What could I expect to buy in the way of a farm/homestead in your area for 200,000.00.Im going to retire young,take my pension and get out of Florida. The quality of life has gone to heck here in the last 10 years. The small town I grew up in now has 150,000 people. Theres no planning, not enough water and 1000 people a day are still moving in. Im outa here!

-- Jim (Lgk2105@aol.com), December 27, 2001

Answers

Response to Most bang for the buck

Jim, I am a 7th generation native Floridian, my people were here in 1838, when the gators were 16 foot, the rattlers were 11 foot; my grandfather took a 3 day each way trip for supplies from Yehaw Junction to Kissimmee for supplies using a raft with push poles. Yes, Florida is turning into a cesspool, not from the locals but from the transplants from elsewhere. I have seen $20.00 an acre swamp turn into $2,000.00 a running foot "commercial property". The Miami City Council now is in Spanish, you need to have a "passport" to cross town, all the foreign nationals have overran the place; soon Florida will be a desert and all the paracites will have to go somewhere else. The water supply is gone, I hope the parasites are next. I was born in paradise, watched it fail, and moved back to America a few years ago. Your $200,000.00 will buy a grand house, a hundred acres with extras, and peaceof mind here in upper right WV., but I would recommend elsewhere in that the roads here are snakey two lanes with people thinking that 20 foot is a safe following distance at highway speeds.

-- mitch hearn (moopups@citlink.net), December 28, 2001.

My recommendation would be to put your things in storage, buy a used RV and then spend up to a year just traveling around the U.S. When a place feels right to you, you can stop at local realtors for an idea of what is up for sale. Around here $200K will buy you a mighty nice spread.

I also grew up in Florida - New Port Richey. Then it was just a quaint little town north of Tarpon Springs. Now it is continuous shopping centers and subdivisions. Road traffic, particularly during the winter tourist season, is bumper to bumper. Go north, young man, go north.

-- Ken S. in WC TN (scharabo@aol.com), December 28, 2001.

Here in Mo you could get a huge place for that!! Also the taxes are low here on real estate.

-- Teresa (c3anch@socket.net), December 28, 2001.

JIM....GO NORTH TO CANADA.YOUR MONEY AND PENSION WOULD GIVE YOU MORE BANG FOR THE BUCK HERE THAN ANYWHERE IN THE U.S. YOUR NEST EGG WOULD INCREASE BY 50% AND LAND AND HOUSING WOULD BE CHEAPER AGAIN. YOU CAN GET A 100 ACRES IN NOVA SCOTIA FOR ABOUT $18,000 U.S. A FRIEND OF MINE BOUGHT AN OLD FARM HOUSE WITH OUTBUILDINGS ON 138 ACRES FOR $38,000.[THATS UNDER $23,000 US].YOUR $200,000 U.S. WOULD BE AROUND $280,000 CDN. YOU COULD GET QUITE A SPREAD FOR THAT HERE.PLUS YOUR BUYING POWER OF YOUR PENSION HERE WOULD BE LIKE FULL PAY. IF YOU BUILT IN NOVA SCOTIA IN THE YARMOUTH AREA.YOU ARE A FERRY RIDE AWAY FROM MAINE.BRITISH COLUMBIA IS MORE EXPENSIVE BUT HAS A MILDER CLIMATE.AMERICANS AND GERMANS ARE BUYING UP ALL THEY CAN IN NOVA SCOTIA.THERE ARE QUITE A FEW AMERICAN CELEBRITIES WITH LAND HOLDINGS HERE.

CORDWOODGUY

-- CORDWOODGUY (cordwoodguy@n2teaching.com), December 28, 2001.

Ken, small world! We just moved in August from New Port Richey, FL to Virginia. How long has it been since you where there? Really bad changes. The builders have ruined it so much. Just subdivisions after subdivision. Very serious water problems, in fact, we were not allowed to water lawns but once a week - no car washing, etc. In the city the give you a water allowance and if you go over you are charged at 3x the usual amount. When we left they were considering doing away with any use of water except for personal house use. No lawn water - and you know how you HAVE to water your lawn or completely lose it in Florida. Traffic on US 19 is worst than ever. School systems stink and out of money. Teacher have to use paper over (collect the passouts and run them through the copy machine and put another handout on the back). Crime is getting worst every year also. I am soooo happy we made the choice to go back to the country!

-- Karen (db0421@yahoo.com), December 28, 2001.

Jim----we have our property for sale --- & you can buy an 11,000 sq ft warehouse a totally remodeled home & a guest house & a barn & oversized garage & other out buildings--with orchards & 2 --1,ooo gal propane tanks & 2--500 gal propane tanks ==we have our own water well we had a hand pump put on it----we totally remodeled the house---new carpet/paint---inside & out-totally rewired & insulated- etc/etc/etc/etc/etc/-----new furnace---you could meet most of your own needs here/ as we have a wood stove & use the furnace for a back up--- our own water well--but also have city water (which is rural water district)--garden spot & I raise my own chickens & geese & ducks--- Our property is in a very small rural town that might have 50 people on a nice warm day---- across from our home is a hill & we have deer & wild turkey that come out of that hillside each day to greet us & to walk down the street to the river---- our warehouse is on main st with lots of parking & we recoated the roof of it & painted the outside of it--- The warehouse has 11,000 sq ft & has 3 loading docks & 4 over head doors & 5 office spaces---PLUS--- the best is that it is across the street from an 1800's stone mill they are in the process of restoreing----- we are off the hwy----so less traffic ---but it is only one mile off a hwy if you needed it for your business--- The warehouse has been a small manufactureing plant & also a large country store---it could be used for any thing ---only your imagination would limit you-- I raise Ducks & chickens & geese in my backyard---have a garden---we can do anything we are big enough to do in this town--- We are in the middle of the Kansas Flint hills /in the middle of Cattle country----- If you have never seen a sun rise come up over those Flint hills you have not lived!!!!! My hubby & I want to sell & size down as we aren't as young as we use to be & we want to move back to the area where we would be closier to his work--(as he drives 1 & 1/2 hours to & from work each day-----we moved to this area to care for our sick & ageing parents--- -they are gone now--- We are selling ALL for $117,500.00 firm----we priced it below what we have invested & will not budge off that price--- You can't buy a nice, single home for that price even an hour from here!!!!! if you would like more information please e-mail me----- also if you want to check out the mill----project there is a web site for it-- http://aalto.arch.ksu.edu/cedarpoint/

We are centraly located & there is much to see & do in our area----- Sonda

-- Sonda (sgbruce@birch.net), December 28, 2001.

Oklahoma has some of the least expensive real estate in the country. Recently I saw for sale 160 acres with ponds and barns, cross fenced, 3/4 pasture with a brand new 2000 sq ft log home for 140,000, one mile from black top and an hour from OKC.

You could buy alot of home and 40 or more acres or a little less of a house and alot of acres here. Email me if you want more info on area's.

We have lots of rivers, lakes and ponds and our population isn't growing by leaps and bounds. Winters are fairly mild, average snowfall of 7 inches.

-- Stacia in OK (OneClassyCowgirl@aol.com), December 28, 2001.

Jim, I agree fla really sucks, I lived in Land o Lakes in Pasco county for one year in the eighties, i could not wait to get a job elsewhere and leave. Went to South mississippi for ten years and we have been in Virginia for fourteen years now and love it. We are in Amelia county about 50 miles west of Richmond, land is reasonable but they keep moving out here. ten years from now it will be differnt. Bruce

-- Bruce Burdge (comfreybruce@richmond.com), December 28, 2001.

I agree with Ken S., that you should drive the country (as cheaply as possible) & see where you would like to live. Just bear in mind you should find out what the winters in those areas are like (growing zones also if you want a garden or larger crops). Also there is something to be said about being close (at least an hours drive or closer) to a city or town large enough to have a mall.

I'm in central Indiana (zone 5), & compared to the rest of the state, we seem to be in a hole where we get less snow, however we seem to get more ice storms (but winters are really not bad here). I'm currently in Johnson county, & you could get a lot of land here for your money. But, there are several nearby counties where prices very (higher or lower) Morison being lower in price. Also southern Indiana has some good land with reasonable prices (Hoosier National Forest area).

Basicaly just see for yourself (don't forget to ask many questions).

Good luck

animalfarms

-- animalfarms (jawjlewis@netzero.net), December 28, 2001.

Hmmm... I need to move to WV. Here in MD 200K would get you 1/2 acre and an outhouse, but you'd have to pay extra to use it. I saw a 5 acre buildable lot without a tree on it sell for $500,000 awhile back. (near us in Potomac, MD) Whoever bought it put another half million into building a house on it. Prices here suck, unless you are selling.

On the other hand, does anyone know anything about the area around Spencer, WV? I saw a farm there last spring that was 220 acres with a three bedroom house (my wife refused to live in it, however) going for $175,000. I find it hard to believe that's not a typo. Sheesh.

-- chuck in md (woah@mission4me.com), December 28, 2001.

Hello Jim,

I to moved out of Florida,(Kissimmee) for much of the same reasons that others did. My wife and I spent two years traveling around the US searching for the best places for our needs. We chose to move to the Missouri Ozarks as the results of our research.

We planned every detail of our move. We stored our furniture in Flippin, Ark. Went back to Kissimmee and bought a used RV. We moved out of our apartment and lived in a RV Court in Haines City for about three months. Once we finished up our work at Walt Disney World we moved to the Missouri Ozarks and began caretaking someone's property. This gave us a base of operation.

We lived in our RV and searched everyday for land. The land around here is running from $750 to $1500 per acre, depending on the quality and quantity that you are looking for. We moved here during a June and by November we had found the land that we were looking for. We bought undeveloped land and just as soon as the water and electricity were put in (we put the water in ourselve by running pipes from the creek), we moved our RV onto the land.

Since then we have built all the outbuildings and have nearly completed the construction of our new house. The land was paid for in cash and we built everything ourselves with cash as well. We are debt free as the results.

Many people in this area have an income of either pension, retirement or disability. There is little work to be found but, my wife and I scrape out a living doing various self-employed jobs. We live on a very modest income from those ventures.

With the amount of capital you are talking about you could live exceptionally well here. Keep yourself as debt-free as possible and do as much of the work on your land as possible. I would even suggest that you do as we did and move to the area of you chosing first and search on your own for an ideal place.

There is a large amount of land (developed and undeveloped) around the Ozarks for very reasonable prices. If you are just looking for a retirement village then I would suggest Mountain Home, Arkansas. It is a thriving little community with the most modern medical facilities in about a hundred mile radius. Land is a little more expensive "over there" but, the ammenities for a senior citizen are close by. Mountain Grove, Missouri is also another choice. It is a little smaller, but still has the "country" look. This is probably due to the high number of Mennonites in that community.

Regardless, of what you are looking for, I believe that the Ozarks would be the best all around. Some areas will never grow bigger than they are now, like the one I live in. But, others are growing to meet the needs of retired people and many have joined the communities with much enthusism.

I would avoid the Springfield, Missouri area as it is growing so fast and land is becoming expensive. You may find some pieces of land still reasonable outside of Springfield, (Rogersville, etc) that can be had for $3,000 or so an acre. Springfield is the largest city near us, (three hours away). It is near a very large theme park area called Branson. If you are familiar with the incredible growth of Orlando/Kissimmee you would understand why I do not recommend this area as a place to settle.

All in all, much of the area I live in is settled with its original families. Many of them came from Kentucky in the middle 1800's. They have inter-married and all most everyone is related one way or another. The whole county (Ozark)as big as it is only has about 9,000 residents. Since there is little commerce, no railroad, no airport, and just a couple of factories, I suspect it will always be about the same.

I hope this helps you get a focus on where to look around southern Missouri, if you decide to move to the Ozarks. But, not everyone will find his utopia here as my wife and I have. That will be decided only if you visit and see for yourself.

Sincerely,

Ernest

-- http://communities.msn.com/livingoffthelandintheozarks (espresso42@hotmail.com), December 28, 2001.

Hi Jim: Well, my husband came out here to north central Montana in June for a job and we have decided to move here (largely due to how much we love the town and school for our daughter). So, we will be ready to sell our place in NW Minn in the next month or so. For roughly 100,000, you can buy our place (house, outbuildings and ten acres) plus the rest of the 150 surrounding it. We will be putting information up on the forum, etc. about it in the next month or so. Good luck in your search. With that amount of money, you can buy a nice place in many areas of the country.

-- Cynthia (farmsteaderus@yahoo.com), December 28, 2001.

Geez.....what a bunch of whiners. Boo Hoo. You all whine about people moving to Florida and ruining it. And just WHAT are you doing? Moving out here to the Ozarks?....What makes you think we want you here? You people are the type that move to the country, buy a couple acres next to a farm, and then try to sue because you can't stand the smell and the tractor noise.

I'm still moving back to Florida in about a year when my house is finished. Jobs?....who cares...I ain't working. Neighbors....naaaaa....I have 20 acres surrounded by state forest. Water?....not a problem...I am tapped into a huge spring that feeds my pond with more water than it can use. You know there is a water shortage in Florida. Your complaint is that you can't wash your car or water the grass. Waaaaa Grow up. I guess if you can't have all to waste that you want, then it's not the right place for you. Do you feel that you are "owed" this right to waste?

Do all of us country folk a favor and stay away. We don't want you here to ruin our areas like you did your own.

-- tim (drnk2that@aol.com), December 28, 2001.

Wow tim . . . . you must be one unhappy person!!!! The posts on these forums are from folks who are looking for information as well as offering information. Whatever the subject may be.

So who died and left you in charge here?? I think that if you can't be a bit nicer then maybe you should just not say anything at all!! You sound like more of those folks who were moving into Florida (snowbirds) from elsewhere and messing up the traffic, causing prices in stores and restaurants to be raised for the duration of the snowbird-season, as well as ruining life in general with your attitude.

Yes. . . at one point I did live in Florida. I left there mainly because of other people just like you!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-- wolfie (wolfiequinn@hotmail.com), December 28, 2001.

Chuck, I responded by e-mail to your question about Spencer,WV. Since it is forum related, I thought I'd reply here, in case anyone else is interested.

DH and I just bought 73 acres for $60,000. The "Homesteaders" taxes are 233 dollars per year. Our cost will be more until we put some money into farm equipment.

There is no electric service to the property and the well is hand-pumped. I have designated the dwelling as a "dozer-downer". The state road that leads from the asphalt road is about a mile long and has puddles even during a drought. We live, and have parents in the a large metro area in MD., and did not want to relocate too far away.

Nothing we saw in VA, MD or PA was this nice for this amount of money. The town of Spencer is very nice. People in rural WV are very polite and friendly, not like we were used to in the city. The town has medical facilities, 2 supermarkets, and a Super Wal-mart. We dealt with United Country- E-mail is: countryhomes@wvadventures.net.

www.spencerwv.com is the town's website.

http://www.spencerwv.com/wvpapers.htm is a link on the spencer page for newspapers in WV.

E-mail me with any other questions. Hopefully I can help.

Happy Trails Ann (and Rick)

ann1956ann@hotmail.com

-- Rick (Rick_122@hotmail.com), December 28, 2001.

We have fifty acres we were trying to sell with woods, pasture ,ponds paved frontage, civil war battle field, water along the paved frontage. 95,000 The land behind that 77 acres with a large creek we canoe up and down in, woods and pasture 145,000. At the end of our lane eight acres with a 6000 sq feet heated and air conditioned with a three car carport and a two car garage all part of the house. Also a 40 by 60 sq feet metal barn or shop. Asking 145,000. Taxes on our hundred acres with house and three large out buildings 300 per year. Winter last two months a year. Little hot in the summer not real bad we don't have air conditioning. Humid most of the time. We would not live anywhere else. Twent two miles to town, six miles to supermarket, fifty miles to huntsville, aprox 300,000 large enough to find most anything you would need.

-- David (bluewaterfarm@mindspring.com), December 28, 2001.

Hello Tim,

The changes I see in the Ozarks are by no means being done by the "outlanders". I have logging all around me. Both property owners are from here, one is third generation. I have another neighbor that just had 30 acres bulldozed just so he could grow more hay for his herd. The roads are littered with garbage and many of the locals are living in squaler. On the beginning of the month the local grocery store does not have enough parking for all the handicapped vehicles that the owner's have driven to the store to cash their disability checks and welfare checks. Any improvements made to increase the economy of our little community are uusually shoed away by the town fathers and rejected at the council meetings.

I am sorry to tell you that this is not the work of outsiders, (outlanders)! Most of the people I know, including myself that have come here to settle have seen the damage of progress to such a point that we ourselves do everything that we can to perserve "our few acres" and not have it destroyed the way the LOCALS have done their land.

I moved to the Ozarks because I watched a little cow town turn into a tourist attraction. I saw hundreds of acres of orange groves bulldozed and turned into subdivisions. I saw THE MOUSE, (whom my wife and I worked for) do enviromental trade offs for the sake of "another theme park". If you do not know what that means I will tell you. Disney buys a derelict old ranch in the middle of nowhere and promises not to develop it, in exchange that they can fill in the swamps and canals in another area to build Animal Kingdom. I watch the population of central Florida DOUBLE! It now stands at roughly 3 million people give or take! And that is just Central Florida!

Anyway, here on my homestead, my family and I do our part to keep the Ozarks pristine. My property was undeveloped, but instead of bulldozing the spaces for my road, house, and outbuildings, my wife and I hand cut the minimum amount of trees just to fit each of these needs into the landscape. OUr home is handbuilt by us. We have an outhouse instead of putting in a septic system. We grow everything organically, livestock included. We do not have a garbage pick up service and you will not find a single piece of garbage anywhere on our property. We recycle everything. Our only waste is just disposible diapers that my baby needs. I drive them to the recycle center once a month for disposal in their dumpster.

LOCALS drive by at the top of my road (1/2 mile up a steep grade) and drop their SUBWAY cups, beer cans, etc. on the dirt road that leads to the black top. I go up there occasionally and pick up the mess.

Before you start mouthing off about people destroying the Ozarks you better take a look in your own back yard first. You said you did not work.....hmmm what is it disability, welfare, or what?

I work as a handyman and I do get quite a bit of work in the community. When I talk with my customers they all tell me the same thing. Can't find anyone who wants to work around here, they would rather stay on disability or welfare! Not, my words....theirs....local citizens that are aware of the conditions that other local citizens are creating in this paradise.

You also must not be too bright, if after reading all the post about the reasons we left Florida... you still want to move there? Believe me...when you get there you will learn a very hard lesson about life. I did! There are not free lunches in Florida! Nope, nada!

I can talk about Florida if I want too because I have seen it all happen. I saw the migration of the Cubans, and the Haitians. I was one of Walt Disney World's first customers back in 1971! I have been through Camielle, Andrews, Hugo and Elian Gongalez! I watched the states water supply be cut in half when they built the canal from Lake Ockachobee to Tampa! I know what I am talking about!

Usually, I do not even waste my time with a "bottom feeder" like yourself, but I am sick and tired of people going out to their way to criticize something on this forum just for the sake of criticizing. If I was you and thank goodness I am not, I would just shut off my computer and take care of whatever problem I had before getting back online and harrassing decent folks!

Ernest

-- http://communities.msn.com/livingoffthelandintheozarks (espresso42@hotmail.com), December 28, 2001.

So Tim, have you thought about taking a happy pill??? Who said they wanted you in Florida??? I don't know of a transplanted homesteader here who does not the utmost respect for the area they live in and try hard to be friendly, respectful, and considerate of thier nieghbors. I don't know who your neighbors are that got your panties in a wad, but I sincerely doubt it is anyone here on the forum, so cut us some slack.

As for your spring in Florida. I got news for you, apparently you haven't been there for a while because NO spring is safe with the water shortages. I think you don't get the point anyway...it is not whining about the shortage, it is genuine concern. You aren't there now to know how serious it is. You can get all the reports you want but unless you live there and see it for yourself, you won't believe it. Entire lakes - gone. Weekie Wachie springs down 3-5 feet (if you know about this place then you will realize how serious that is). When you have drought and no water you also have sink holes. You can have a spring in your backyard, but won't keep you from a sink hole. Spring Hill alone had 58 sink holes in July and August alone.

As for washing cars and watering lawns. Lots of folks have no choice but to live in subdivisions. Most all subdivisions in Florida have very strick deed restrictions (and someone ready with pen and paper in hand to inforce them) -- including the appearance of your lawn. Goes back to a time when Florida had water to burn. If you know Florida then you also know in order to have any type of lawn (again required in most subdivisons) you have Floritam. Try spending $2,000 for a lawn and another $1,000 for landscaping and then not be able to water it. Big investment to lose. I don't know anyone who cares if they can't wash thier cars (just take them to the car wash) it is only an example of how severe this problem is.

If you love Florida, then more power to you. Florida needs more bozo's anyway. Opens up a spot for someone who cares and will appreciate the Ozarks.

-- Karen (db0421@yahoo.com), December 28, 2001.

THANK YOU ERNEST . . . . YOU SAID THAT SOOOO WELL.

-- wolfie (wolfiequinn@hotmail.com), December 28, 2001.

Thank you for all the prompt answers, This past summer I did take a long trip. Drove to Abingdon Va. then slowly drove up I-81 to New York State. over to Mass. up to Vermont and New Hampshire. Was sort of scouting things out didnt do much land shopping. Wife and I really liked area around Roanoke Virginia but land seemed to be high there. Wish I would have cut over to West Virginia for a look around. I dont plan on retiring for about 18 months and I want to take several more trips for a look around. Im not the type to buy impulsively. Im looking for mostly woods with some water, with about 5 to 10 acres cleared for a house and garden and room for a few animals, am not interested in large scale farming. I really dont hate Florida, I just hate what has been done to it by greedy developers. I really get a kick out of the people who are moving to central Fl and buying 300.000 dollar homes in new subdivisions and bragging about the beautiful cypress trees in their back yards. The reason they have cypress trees in their back yards is because that 300,000 dollar house is built in a swamp, and when Florida goes out of the dry cycle they have been in for the last 20 years many of these subdivisions are going to be underwater. How developers can get rights to develope these wetlands is beyond me. I think I just need a change for the last third of my life and I will soon have the resources to make the change happen. Heck if I dont like it Ill just move back to Fl If its not all paved over by then. Dont be too hard on Tim, Hes probably just having a bad day.

-- Jim from Fl (Lgk2105@aol.com), December 28, 2001.

Jim, if you liked Roanoke you might consider the Wytheville area. Land and taxes are much cheaper and easier to find and wonderful wonderful view. You have rural-ness but with conveniences (hospital, Walmart, Lowes, ect.) plus you are only about an hour to Roanoke when you need the big stuff. It is also only 1/2 hour from Bluefield VA/WV (right on the boarder) and has a big mall, Sam's Club and all the usuals; and only 40 min. to Christainburg with another big mall and tons of everything else. 2 hours to Gatlinburg, TN. 1/2 hour to NC boarder. Best kept secret in Virginia. If your interested and really want the big bang for the buck, check out the Max Meadows/Ft Chiswell area (10 min. from Wytheville and only 2 miles off the interstate). Friendly people in these parts.

-- Karen (db0421@yahoo.com), December 28, 2001.

Jim, my farm in Adams County Ohio is still for sale - 108 acres, 10 tillable and rest woods, a small spring fed pond, two good barns, old house with electric and well, $115,000. I have a long post about the place in the "Land" archive, or would be happy to email more details.

Adams County is great if you do not need a job - very slow growth, very rural in character. The area is called "The Little Smokies" and is very scenic, with good land prices. Might be worth a look if you come up again to look in WV or SE Ohio. There are always some Adams County land and farm listings in the Cincinnati multilist, www.cincymls.com, in case my place doesn't interest you.

-- Scott McAlpine (scottmcalpine@juno.com), December 29, 2001.

CORDWOODGUY - where on earth can you buy the types of stuff you were posting with regard to Nova Scotia? Any online sites? "YOU CAN GET A 100 ACRES IN NOVA SCOTIA FOR ABOUT $18,000" .. i'll buy it right now if you can post a url :)

-- Jon Kolko (jon@smallbear.org), December 29, 2001.

Hi, this is mainly a response to Ernest's post above. I live in Missouri too, and the Ozarks are beautiful! But, Ernest's remark about Springfield bothered me. Springfield is a great city. Yes, it is growing, but it is a comfortable place(and I usually don't like big cities) There is a lot to do there and it has a lot to offer. I took my son for a vacation there not too long ago and we just enjoyed seeing the sights. Also, Branson is not a theme park, real people live there, work there and grow up there. Yes, it is very commercialized, but it is a town, not a park. Maybe Ernest meant Silver Dollar City which is close by. Now that's a park. Anywhere in Southern Missouri is beautiful, but I couldn't tell you the prices or taxes. But, it would be a beautiful place to live. The Mark Twain Forest covers a lot of southern Missouri and is beautiful. It wouldn't hurt to check into it.

-- Diana (rock_hunter83@hotmail.com), December 30, 2001.

Ernest's post could describe a lot of places that have been ruined by the locals. Many times people who move in and perhaps nicely suggest something that worked well elsewhere get really bashed in the local papers. It is sad. Lord help you if you even suggest something as innocuous as a Dial-a-Ride (for those unfamiliar, it is a city or county run van that you can call for pick up at your house to take you to appointments in somewhat of a roundabout fashion (when you get there is somewhat dependent on where others who were picked up are going) but it is better than having no transportation at all if you don't have a car or a ride! Very useful for elderly and handicapped, and much, much, cheaper than a taxi.

Same with some places that have CC&Rs. I am no fan of them, but they were simply a reaction by people and builders to what was going on around them. Sure the people running things can be a little dictatorial (which is why if you live in that sort of neighborhood you want to at least attend the board meetings, or better yet, be on the board), but mostly all they are trying to do is to preserve a certain standard of living in their little neighborhood, or try to preserve larger lot sizes so the area doesn't turn into Orange County, CA. In many areas, like-minded neighbors have even voluntarily formed their own homeowners' associations because they care about their neighborhood.

I don't know about others, but I would rather look at some nicely kept standard size city lots (always like to walk around and check out really cool landscaping) than what I see in "the country" a lot, which sadly is often junk cars (complete with resident skunks) and junk everywhere. I agree that people should be able to mostly keep their property as they wish, but your neighbors (anyone who can see it) should not have to look at blight. Plant an evergreen hedge or something. But then on the other hand, you fix up your place just so it looks nice (no upgrading, just maintaining), and the assessor comes along and raises your taxes....

Just my $.02. Good post, Ernest.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), December 31, 2001.

North Dakota land is VERY cheap and so are the taxes!

-- Novina in ND (homespun@stellarnet.com), January 03, 2002.