Need help with libility question

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I have no idea what category this belongs under, but I have a situation perhaps some of you have experienced and can help. We live in a community where the house lots are approximately 3/4 acre. Often times, back yards adjoin and are not divided by a fence. Our neighbors have a 5 year old daughter who enjoys playing in our yard. We have chickens, a hammock, and a big apple tree with a swing. Today, while I was hanging clothes, the child came over into my yard (uninvited) and jumped on the swing and almost fell off. It got me wondering what my libility is if something had happened. Her parents (both nice people) are from a long line of "sue-happy" people and just recently one cousin sued another cousin. What's to keep these people from suing a neighbor? Should I speak to the parents about keeping their child in their own yard or that she must play in my yard at her/their own risk? Is there any legal way I can protect myself? Or should I put up a fence and/or take down my swing, hammock and get rid of my chickens? The parents are very nice and friendly people so I don't want to cause a problem if there isn't one. Any suggestions from others who've experienced something similar? Or am I making a mountain out of a mole hill?

Thanks for reading.

-- Dianne in Mass (dianne.bone@usa.net), April 15, 2001

Answers

laws require you to put fencing and No Tresspassing signs in most areas. It is possible that the signs alone may suffice, but that is rare, check local statute. Always maintain homeowner liability insurance as protection against members of the "Sueyoutoo people".

-- Jay Blair in N. AL (jayblair678@yahoo.com), April 15, 2001.

Sound like the lawyers would claim you are maintaining an "attractive hazard". Sigh maybe, get your insurance agent to write a letter and fence if last resort. On top of my homeowners' insurance, I carry excess liability for a million dollars the costs $200 per year.

-- Lynn Goltz (lynngoltz@aol.com), April 15, 2001.

I would put a fence up, she needs to play in her own yard and her mom needs to be watching her. 5 is not very old. You don't have to tell the neighbors anything, just that you have wanted a fence for a long time, and you're finially getting one!

-- Cindy in Ky (solidrockranch@hotmail.com), April 15, 2001.

Thanks to all of you who wrote. I appreciate your thoughts and perhaps a fence is a really good idea. I am glad I have good friends who can advice me well.

-- Dianne in Mass (dianne.bone@usa.net), April 15, 2001.

Good fences make good neighbors! I'd go for the fence for sure. YouYou can also look into a liability policy so that you are covered if someone injuries themselves on your property.

-- amy (acook@in4web.com), April 15, 2001.


Here in Indiana NO Trespassing signs don't work on another note NEVER put up a Beware of dog sign. That tells people you havd a bad dog. Put up a guard dog on duty sign this tells people you have a working guard dog doing his job

-- grant (organicgrange@yahoo.com), April 15, 2001.

If you like the child, and don't mind her playing occaisionaly, then consider explaining to the adults that you don't wan't her wandering over alone, for her safety and also your peace of mind. Tell them that they must bring the child over and that an adult must help her on the swing at all times.

That should take care of the insurance risks from swing accidents.

And of course theres always tie up the swing and/or get a fence.

Then enforce the policy, and tie the swing up to the tree if need be.

-- Rick K (rick_122@hotmail.com), April 15, 2001.


Don't worry, be happy. you can't stop people being the way they are.

-- Fred (me@here.net), April 15, 2001.

Dianne, Your swingset, chickens, etc. are considered to be an "attractive nuisance (hazard)" and a fence would sure help reduce any likelihood of someone coming onto your property and getting "hurt." I would suggest you put up a fence, inform the neighbors that you were afraid that their child will hurt herself on the swingset and would appreciate if she did not use it without their supervision and your permission. Of course, being the good neighbor that you are, you would not mind her using it if they were supervising her. Check your homeowners policy. Most general policies only cover $2000 per incident. After that, the injured party would have to sue you and your insurance company to get more money. I also believe in "Good fences make good neighbors."

-- JoAnn in SD (jonehls@excite.com), April 16, 2001.

There is an old saying: Good fences make good neighbors. I live by it.

You are liable - even if you can prove that the child is there uninvited. God forbid something should happen when you aren't at home, and you can't even prove that the child was there uninvited. Get a fence. Its much cheaper than a lawsuit - and - your homeowner's insurance more than likely won't cover this.

Think about it... if you have a pool, and its all fenced, etc. but you leave the gate lock open, you are still liable. Wouldn't that cover most anything else in the yard as well??

-- Sue Diederich (willow666@rocketmail.com), April 16, 2001.



Don't know how it works there, but here dividing fences are a right, and each party is required to contribute half the cost of a reasonably-constructed fence. If either party wants more than the average fence, then they have to pay the extra. If this sort of arrangement is in force there, then you could either get half the cost covered, or alternatively get the neighbour to sign an agreement that they will be responsible for their daughter OR GUESTS if they cross the boundary. Still wouldn't ease your conscience though if the child was injured on your property.

-- Don Armstrong (darmst@yahoo.com.au), April 16, 2001.

I'm a only paralegal (so this is not to be considered "legal advice") but we have had simular situations occur with our clients. Every state and community has differant laws governing this issue, but in in general, you would be liable for any injury incurred by anyone on your property for whatever reasons. First thing you need to do is to be sure your homeowners insurance is in order and that you carry a minimum of $1 million coverage. Especially in children, jury's tend to award very high awards where there is scaring (especially facial, arm or legs -- especially in girls) or permanent injuries where the person could not perform there usual day-to-day duties. Million dollar settlements are not unheard of any more and medical bills can hit $40,000-$100,000 in no time in a serious injury or when plastic surgery would be required. The fence would not be a very good idea at all as well as a sign designating no trespassing along with the phrase "we will not be responsible for damage or injury". Be sure the sign is posted in several locations easy to see. Also send a letter "certified mail" to your neighbors. Very gently and kindly explain that although you love children and thier little girls is so sweet, you are very concerned about her getting injured. Be careful in your wording. Show that your concern is not for your liability but your concern is for thier daughter. Also makes for keeping the neighbor's happy. Keep a copy of the letter and the green certified mail reciept. Shows they did recieve the letter. This will be VERY valuable in case you are sued. Take a photo of the sign in clear view with a camera that imprints the date and time on the photo...long before injury occurs. This way you can show that in all the foregoing, you took all responable and expected precautions to avoid an injury. This may not prevent you from being sued, but your insurance will cover cost of mediacals, etc. of the injury and a jury probably would not award more than you are covered by insurance.

-- Karen (nascargo3@msn.com), April 21, 2001.

Ooops, I mean to say "the fence would be a VERY good idea"...that's what I get for rushing to finish the post!

-- Karen (nascargo3@msn.com), April 21, 2001.

Karen, Thanks so much for all your valuable information. These neighbors have lived next door for going on 3 years. When they first moved in the child was two-ish and wasn't allowed outside by herself. Now that she's five, she's all over the place. I can't seem to go out into my own yard without her coming over. While her parents are very nice neighbors and I do like them, I do wish they would instruct the child to stay in her own yard. Last year, she came over and opened my chicken door (without permission) and let the chickens out. They nearly ruined my garden before I got home to shut them up again. (Completely lost the peas!) I did speak the the parents at that time and of course, they instructed the child to not do that again, but she still comes over, whether we're home or not. Anyway, I'll take all your suggestions to heart and begin preparing to protect myself. Thank you again for your kind response. Sincerely, Dianne Bone

-- Dianne in Mass (dianne.bone@usa.net), April 21, 2001.

Hi!

All of these suggestions have been very helpful, to us, too. We are having a very similar problem with our neighbor children. We have a few boys of our own and it's nice for our boys to have someone to play with, however, neighbor courtesy is very one-sided at our end. We make sure our children never leave our yard without permission from us and cannot go in our neighbor's yard without being invited. Our children have done great with our rules. The neighbor's children are very nice children, and we know that the parent's are the one's that are not enforcing similar common cosiderations and courtesies. We can be in our living rooms, in our pajamas and next thing you know the children and mom are in our yard waving to us. We love the set- up of our window, overlooking our yard, with no neighbors behind us. We enjoy our privacy, as many people do. However, this is a regular thing to be walking around every single day with them out there...uninvited and obtrusive to our privacy. Liability is one big issue, however the idea that our privacy is in the past is an awful feeling...until we figure out a way to handle this uncomfortable situation. Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

Thanks, for the ideas and keep them coming!

-- Elizabeth (momsfourboys@ivillage.com), June 09, 2001.



Insurance covers you for what is NOT protected by law. If you are poor, or have very few assets, you are more or less "judgement proof," so insurance may be a waste of money. Look at people like OJ--sued for millions but he still has a nice house, etc. I think by law (not a lawyer though, but someone reading this forum probably would know) some assets are protected, like retirement accounts, etc. I think also that they can only take it in some percentage of your income (25-30%)? A place like www.nolo.com (for Nolo Press) would probably know. I also think the fence is a good idea, because children can never be held accountable. As for "we are not responsible signs/contracts, etc" I believe that you cannot prevent anyone from suing. Look at all the suits over amusement rides. Whether they can collect is another matter. We had a similar situation when I was younger. A neighbor child would ride his motorbike in front of their property, up our dirt road for a bit, then thru their backyard like a little racetrack. My parents asked the parents nicely to please not have their kid do that, because it wasn't safe, etc., and they accused us of not being "neighborly". We put up a fence, and they refused to talk to us after that, except to later try to get us to take down OUR fence to get to their backyard with a truck--something they could no longer do because they extended their ranch house to where they no longer had backyard access from the other side. They even went to the city to try make us take it down. The city just laughed at them. Just goes to show what people will do these days.

-- GT (randomnotznospam@yahoo.com), June 25, 2001.

Thanks for the good advice. Right now, this neighbor is in deep trouble with our town for by-law violation and is getting ready to sue the town for harassment. In addition to his daughter being a problem for us, what he's doing in his backyard is having a direct financial impact on our property value. He's operating a business from a residential-zoned property, he also has nine BIG trucks parked in his yard in various stages of dis-repair plus he's allowing landscapers and road construction companies to dump yard waste and broken asphalt on his property. What a mess! He did tell me this weekend that he'd put down a deposit on some land in NH and may be moving soon if he can't get the town off his back.

Thanks for all your suggestions. Right now I'm just going to wait and see what happens.

-- Dianne in Mass (dianne.bone@usa.net), June 25, 2001.


Found a webpage for what people can and can't get in a lawsuit. It varies by state. You might want to look at putting your own assets into a legal trust to protect them--read up before seeing a lawyer. The Nolo Legal Encyclopedia is very useful. YOUR NEIGHBORS may or may not have assets that you can go after--after all, you are no longer able to "quietly enjoy" your property and you have a right to that. As far as devaluing, I think that is harder to prove, real estate being what it is, and you are not actively engaged in trying to sell your property. http://www.nolo.com/encyclopedia/articles/cm/dontsueunless.html

You could videotape your yard as it is, and his as well to document the problem, as well as send a letter (certified return receipt) offering to pay half the cost of a fence, as well as an offer to go to neighborhood mediation. You may as well detail the ENTIRE problem to them, trucks and all. Keep that reciept and a copy of the letter as proof of delivery. You might even send a copy (certified return receipt) of that letter and the video (or bring it in person) to the code enforcement office. Also, you can demand that the city enforce its own code enforcement laws, or....another lawsuit! *grin* Hope this helps.

-- GT (randomnotznospam@yahoo.com), June 25, 2001.


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