The "Ken explain" thread was a breath of fresh air on old wounds. Thank you Chuck for just letting everybody be everybody. I loved it not because everyone was arguing but because everyone was actually sharing again. That is real life. That is what homesteading really is. None of us come to this lifestyle for the same reasons. We come from varying viewpoints, races, belief systems, and environments. How can homesteading be a cohesive movement if all the players don't know one another. How can a better world be built if we can't discuss and if not solve our differences, at least express them. People are unique. Someone in the other thread the Second Amendment was for the government. That is true. I have never said that Countryside was violating the second amendment. I said that they were denying rights that I have been given by God(when he gave me a mouth or brains and fingers as the case may be) to speak my piece. I felt they were doing this, even as they took advantage of the rights given in the Constitution to speak theirs(freedom of the press). Nevertheless I never denied them the right to make their own policies. I chose to leave rather then give up my God given right, as all of us are capable of doing when we are placed in a situation that violates our belief system. Freedom is not granted to men by either government or any organization. Countryside or Chuck or anyone can make rules and laws, but they cannot grant or deny my freedom. I can choose to give up freedom. I can choose to bend to another's will if I decide the alternative is worse, but my freedom is granted by God. It is a permanent possession that nobody can take away. Among men we all exchange our rights for the mutual good of everyone. As a Christian I exchange my rights all the time to follow God's way rather than my own. It is up to each of us to decide our boundaries and the level of submission we bring to various situations. This is what America was founded upon. Our forefathers knew this and called it "self evident". As far as the forum problems before, they are the past, as far as I'm concerned. I am happy to hear all of the various voices and I'm very thankful to Chuck for saving a place that really still has much to contribute. I hope everyone here can have a great time just enjoying one another.

Little Bit Farm

-- Little bit Farm (littlebit@farm.com), February 20, 2002

Answers

Now this is just my theory on this forum when it was "owned" by Countryside. Please bear with me. When CS was involved and everyone had their knickers all bound up and they were carrying on, it was a reflection on the magazine! I'm not certain that I would have subscribed to the magazine had I come upon this forum with all the arguing and name calling that went on about a year ago. Fortunately, we had been subscribers for many years before that.

Now, we are on our own and nothing we say will reflect on the magazine or the Belangers.

-- Ardie/WI (ardie54965@hotmail.com), February 20, 2002.

True Ardie but what ever we say does reflect on who ever says it. I just hope that we can talk about anything with out name calling. Statement of beliefs yes but lets not speculate on canaine parent for anyone. My one question here Little bit is which thread were you refering to as I didn't see one with that title? And again people lets be nice and post and live as friends or at least a good neighbor.

-- gail missouri ozarks (gef@getgoin.net), February 20, 2002.

I'm sorry, I was going from memory, a BIG mistake when it comes to me. It was the "Ken can you tell me how many applied?" thread. Sorry folks!

little bit Farm

-- Little bit Farm (littlebit@farm.com), February 20, 2002.

I am going to break my personal rule up to now and bring up what is going on over at Countryside. All I have to say, is that the hole that they shot in their foot is now getting infected. I am really sorry to see that forum go, but when you practice free speech yourself and take advantage of it's blessings to earn your living, then deny others the same priviledge, you pretty much have nowhere to go but down. I am fairly confident that the person chosen to head the forum hereafter will also be as restrictive as those who are choosing him. If so I don't give the forum much chance of making it. It is just completely unfeasable to stop everyone at the door and question them like you would a jury to find out if their beliefs are acceptable. Ultimately this whole debacle has and will affect the magazine. Even so it was their choice, and as such they should shoulder the responsibility.

Why are you here? All you want to do is cause grief and upset things. I know that your pathetic little site is down the tubes but why come back? Not only are you boring but long winded as well

-- (Here We Go Again@Dontthinkso.com), February 20, 2002.

You Posted on your site;

I am going to break my personal rule up to now and bring up what is going on over at Countryside. All I have to say, is that the hole that they shot in their foot is now getting infected. I am really sorry to see that forum go, but when you practice free speech yourself and take advantage of it's blessings to earn your living, then deny others the same priviledge, you pretty much have nowhere to go but down. I am fairly confident that the person chosen to head the forum hereafter will also be as restrictive as those who are choosing him. If so I don't give the forum much chance of making it. It is just completely unfeasable to stop everyone at the door and question them like you would a jury to find out if their beliefs are acceptable. Ultimately this whole debacle has and will affect the magazine. Even so it was their choice, and as such they should shoulder the responsibility.

Why are you here? All you want to do is cause grief and upset things. I know that your pathetic little site is down the tubes but why come back? Not only are you boring but long winded as well

-- (Here We Go Again@Dontthinkso.com), February 20, 2002.

I'm sorry, what?

Is it just me, or did that last post (by someone who chose to remain anonymous....the least you could do is choose a screen name.) make absolutely no sense?

-- Chuck (reply@mission4me.com), February 20, 2002.

It made absolutely no sense.

-- cowgirlone in OK (cowgirlone47@hotmail.com), February 20, 2002.

I am admittedly not the brightest light in the chandelier, but I didn't get it either.

-- Nan (davidl41@ipa.net), February 20, 2002.

I knew that post sounded familiar, the one that doesn't make any sense. If you want to be anonymous, don't post in a recent thread, like statements.

I am sorry to see this forum and Countryside part ways. If the new administrator is as restrictive I expect it will limp along at best for awhile. Yep! The bullet hole in Countryside's foot finally got gangrene! Even so, once this forum was my favorite place. Once it was about homesteading and homesteaders who shared all their feelings, beliefs, concerns, triumphs, and failures. Once it was GREAT! Maybe someday we will all recover from it's loss. Little Bit Farm

-- Little bit Farm (littlebit@farm.com), February 18, 2002.

Drives me crazy when people don't have the backbone to stand up and identify themselves...

-- Laura (lauramleek@yahoo.com), February 20, 2002.

Usually when the leader of a revolution lays down his arms and walks quietly and with dignity to the peace conference than the army Stands Down. Please let this be the case here also ! We are emotionally battered and I mean both sides of the trench. At least try for awhile the new leadership before condemning the unknown. I led all of you into the struggle for free speech and I hope now to lead you to the garden. Your Boycott was successful and in a much shorter time than even the Montgomery Bus affair. There is always time to wage war and so little time to enjoy the peace ! Someone has suggested we go away. No, I will not submit(besides I was here since the time began ) but I will live peaceably amoung you. Sharing your joys, griefs, good fortunes and your calamities. However, I do expect the same in return, very few of you even realize the sacrifice we made to give you back your basic freedoms. I will not often be here because I have other interests as well. The war is over, there are no victory dances, no fireworks and no one even sang "ding dong the wicked witch is dead". Let us try to heal the wounds.

-- Joel Rosen (JoelnBecky@webtv.net), February 21, 2002.

Joel, did you get into the morning glory seeds?

This is getting better than a daytime soap opera. ; )

-- Dave (something@somewhere.com), February 21, 2002.

Laura: I think the poster of the bolded portion of your post preferred to be anonymous. It wasn't Little Bit, thus the confusion IMO. They just copy and pasted another post Little Bit put on her forum for "contrast".

As to the rest, time will tell. Little Bit and Joel have returned, seeming to feel vindicated, merely because Countryside Mag has decided the forum is just too much hassle. If they wanna take credit for it, they're as welcome to their delusions as I am to mine.

I guess they've failed to notice that there are MANY more new posters and threads initiated and alot more participation than there had been prior to their departure, which would kinda put a damper on the self congratulatory glee they seem to feel.

Its my hope the forum continues to remain topical to HOMESTEADING or it will certainly devolve back into what it had been prior to the exodus of several "activist" participants.

-- john (natlivent@pcpros.net), February 21, 2002.

Well John, I would have to say that the increase in posters on the board is equal to the number of new people acquiring computers. Just statisically speaking. Also more people thinking simply because Pedro in Wegotyourjob, Mexico has forced them to meager existence line ? Homesteaders by force--you might say. Take credit for it ? No, I just pitched the ball. In the end it is always the same -I say green you say blue--it has always been that way ! Probably just some flaw in our characters. That's one vote to continue the war cast by John, so noted John, your voice as been heard.

-- Joel Rosen (JoelnBecky@webtv.net), February 21, 2002.

Taking notes, Chuck? You mad, impetuous fool, you!

-- Don Armstrong (darmst@yahoo.com.au), February 21, 2002.

"You can observe a lot just by watching." Yogi Berra

-- paul (primrose@centex.net), February 21, 2002.

Since we are free to speak, I for one DID NOT like the "Ken Explain" thread. Who is this Susan anyway, did she post again since that thread, or was it just a game to get everyone going at each other? I don't like the name calling, us/them type conversations, assuming things might happen, whining and crying about "rights" and just overall "me, me, me" type behavior.

Ardie's hit the nail on the head, this forum is a reflection of the magazine. We all knew that. Some didn't care.

And John's right too. Trying to take credit for breaking up the forum is more of the "me, me, me, look at me, listen to me," self- centered, and IMO, not God-centered attitude. If people don't let go of all their old wounds, they will be the ones turning gangrene.

Ever hear that song, "Let go of the stone"? You are sinking in a large pool of water, holding onto a large boulder. But you refuse to let go of it, because it is all YOUR past bitterness and hurts. You want to hang on to them, and keep them with you. You can not swim out and save yourself, or take someone's hand to pull you out unless you let go of the stone.

-- Cindy in KY (solidrockranch@msn.com), February 21, 2002.

Well said, Cindy!

-- Ardie/WI (ardie54965@hotmail.com), February 21, 2002.

AHHHHH...time for some humor here guys! He who lives in glass houses, shouldn't throw stones....but I like the other one....He who lives in glass houses....dresses in the basement! heehee! Come on ya'll. Life aint that bad! Hug someone you love today! Step back and smell the cows...oops....the roses! ;~)! sniff sniff sniff...the chickens?!!!! Yep, definitely the chickens!

-- Nan (davidl41@ipa.net), February 21, 2002.

Oh Cindy, I do happen to agree with you. I was just trying to get the menfolks up there to lighten up a bit.

-- Nan (davidl41@ipa.net), February 21, 2002.

Oh, come on folks, Stop! I understand that some of us have some pent up feelings from the past. Let's leave it in the past now and move on. There just isn't any sense in inflicting it on our new moderator. This is a great forum, Chuck's a nice guy and doing a good job, and I'm glad to be here. What more could we want that we can't provide ourselves by trying to get along? Spring will be here soon, cheer up. :)

-- Rebekah (daniel1@itss.net), February 21, 2002.

Spring IS here! Today, anyway. I rode my motorcycle to work this morning! Woohooo!

-- Chuck (reply@mission4me.com), February 21, 2002.

Yeah, it's actually a little hot here today in Gainesville. All these dark clouds yesterday and today from this storm system and we haven't gotten enough rain yet to wet my hair. Sigh...

........Alan.

-- Alan (athagan@atlantic.net), February 21, 2002.

Actually I wrote three posts one to my board and two to Doreen's before I had a conversation with Chuck and before I knew who he was. I've said worse things in my lifetime and I have no problem with everyone knowing what I said. After all I published it to a public forum. I actually apologised to Chuck via e-mail. Do I feel vindicated? Yeah in a way, but mostly I feel grateful. Everyone can go read for themselves what I've written. I am not ashamed of standing for what I believe in. The weather here is hazy sunshine with a good stiff wind. It's supposed to be 58 degrees today.

Little Bit farm

-- Little bit Farm (littlebit@farm.com), February 21, 2002.

Joel and LBF, the forum here is not bigger because of any "war" fought, or because of God or any of his/her incarnations thereof, or because of anything other than the simple truth, more and more folks are becoming interested in learning all they can about living more simply and cheaply beyond the sidewalks.

Stop hunting for dragons that do not exist, and I wonder as well why you both are here, you both pitched such a fit not so very long ago and swore you would never grace these halls again, tried valiantly to encourage all and sundry to cancel their subcriptions to Countryside, and I distinctly remember Joel saying he would look forward to shoveling the dirt on our graves of the one's who remained and participated here.

It seems that some of us are suffering from an extreme bout of "selective memory" syndrome.

-- Annie Miller in SE OH (annie@1st.net), February 23, 2002.

That's funny Annie. Another point to ponder is that the two who were screaming the most, telling everyone to leave and never come back, never did cancel their subscriptions to the magazine. One said his wife wouldn't let him.

-- Cindy in KY (solidrockranch@msn.com), February 23, 2002.

Actually if you go back and read what i said in the archives you will see that I never asked anyone to leave. I said I was leaving. I never e-mailed anyone and asked them to leave. In addition I haven't had a subscription to Countryside in years, although I always purchased the mag every month. So I never cancelled my subscription because it was always easier to buy it locally.

Little Bit Farm

-- Little bit Farm (littlebit@farm.com), February 23, 2002.