A sad thing(social commentary)

greenspun.com : LUSENET : Countryside : One Thread

Among other things I've started a new job about two months ago. I deliver pharmeceuticals to nursing homes. I was talking to one of the nurses tonight and mentioned that in a conversation with one of the aids I learned that many of the residents there had been there for more than twenty years. I was kinda surprised and asked "Who pays for their care?" She told me it was the county and medicaid.

Then she went on to tell me a little history. That particular home is a county home that used to have a farm attached to it and many of the long term residents actually worked on the farm, taking care of the animals, doing farm chores, large scale gardening etc. She said they were much happier and healthier then because they had some purpose in life, felt needed and were getting some meaningful exercise.

I asked, if it was so popular with the residents why was it discontinued. I guess someone thot it was a bad idea because they couldn't pay the residents and without being able to pay them it almost amounted to slavery in the eyes of some.

I can actually understand that reasoning, especially in these days of hypersensitivity over just about any "just" cause. It would be a lawsuit waiting to happen.

On the other hand to me the genuine welfare of the residents should rank higher than anything else. The home is there to help the residents rather than merely warehousing them isn't it?

Things like this cause me to shake my head in bewilderment and wonder if humanity will ever become wise and less contentious. The do-gooders say look at them, exploiting those handicapped people and making them work like dogs. We gotta put a stop to this! (Well meaning but foolish liberalism, Compassion without wisdom?)

Others say, well we could ask the residents but what do they know? They're not in their "right mind" and are therefore incapable of knowing what they like, don't like or whats good for them. (Well meaning but arrogant paternalism?)

And yet others say, pull all funding from this socialist scheme and make them fend for themselves. If they can work on a farm they can wash my car windows on the street corner. (self righteous, neo-fascist conservatism or economic darwinism?)

And last, there are some who would actually, intentionally exploit them. (just criminal or pragmatic capitalism?)

Just about every social issue we discuss here or in real life has many facets and perspectives. Some, imo, are better informed and better thot out than others but even the obviously ignorant sometimes have a ray of light to shed on the problems.

I do not believe the conservatives have all the right answers any more than the liberals do. Each point of view has some validity to it and the sooner thats recognized the better off we'll all be. Do we seek a balance now by acknowledging the other might have some genuine insight to a problem and work within the parameters defined by that thot or do we ignore the facts the other side has going for it and steadfastly stick to our ideology?

-- john leake (natlivent@pcpros.net), November 01, 2000

Answers

and just what may i ask does this have to do with homesteading

-- Bob Condry (bobco@hit.net), November 01, 2000.

It has to do w/ the world we happen to share. We fund these, and other institutions that are equally distressing. Surprisingly, many folks are not aware of all that goes on out there on the amber waves of grain. Where your tax dollars go is of intrest to most folks. Or should be, since only about 15 cents on each dollar collected gets spent on those who need it most. john

-- john in s. in (jsmengel@hotmail.com), November 01, 2000.

Hi John, You've touched upon something near to my heart.I used to work in a nursing home;my best friend died in one(cancer);and my daughter and I used to visit the residents.They were such a blessing to us,and I know many of them would've greatly enjoyed such a thing as you at first described.One little lady had a large painting hanging on the wall of her room-the painting was of her farmstead.She couldn't look at it without getting a tear in her eyes;she missed it so much.The ladies especially love when people would give them bunches of snap beans;You oughtta see them go to town on those beans.They put me to shame.As to anyone who could figure that they aren't in their right mind...,it's obvious that they haven't spent much time with the residents.Most are "all there" and how!Even those that don't seem to be know more than most would imagine.I think of one little lady who had had a stroke.She lay in bed all the time,couldn't talk,generally gave no indication that she heard you when you visited other than the fact that occasionally her eyes would fix on you for a while.A friend and I would bring her wildflowers and set them where she could see them.Then we'd sing to her a bit and read to her from the Bible,talk about this-n-that abit,tell her about the Lord Jesus and what he did for her,pray with her and for her,hug her and go out to visit others. It seems that as we visited more often;she would look at us more&more. Just sorta gaze upon us nearly the whole time.We would share with her again in some way about the Lord.On our last visit with her,as we shared with her and prayed with her,we noticed tears coursing down her frail face.She looked peaceful,yet those silent tears flowed down her precious cheeks.We weren't quite sure what to think of it,so we stayed a little longer.Holding her small,gaunt hand.We left her with more gentle hugs and went on our way.We never had the chance to visit her again.She died not too long thereafter.I hope and pray that I will see her in Heaven.

Sorry if I've rambled.God Bless,~~~Tracy~~~

ps-John,I know theologically we disagree immensely,that aside for the moment,I think you are a real sweetheart for posting this.Thank You!

-- Tracy Jo Neff (tntneff@ifriendly.com), November 01, 2000.


Bob, it has everything to do with homrsteading, unless you have figured out how to avoid becoming old yourself. Unless you are going to "walk out on the ice and die" as in old Eskimo culture, you will be in need of extended care at some point in your life. Don't you care about the quality of your life at that time? I know folks don't like to think about such things, but they should, there has to be a better alternative to "traditional style" nursing homes. Thanks for the insightful post, John L., Annie in SE OH.

-- Annie Miller (annie@1st.net), November 01, 2000.

John, We have a county jail here that had extra land and the cook and trusty staff worked a good sized truck patch to supplement the jail larder, reducing food expenditures that could be used to upgrade conditions at the facility. Maximum security prisoners complained they were "left out" of the voluntary garden work. The result, it was deemed unfair, no garden fresh food for all, no funds to help with condition upgrades, nothing for the prisoners trying to improve themselves to look forward to. It just doesn't make sense.

-- Jay Blair (jayblair678@yahoo.com), November 01, 2000.


Thank you, John for the lovely post. I surely agree that common ground and open minds and hearts is what we all need to find. And to Tracey: I know your heart was filled with love for this old woman you so eloquently described. However,I am hoping that she was someone about whom you knew enough to be certain that your visits were appreciated! I was just imagining myself in her position, completely helpless and unable to express myself, having a stranger come into my room on numerous occassions, giving me religious services that I would have no interest in, and to which I would love to have had a chance to participate in a lively discussion about. I guess it would be akin to you lying in that bed, helpless and silent, and having someone unknown to you come in to regularly talk to you about how you should convert to hinduism before you die,because it will make you happy and otherwise you will come back as a frog. Just a thought....about openess.....and respecting the beauty and importance of our differences....blessings, Earthmama

-- Earthmama (earthmama48@yahoo.com), November 01, 2000.

I am not critical of the farm the once had there, but what I want to know is if these people are able to be up and around, why are they in the nursing home? My guess is their families just don't want to be bothered with them. A few may not be in their "right" minds, and may need watching 24/7, but it seems to me that most were just abandoned by their families. I know that often people in the nuring homes do have a condition that needs more than can be given at home, but still, if they were able to work on a farmstead.... I think the government paying for their care is why no one wants to bother with Grandma or Grandpa any more. If the families had to pay for themselves, the old folks wouldn't be such a bother.

-- Green (ratdogs10@yahoo.com), November 01, 2000.

And Bob, if you are unhappy with this thread, look up the list and check out the one about women shaving or not shaving their legs. Sheesh!! I'm about ready to quit this forum.

-- Green (ratdogs10@yahoo.com), November 01, 2000.

Excellent post, John!! I believe that, as the Baby Boomer generation ages, elder care is going to be a tremendous problem for this country. I have read that by the year 2020 the number of Americans over age 65 will outnumber children. With the medical technology available to us now people are living longer. I don't think we will be able to count on Social Security to be available to take care of us financially by then. Not very many people that I know of are able to save money for retirement, it takes everything a person makes to take care of your present needs. Those with retirement funds through their jobs, those funds are tied up in a volatile stock market. Who will be shouldering this burden of elder care? In my area, there is a farm set up for mentally handicapped adults, much like you were talking about. They also run a commercial greenhouse business to bring in money and teach the residents a skill. Local people are generally happy to buy their plants from them to help out and donate to a worthy cause. I agree with you, the people in a nursing home would definately benefit from the fresh air, sunshine, added nutrition and exercise. And caring for animals is good for the soul, especially for those who have no one around who cares for them. Many of them probably grew up with that kind of lifestyle, and would like to have the opportunity to VOLUNTARILY contribute to a living environment like you suggested.

-- (trigger@mcn.net), November 01, 2000.

I have a feeling that the really long term residents of the home John mentioned may have been mentally handicapped -- the county homes, prior to being forced to disgorge their population into the streets, housed anyone unable to take care of themselves, not just the elderly or seriously ill, as is now usually the case. Of course, those long- term residents may now be elderly themselves. John, could you clarify this for us?

-- Kathleen Sanderson (stonycft@worldpath.net), November 01, 2000.


Hi again everyone!

I thought perhaps I might've come across wrong.Earthmama,I wouldn't force my beliefs on anyone;I feel that would do harm rather than good.However,given the opportunity to share I will gladly do so.You were right that my heart was full of love for this sweet,elderly woman.We were the only visitors that she ever had,and once she realized we were there to see her(it took several visits-we only visited once a week)her eyes would search for us and seemed to feast upon the sight of us.[I forgot to mention that the volunteer director (not a Christian)told us that this sweet lady needed visitors.]Our visits were never long for we had many people to see and many wildflowers to deliver.I think my description of them made them seem long perhaps.If ever we got the indication that someone didn't want company we politely,apologetically,and kindly left.Oftentimes,we weren't led to share anything more than a merry visit,wildflowers,and a brief prayer.We were there to show the love of Jesus to those dear people in whatever way we could-not to collect souls as scalps.

Thanks again John for posting this;I hadn't realized quite how much I missed going there till now.Perhaps I'll drop in soon and run the idea of a garden past the volunteer director.Wouldn't that be so wonderful for the people there?!!!

Oh!Anyone so inclined,I've never had a resident that didn't relish those little wildflowers!Even the men loved them!Perhaps someone else might want to bring some to some lonely,and not so lonely,but appreciative people come spring&summer.

Bye again,~~Tracy~~

-- Tracy Jo Neff (tntneff@ifriendly.com), November 01, 2000.


Re Earthmama's response to Tracys posting: As Christians, we are commanded by God to share His Word with all people, therefore there is no such thing, to us, as being sensitive to peoples' beliefs or preferences. On my deathbed, helpless and unable to speak, I would pray for the Hindu that was trying to convert me and welcome the opportunity to do so. Christians are just not into being "sensitive" or "tolerant" of differences when it comes to either obeying or disobeying the Lord. This does not mean that we force our beliefs upon folks, because our job is only to present God's Word. It is very hard for non-Christians to understand that we have an order from God to preach His Word, and what other folks think about is is frankly, irrelevant. Hope this clears up your understanding of why we do things like Tracy, even though many people are offended by such actions. God Bless.

-- Lesley (martchas@gateway.net), November 01, 2000.

Lesley, you have summed it up perfectly! Thank You!! And Tracy, you are a faithful servant and a great witness for the goodness of Christ! God Bless! Wendy

-- Wendy@GraceAcres (wjl7@hotmail.com), November 01, 2000.

Green, re: leg shaving post. Agreed, the forum lately has been readking like a teen magazine these days. (I'm guilty of some of it!) However, I found that post to be somewhat refreshing and in some ways more enlightening than the political threads that are multiplying like rabbits on this forum these days. Sheesh is right! How many times can you write about your favorite candidate and why the other candidate is the anti-Christ?

John. I am pondering this. I don't mean to dis your post by my answer here, but I wanted to make a point as well. Apologies, and I will return when I can post on-topic.

-- sheepish (rborgo@gte.net), November 01, 2000.


Hi John, Are not these the very same farms that were called POOR FARMS sometime before WWII? I expect the name had something to do with the liberal politicians doing away with them after all we can not have old Uncle Mike or Aunt Jane living on a POOR FARM. The name nursing home is much more Yuppiefied, even though it is a sterile environment at best. In a similar context, much like the upwardly mobile look down their noses at "homesteaders".

-- JLS (stalkingbull007@AOL.com), November 01, 2000.


Not So Quick (True) Story: My neighbor (Marie)'s Great-aunt had dementia, but that didn't stop Marie from visting the old woman several times a week, at the nursing home. Marie would vist with the grandkids, the dog-the other patients would see Marie coming, and be excited akin to a circus-which it usually was! Marie made arrangements with the NH directors and brought as many as 8 'patients' home, to her home (day trips)for the holidays, because so many of them, didn't have families, and no one to 'take them home'. When Marie's Great-aunt died the nursing home offered her a position as activities director at a very handsome salary! Thats not all, one of the 'patients' begged Marie to "take me home forever, and I'll leave you my fortune", by this time Marie and her family were so fond of 'Miss Lady', that it mattered little that her 'fortune' was a box of buttons, and her Social Security/Medicare didn't cover her care. Miss Lady had joined the family. She loved the garden, the grandkids, was suprisingly good at poker, and when she died after 6 remarkable years, left Marie over a million dollars.

-- Kathy (catfish@bestweb.net), November 01, 2000.

Not So Quick (True) Story: My neighbor (Marie)'s Great-aunt had dementia, but that didn't stop Marie from visting the old woman several times a week, at the nursing home. Marie would vist with the grandkids, the dog-the other patients would see Marie coming, and be excited akin to a circus-which it usually was! Marie made arrangements with the NH directors and brought as many as 8 'patients' home, to her home (day trips)for the holidays, because so many of them, didn't have families, and no one to 'take them home'. When Marie's Great-aunt died the nursing home offered her a position as activities director at a very handsome salary! Thats not all, one of the 'patients' begged Marie to "take me home forever, and I'll leave you my fortune", by this time Marie and her family were so fond of 'Miss Lady', that it mattered little that her 'fortune' was a box of buttons, and her Social Security didn't cover her care. Miss Lady had joined the family. She loved the garden, the grandkids, was suprisingly good at poker, and when she died after 6 remarkable years, left Marie over a million dollars. Now, for those of you that don't understand-'Miss Lady' had been paying for her own incarceration all along, what the woman needed was a family.

-- Kathy (catfish@bestweb.net), November 01, 2000.

My ending to the previous post was lost in cyber- 'Miss Lady', had paid for her own care at the nursing home.

-- Kathy (catfish@bestweb.net), November 01, 2000.

I work in a nursing home as a social worker,I would say about 40 of my 150 residents could live at home if there was somebody to watch them and cook there meals. We have about 95% county patients, some private insurance. I know for sure a lot of my people would love to garden, but the rules and papers you have to fill out to do some- thing as simple as putting some plants out is unreal. so much of nursing home care is government regulated it is hard to get past that to get to the real meat of what you want to do. The activity dept has so much paper work to do out of 4 people in the dept only one actually does activities.There is a program called The Eden Alternative it is put in place in nursing homes and the idea s to put plants , gardens,animals birds and let the residents who feel like it take care of all this.Of the nursing homes that have tried it they have found a decrease in the amount of medicine the people took and just better health in general.The clincher is you have to get the administer to go along with it which is impossible to do in most cases.Ibelieve if people werent so hung up on material things and didnt have to work so many hours they could take care of Mom and Dad.This is not the ase all the time but it could be done a large part of the time. Roxanne

-- Roxanne Walden (hmstdlady@webtv.net), November 01, 2000.

Dear Leslie, My understanding of "why we do things like Tracy" actually didnt require clearing up; I grew up in a home run by people like this. I am exceedingly familiar with the way they think. In fact, I was rather like them, until I began to see myself from a distance, as others saw me. I began to see that my heart, which I had so dearly believed was only filled with love and concern for my fellow humans and this was why I felt the need to persuade them to accept christ, was actually a fear-filled and arrogant place, and that the more vociferous I was in my witnessing, the more obvious was my insecurity. I could not see this when I was in the midst of it; it is almost impossible to see clearly when in a zealous state, in my opinion. I find it sad to hear things like this: " there is no such thing, to us, as being sensitive to peoples' beliefs or preferences." To me, this is totally contrary to what Jesus stands for above all else: love and compassion. I do not believe you can have it both ways. One cannot claim to love ones fellow people, and proudly claim allegiance to intolerance and insensitivity. My experience over the years is that people who are most turned off to Christianity, who are least likely to ever be converted, have become so directly BECAUSE of this kind of evangelical zeal. They see these people with hearts so closed and narrow, with minds firmly anchored and immovable to new ideas and all the wondrous expansions of the universe and the myriad fascinating people within it, that they will never come aboard. And this, in my opinion (for it is all my opinion, I claim no great wisdom or "truth"), is why I see it as completly counter-productive to winning people to Christ. I have neighbors down the road who are, to us, the perfect example of the sorts of Christians who win souls all the time. They treat everyone with equal respect and SINCERE kindness, regardless of their religious beliefs, political opinions, family arrangement, country of origin, etc. They are even kind to those who treat them badly. They have a lighted cross on their home most of the year, a statue of Jesus with lambs at their driveway entrance, always wear a cross necklace: there is no doubt of their spiritual affiliation. But the striking thing I hear from neighbors is ,although wary at first at these obvious signs of allegiance, they are astonished to discover that these people never talk about spiritual or religious subjects, unless one brings them up. In this way, we all around them feel their love is genuine, and not some path to indirectly lead us down their road. I believe their soft and gentle living an example of the love,non-judgement and open-heartedness of Jesus is what led me to Him as a teenager; and, in stark contrast, what I see as the current mind-set of most "Christians" I have increasingly encountered over the past 35 years since is what continues to turn people away from the church, including myself. Blessings, Earthmama

-- Earthmama (earthmama48@yahoo.com), November 02, 2000.

Earthmama, Amen! That's how I see it; that's how I think it; and that's how I try to live it, too. It's all about love.

-- sheepish (rborgo@gte.net), November 02, 2000.

Very well put, Earthmama. Thank you.

-- Joy Froelich (dragnfly@chorus.net), November 02, 2000.

Great speech, Earthmomma, love should have no preconditions required. Annie in SE OH.

-- Annie Miller (annie@1st.net), November 02, 2000.

Earthmamma, I do claim "truth" and with that, wisdom. Not the wisdom that this world values, but the wisdom that comes from my Lord, Jesus Christ. He has given us His truth in his Word. His word tells us there is ONE way to God the Father, and it is narrow. IF we are His own, we are called to proclaim that truth. That His harvest (not mine) may be plentiful. That many will not accept,is true. That some will, is also true. But to suggest that being sensitive and openminded, so as not to offend, rather than obey a clear command to proclaim the good news of salvation, is rather silly. Not to mention fruitless.

Your definition of love is certainly easier and more popular. It is also earthly in scope. The call of the christian is eternal in its scope. If you do not claim Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, then you can legitimately proclaim anything you wish, but to do so while laying claim to Christ, is akin to being a wolf in sheeps clothing. Accept it or reject it, but don't twist it, change it or distort it. God Bless! Wendy

BTW, in Revelation 3:19 Jesus says "Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline; be zealous therefore, and repent." Notice the word zealous. Bear in mind this is said to the same people whom Jesus has declared to be "neither cold nor hot" and because they are lukewarm, He says " I will spit you out of My mouth." I will take zeal anyday.

-- Wendy@GraceAcres (wjl7@hotmail.com), November 02, 2000.


Earthmomma, Sheepish, Joy, how do we respond to the above, makes my head hurt trying to even think about it........help!!!!! Annie in SE OH.

-- Annie Miller (annie@1st.net), November 03, 2000.

Sorry Annie, I can't think of anything that would not provoke an argument, and what would be the point of that? Based on my past experiences, in the end, no one has changed their minds about their position.

I guess I thought Earthmomma's point was akin to the "catch more flies with honey than vinegar", and I guess Wendy doesn't agree with that approach. Or maybe we're not even talking about the same thing!

-- Joy Froelich (dragnfly@chorus.net), November 03, 2000.


I forgot to say, I am hoping John will come back and explain more about this nursing home. Ya out there somewhere, John?

-- Joy Froelich (dragnfly@chorus.net), November 03, 2000.

Joy, your absolutely right,... let it be. Thanks, Annie in SE OH.

-- Annie Miller (annie@1st.net), November 03, 2000.

Keep loving Wendy, and she'll keep loving us, and one day we can hopefully get it all together. We are all seeing through a glass darkly, still...

-- sheepish (rborgo@gte.net), November 03, 2000.

Thank you Sheepish, sometimes (sometimes lots of times!) I need reminded of that. We are but a great work in progress. Annie in SE OH.

-- Annie Miller (annie@1st.net), November 03, 2000.

John, Don't know if the home could ever get their gardening activities back with the farm as you said due to govt regulation, but here is something for the residents. Volunteers could set up window boxes for residents inclined and able to tend em. If a number of them all took part , the hobby boxes could produce a few fresh veggies, flower bouquets and most of all fond memories and a little more independence and self esteem.

-- Jay Blair (jayblair678@yahoo.com), November 03, 2000.

Nice suggestion Jay. I'll explore that when there's a little time.

Joy: My time there at the homes is usually pretty limited as I'm on a schedule however from observation I'd say many of the residents are elderly, a few recovering from surgery, illness etc and the rest suffering from some kind of mental disorder. I've actually become kinda buddies with one or two of the residents, trying to take a minute or two to say Hi or minor chit chat. One in particular is autistic and unstable, even with meds.

-- john leake (natlivent@pcpros.net), November 04, 2000.


88

-- 88 (88@888.com), May 13, 2002.

Moderation questions? read the FAQ