where all posted, and before we opened up on her} As it has been pointed out many times this is a public forum, any body can answer a post, if she didn't want so much of a responce, she shouldn't have posted so many times.

Her so called apology, sounds more like a pouty child that didn't get her way than anything else.

But, I still think my dogs would like to go there anyway....they do enjoy to travel....

AND...IF she had posted saying that she had just moved to this place in the country, and would we spread the word about her web site, instead of the 6 advertisements, [and her rude coments to us], it would have been VERY DIFFERENT.

-- Thumper/inOKC (slrldr@yahoo.com), March 02, 2002.


I guess it's hard to hit everyone's standard. I didn't even read the 6 postings. Looked like advertising to me so I skipped it. Too darned busy I guess. I'd say if she'd left it at "Unbeknownst to me, I upset a lot of people, for this I am truly sorry." as an apology and holstered her anger to sum up, forgivness would be easier. I'm sorry but I hate you and won't be back?? Nasty all round Gloria gets a dose of flames, and loses out on a great board, the board gets a shake, and nobody's the better for it. Try again Gloria, you stepped on the board's toes, and paid for it; though you'd have faired far worse on other boards. I'll bet you can find true forgivness and a lot of value here. Wingnut and the others (obvious) have excellent track records here; quick to smack your hand maybe but good people. Sorry to hear about your cat Cody, and I hope your calf pulls through Paul!

-- Ross (amulet@istar.ca), March 02, 2002.

Gloria, We accept your thanks for the lesson. Th pleasure is all ours!

-- woodsbilly N.C. Pa. (coleenl@penn.com), March 02, 2002.

I liked the way some people defended the forum against spammers,not being tolerated.Pam

-- Pam (pam@hotmail.com), March 02, 2002.

At first I wasn't going to respond to this thread. Before I start let me say this ... Gail posted on Country Style Homestead forum, too. I didn't have to be notified because I keep a pretty close watch on the forum and the post was deleted before anyone could get nasty, hurt, offended, childish, etc. Then I emailed Gail and explained my reason and offered the friendship and information our forum(s) could offer. That would have been very efective here, too. As it is, I'm appalled!

My DW informed me that everyone was giving this lady/biz/whatever a hard time STILL and I really couldn't believe that busy homesteaders had time to sit in front of the computer and dish out the sort of material I've read in this and the previous posts. I'm not defending what Gail did, but goodness folks - we all started out somewhere! How many of us have made MUCH worse and costly mistakes in our homesteading adventure? There are a couple adages that come to mind here - "Do unto others..." and "...cast the first stone."

-- Phil in KS (pemccoy@yahoo.com), March 02, 2002.


Phil, who is Gail??

-- Ardie/WI (ardie54965@hotmail.com), March 03, 2002.

Sorry ... bad case of late hours and serious brainfartitis - the post/lady in question is, of course, Gloria (hey - at that time of night, "gail" was close! -grin-).

-- Phil in KS (pemccoy@yahoo.com), March 03, 2002.

Oh! Phil, I thought I was having a senior moment! Someone mentioned a "Misty" and then you said "Gail"! Was wondering how many names this person had. Thanx!

-- Ardie/WI (ardie54965@hotmail.com), March 03, 2002.

Hey! Leave us Gail's outa this! We didn't do anything.... yet.... Ok, so I insinuated barbequeing a dog on another post.... Hey, Cody, why don't ya do that and invite the neighbors? Nothing worse than a killin' dog. Sorry for your loss.

-- Gailann Schrader (gtschrader@aol.com), March 03, 2002.

Just now getting back to this thread. I wouldn't be posting again, except that cowgirlone addressed me specifically so here is my reply:

cowgirlone wrote: "As for Joy, I don't understand why you are even posting here, asking "why we didn't notify the moderator" you must not know what was going on here last night."

cowgirlone, yYou are correct that I was not here to see what was going on. I have been told that there were numerous posts on the multiple threads taking Gloria to task for her multiple posts. Was I given erroneous information? I DID NOT ASK "why we didn't notify the moderator". I was suggesting that, instead of taking it upon yourselves to be moderator, you notify the moderator. Period. Obviously someone (or several someones) did notify Chuck, and HE then took the action he deemed appropriate. If you don't agree with my opinion, fine. However, please do not put words in my mouth. I am also curious, were you saying that I shouldn't be posting an opinion? To all and sundry: Gloria spammed the forum. Whether or not it was intentional, none of us will know. You may claim you "know", you can form your own opinion, but you cannot see into another's mind or heart. WHY not err on the side of kindness? Phil in KS, I am in agreement with you!

-- Joy F {in Southern Wisconsin} (CatFlunky@excite.com), March 03, 2002.


Hey, Phil ~ as long as we're tossing around biblical adages, here's another one: "Judge not lest ye be judged."

I didn't see you or Joy sitting here next to me when I read those nasty e-mails from Gloria/Misty/Missy and I doubt you were sitting next to Diane, either. So who are you two to say that we were/are wrong? Those e-mails from her gave me a pretty good look into her heart and mind ~ it wasn't pretty. Yes, I've made mistakes in my life and I paid for them. I took my lumps without whining and offering contrived apologies that were really cleverly disguised barbs. I am very kind and merciful to someone who deserves it. And I'm also sick and tired of people who weren't here and don't know the entire story judging those of us who were.

-- Wingnut (wingnut@moment.net), March 03, 2002.


In respect to those that will be offended, if not forewarned the following is from the Bible;

Smite a scorner, and the the simple will beware: and reprove one that hath understanding, and he will understand knowledge. Prov.19:25

Gloria scorned the policy for posting here, we smote her.

As far as I am aware none of the persons involved, from this form are still angry with her,....to me that would be like,......staying angry with a tack that poked you a week ago......

-- Thumper/inOKC (slrldr@yahoo.com), March 03, 2002.


And Phil, in regards to your "quotes" she spamed first, didn't she?

-- Thumper/inOKC (slrldr@yahoo.com), March 03, 2002.

Well, one more post and then I'm out of this thread for good.

I wasn't trying to be judgemental (exception noted below) -- I was trying to suggest ways that all this upset and bad feelings could be avoided -- by letting the MODERATOR do the moderating job.

This is the exception -- in my first post, I wrote: "But to anyone who sent her nasty comments directly, I hope you are ashamed of yourselves. Probably not, but I can hope."

I guess that is judgemental, but I stand by that. I don't care if someone "does it to you first" -- that does not justify doing the same thing. If Gloria or whoever was nasty to anyone, then she should be ashamed of herself as well.

If anyone thinks that I am being nasty, I'm sorry. I don't mean it that way. I'm now ceasing all effort to present another way of looking at things and leaving this thread.

-- Joy F {in Southern Wisconsin} (CatFlunky@excite.com), March 03, 2002.


"I need some time to recover from all the junk and filth that was thrown at me for 6 postings."

O.k..................since we have OBVIOUSLY brought out every self righteous lurker here...................someone PLEASE tell me, use a fake address certainly...........WHAT KIND OF FILTH IS THIS GIRL TALKING ABOUT????????????????????????? No one seems willing to let this dead horse alone.............so lets just pick it dry. Since she first posted this I have been wondering.

I remember a couple of references to maybe she is blonde, and then a couple of our blonde regulars making a couple of cute remarks. I remember talking about would our dogs, cats etc. be welcome. I just remember that is was all done pretty much in a spirit of fun and never once felt like I was BEING A MODERATOR!!!! Even after a terribly rude response by Misty as to my saying posting six posts would most likely qualify as spamming, I don't recall saying anything except in caps to be sure........STAY OUT OF MY MAILBOX.

So..........who sent the filth????

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), March 03, 2002.


Joy, we just posted simutaneously

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), March 03, 2002.

Joy, you are giving the impression of someone who is over sensitive, the three post BETWEEN yours are directed to Phil, ..or are you posting under 2 names?

I had wondered how many of the post/mail responces she got where from other places, as she didn't just do it here.

-- Thumper/inOKC (slrldr@yahoo.com), March 03, 2002.


Never thought of that Thumper, maybe she REALLY spammed the WRONG forum someplace else??

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), March 04, 2002.

Yeah, I'll bet that's what happened! Would explain a lot...

-- Wingnut (wingnut@moment.net), March 04, 2002.

Wow Joy, you're right. How could I have taken your words "Perhaps in the future, some of you would consider merely notifying the moderator" to mean "Why didn't we notify the moderator" (That's putting words in your mouth???) LOL! As for your posting on this issue, I stand by my statement, You were not there, you have no idea what you're talking about. I don't skip the goat threads for the heck of it, I don't have a goat! As for everyone that did reply on the Gloria spam posts, You don't have ANYTHING to apologize for. There were NO nasty threads sent from this forum. Everyone did a great job on their replys, AND we'd do it again if needed! Best wishes

-- cowgirlone in OK (cowgirlone47@hotmail.com), March 04, 2002.

Upon returning to this thread ONCE again, it occured to me that perhaps my statement about "self-righteous lurkers" would need clarification. Not to my friend Joy, whom I share a common definition of lurker, but to others who perhaps might think I was calling joy one. NOT.......more in reference to those who will remain unnamed, who find it necessary to tell me what they think in private or here under assumed identities.

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), March 04, 2002.

Wingnut & Thumper - you're both correct, and I apologize! I didn't see any of the nasty emails anyone got, therefore didn't have sufficient information to make the assumptions I did in my post here.

Didn't realize the depths this "conversation" had taken - previous comments withdrawn! Hope I didn't ruffle too many feathers beyond repair!

Good day to all!

-- Phil in KS (pemccoy@yahoo.com), March 04, 2002.


These are just my thoughts, friends. I think that Gloria-Misty- Whoever is getting too much attention. We should not be bothering with this. She can go back to doing whatever she was doing. We need to do te same. We have far too much fun in here to be concerned about the child.

-- Ardie/WI (ardie54965@hotmail.com), March 04, 2002.

Ardie, I think the focus of this thread switched from Gloria to those of us who "responded" to her. But I agree that the horse is deader than dead and beaten beyond recognition. And in that spirit...

Thank you, Phil! Now THAT was a sincere apology. I heartily accept it and give you my thanks!

-- Wingnut (wingnut@moment.net), March 04, 2002.


Ditto, Wingnut.

-- Thumper/inOKC (slrldr@yahoo.com), March 04, 2002.

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