y2k legal info needed, If y2k tanks the economy and I am without an income,how can I prevent the loss of my licence or freedom if I am unable to pay child support

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To all you legal eagles out there need guidence. A very Serious concern for all non-custodial parents. If y2k tanks the economy how can we protect our selves from losing our licences or worst our freedom if y2k leaves us without and income to pay our court order child support. Who out there is spearheading this serious public concern. Aclu and aclj seem to be very asleep at the wheel concerning the civil and constitutional rights violations of non-custodial parents.

-- concerned non cutodial parents (fathers rights not @ not.com), October 13, 1999

Answers

You will have to check your state's laws, but here, either parent may file for a child support modification if there has been "any substantial change" of circumstances, and if it has been more than 1 year from the time of the original arrangement or dissolution. In real english: if you lose your job, or take a big financial hit, petition the court to modify your support payments. Do it right away, as these payments can't be changed around retroactively. Check with your state bar association to find out where to get free legal help if you cannot afford it. Many counties have free clinics, and many counties also have offices that help people deal with their family law cases also for free.

Good Luck. Your mileage may vary, depending on your state's laws.

-- (formerly known as nobody@nowhere.wdt), October 13, 1999.


BE realistic! If things are so bad that thousands of non-custodial parents(read MEN) lose their jobs, that implicitly says that it's likely that there will be so many other survivalist issues and chaos present that there wouldn't be a hope in hell of having any redress/enforcement actioned against you.

Seems that the Feminazis might be in for some comeuppance, another "victim" of Y2K, along with the long list of other liberal idealist experiments that have been pursued with the zeal of a pogrom over the past 25 years. All I can say is that after hearing them flaunt that word "victim" so freely for so long, maybe they'll finally get to see firsthand how it feels to be one. Are all the rest of you out there so cowered that none of you have dared to mention it on this thread? Well, I just have.

-- profit_of_doom (doom@helltopay.ca), October 13, 1999.


No - you be realistic. Are you planning on NOT filing any tax returns, or are you advising others not to, because of y2k? So what's your defense going to be? "Oh, I'm sorry, Judge, I thought y2k was going to eliminate both you and the sheriff."

To all you wives out there married to husbands with support obligations if you ever hear your hubby say something like,"y2k is gonna take out the ex-wife and those support payments." . . . (1) get a large, cast-iron, y2k compliant frying pan, (2) tell hubby to "assume the position", (3) from a lateral position, raise the pan above your right shoulder (4) swing pan down while pivoting on feet (5) important - pan should impact while still accelerating swing.

Hubby lost job? File petition.

-- Magnolia (magnooliaa@yahoo.com), October 13, 1999.


Hey fucking looser,

As long as you are still able to draw a breath there is no reason your child (remember your child?) should go without.

-- 8 (8@8.com), October 13, 1999.


Concerned,

By all means support your children. I lived in a trailer for seven years and worked Saturdays in order to meet every imposition. After I was done with alimony I got a call from the DA telling me I owed more and the DA chick produced an order for more alimony which I had never received. Lawyers...

Contact this group for more info...From: ZOBOLI@aol.com To: undisclosed-recipients:; Subject: Citizens Arrest Judge in Marion County Date: Monday, October 04, 1999 10:24 PM

CITIZENS ARREST JUDGE IN MARION COUNTY FOR TRESSPASS OF TREASON TO CONSTITUTION

Citizens Arrest Judge in Marion County Roger Weidner arrested for the l9th time fighting judicial corruption Wilbur Gaston perfoms a Citizen Arrest on Judge Avera in Open Court

MARION COUNTY SHERIFF SGT. DAVE (THE THUG) McMULLEN STRIKES AGAIN, ARRESTING ROGER WEIDNER AS COURT WATCHERS LEAVE THE COURTHOUSE

October 1, l999 - Salem, Oregon

On September 30, l999, in Marion County, Oregon, an outraged group of citizens placed judge Fred E. Avera under Citizens Arrest for Tresspass of Treason to the Constitution and Misprison of Felony. Witnessing this arrest were courtwatchers from A Voice For Children, Oregon Judicial Watch, Constitutional Defenders and Grandparents Rights groups who have been actively confronting the corruption in the Oregon judicial system. Among the courtwatchers were l998 Reform Party candidate Roger Weidner, candidate for Secretary of State Carlos Luceros, Director of F.A.I.R. Velma Hartwig, and Oregon Judicial Watch President Pamela Gaston, and 20 supporters. Wilbur Russell Gaston was in the Marion County Courthouse in a trial with no jury to terminate parental rights of his ten year old daughter Melissa The OREGON OBSERVER has covered in previous issues the outrageous treatment of Wilbur Gaston, his ten year old daughter Melissa Gaston and his wife Pamela Gaston by corrupt judges, attorneys, SOSCF personnel and other public officials. Over the past three years the Gastons have proven in court: How Melissa Gaston was sexually molested in more than three of the eighteen foster homes she has lived in, burnt as punishment in one of the foster homes; How on the orders of SOSCF employee Larry Lawson a movie was made of Melissa dancing nude, sexually manipulating herself, by foster mother Hazel Spees; How Wilbur and Pamela Gaston have been repeatedly arrested and jailed for attempting to expose the criminal conduct of the judges, SOSCF officials, and others, who have been sexually exploiting Melissa Gaston. In an earlier edition, the OREGON OBSERVER reported that in April, l998, a Marion County Jury, hearing a criminal contempt charge against the Gastons, not only found the Gastons "not guilty" but found that certain Marion County judges, SOSCF personnel and other state officials, were conspiring against the Gastons. From all the informed people, the OREGON OBSERVER has talked to about this case, it has become apparent that the reason the STATE wants to terminate Gaston's parental rights, is to keep Melissa quiet, to keep Melissa from telling, in her own words, how she has been sexually abused while in the STATE foster home program. On September 30, l999, judge Fred E. Avera (Polk County) was presiding. In a previous hearing, before judge Avera, the Gastons had moved for a summary judgement on a Racketeering Complaint the Gastons had filed against the judges, SOSCF employees, and other public officials. In the earlier case the Gastons argued that a jury had found them not guilty because they had been the victims of a conspiracy involving the judges, SOSCF employees and other public officials. In the earlier case, the Gastons argued since the jury found the judges conspiring, in the criminal case, the Gastons were entitled to a summary judgement on that same issue in the pending Racketeering case. In that earlier case when judge Avera ignored the facts and ruled the Racketeering claim "frivolous", the twelve Gaston supporters present got up and walked out of the courtroom in disgust. On September 30, judge Avera first heard from the attorneys for the STATE, who were present to quash all of the subpoenas that the Gastons had served on Governor Kitzhaber, Attorney General Myers, and Chief Justice Wallace Carson and other STATE officials. Kitzhaber, Myers and Carson were subpoened because they hae knowledge of the STATE abuse of the Gastons for more than two years, and have refused to take action to stop the abuse. Judge Avera then asked Wilbur Gaston if he had anything to say..... Gaston then stood up and for fifteen minutes read a prepared statement setting forth the criminal behavior of the judges, SOSCF employees and public officials, in covering up, in sham hearings, the sexual abuse of his 7 year old daughter, Melissa, while she is in the custody of SOSCF. Two of Gastons supporters then stood and stated, on the record, that judge Avera had committed Tresspass of Treason to the Constitution and numerous other criminal acts, while hearing the Gastons cases. Gaston turned and addressed the Bailiff. "You have heard more than two people in open court, under the Constitution of the United States, charge judge Fred Avera with Tresspass of Treason to the Constitution. "You must remove this man from the bench. If you do not remove this man from the bench, you have violated your oath of office and are as guilty as he is, of committing Tresspass of Treason to the Constitution and Misprison of Felony". Gaston then read the relevant portions of Article 18, Sec. 4, of the United States Code "whoever having knowledge of the actual commission of a felony, cognizable by a court of the United States, concealls and does not as soon as possible, make known the same to some judge or other person in civil or military authority, under the United States, is guilty of the federal crime of Misprison of a Felony". Gaston then turned to the Bailiff again, and said, "will you interfere if I perform a citizens arrest on this man? I will not subject myself to be arrested performing a citizens arrest, as is my Constitutional Right, but on the record, in open court I am placing MR.AVERA under citizens arrest for the c rimes of Tresspass of Treason and Misprison of Felony, here before God and my fellow State Citizens of the Republic of Oregon. AS GOD IS MY WITNESS THIS CORRUPTION STOPS NOW." Gaston declared, pounding on the table, in outrage. As Gaston spoke, Assistant Attorney General Ted Meese, State appointed Attorney for Melissa Gaston Richard Condon, SOSCF caseworker Larry Perton, Assistant Attorney General for the SOSCF Staci Barry, Assistant Attorney General Trial Attorney Cynthia Botsios, and Assistant Attorney General for the SOSCF termination specialist Dina Vitolins, sat silent and red faced. Also in the court as Gaston spoke were the Marion County Sheriffs deputies Poston, Papenfus, Daley, Schultz, Olson, McMullen and Stai. When Avera threatened Gaston if he didn't stop talking he would be removed, Weidner had all the supporters stand in support of Gaston. As Gaston finished his statement of arrest of judge Avera, Weidner told the supporters to leave the court, that Avera was conducting sham judicial proceedings where the outcome was a foregone conclusion. As Weidner was leading the supporters out of the courtroom, Lt. Sgt. McMullen was holding the door and made a sarcastic remark to Roger Weidner, who then reminded McMullen that he is a public employee. As Weidner was nearing the front door, he turned and told his supporters to get the names of the guards present. McMullen approached Weidner, white faced with his handcuffs held in his left hand, shoulder high, ready to strike. McMullen then Yelled at Weidner "I am telling you to get the hell out of this building". Weidner responded "this is a public building, McMullen. I am leaving, but I will leave when I want to". As soon as Weidner spoke, McMullen violently grabbed his left arm, pushing him down, snapping on the handcuffs hard enough to leave red welts on Weidners wrists. As McMullen was manhandling Weidner, he snarled "I am getting sick and tired of you Weidner". As Weidner was being taken to jail, he said to McMullen "you are making a big mistake, McMullen!" McMullen responded sarcastically "you really scare me, Weidner!". This is not the first or even the second time that Dave (the THUG) McMullen, has attacked concerned citizens, courtwatchers who have been fighting the corruption in the Oregon court system. On March l9, l998, Gaston supporter and Family Freedom Press Editor DottiAnn Blakemore, a 50 year old church secretary and family rights advocate, was violently attacked by McMullen after she spoke in court to Gaston, who was being arraigned on a contempt of court charge. Gaston had been brought in shackled, and after Mrs. Blakemore said "we love you Will", McMullen attacked her and drug her screaming f rom the courtroom. McMullen and other sheriffs drug Mrs. Blakemore around the courthouse for 45 minutes with her clothes around her ankles, torturing and abusing a woman with impaired health and arrested her for criminal tresspass. On April l6, l998, Pamela Gaston went to the Marion County Courthouse to get judge Ertsgaard's signed order to protect Pamela and her nine year old son Kevin from the SOSCF retaliation. Judge Paul Lipscomb had earlier issued a memo barring Pamela from the courthouse. While Pamela was in Ertsgaards office, she had been followed in by McMullen, and told to get out of the courthouse immediately or she would be arrested. Pamela told McMullen she would leave as soon as she got the judges order. As Pamela approached Ertsgaards doorway, McMullen violently attacked her, threw her to the floor and maced her. It is outrageous and the OREGON OBSERVER condemns Marion County for allowing armed thugs like Lt.Sgt. Dave McMullen to continue to attack inncent citizens of this state who are fighting to restore Constitutional Rights to the citizens of this state. The arrest statement is printed below, and two concurred that judge Avera is guilty of the crimes of Tresspass of Treason to the Constitution and Misprison of Felony. This document, signed by thirteen people, now is in the hands of an office in the Pentagon of Military Authority to defend the Constitution under federal laws to prosecute this judge for CONSTRUCTIVE TREASON.

Editors Note: The Gastons and courtwatchers left the courtroom after arresting judge Avera and charging him in open court on the record. Avera immediately quashed all Gastons subpoenas, denied all Gastons motions, allowed previously discredited witnesses and perjured testimony that has been discredited in past hearings on the record, and unlawfully terminated parental rights of Wilbut Gaston, and stated that Melissa will be adopted out, as was a foregone conclusion that he would, as every ten other judges have before him. No matter what the STATE presents, it gets protected by corrupt judges acting in the best interest of the STATE regime. The Gastons have been told that Melissa has already been adopted out, before parental rights were terminated. All actions of the court are void, and will be dealt with in the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals, where the rest of the Gastons cases are now pending. The Gastons, in a press release two days ago called the "Killing Floor", described every detail of how the sham proceedings and Alice in Wonderland Court take the children from the families without due process. The court, and Avera followed their script to the letter in this hearing. After the termination was decided, a wave of fear swept the courtroom. Courtwatchers reported that counsellor Nancy Link, who has vacated her office without a forwarding address in the last month, requested armed guard to leave the courthouse. The other members of the court spoke to each other of being in fear for their lives, not of Wilbur Gaston, but of the people who are affiliated with him. Finally these criminals and perverts are realizing that they cannot make this go away by destroying Will Gaston and his family, and now the public outrage is a rising tide. The people are demanding their constitutional rights and accountability, now that they see how the SOSCF operates in these corrupted courtrooms. The Gastons case has exposed and documented the practices of concealling all evidence of STATE abuse as they routinely sexually abuse the children in foster homes and cover up these acts, and protect the criminals, to prevail in taking children from their families and profiting from this.

CITIZENS ARREST STATEMENT OF CONSTRUCTIVE TREASON AGAINST JUDGE FRED E. AVERA - SEPTEMBER 30, 1999

I wish to make a statement. Please, tell me this - is this a court? Thank you. Is this a court of record? Thank you. Are you a judge? Thank you very much.......

For the record, since this is a court of record and you are a judge, I wish to report a felony. If I don't, I shall be subject to fines and imprisonment under federal Laws. Under Title 18, USC, Sec 4, I wish to report to the court that you, sir, have committed tresspass of treason to the Constitution, by you denying us access to said Constitutions, denying us the rights protected by the Constitutions Article 3, Section 3, clause 1...

You are guilty of Depriving a free, white man, State Citizen of Constitutional Rights of ORIGINAL Article 7 of the Oregon Constitution; where "in all controversies a trial by jury shall be preserved" By obstructing justice with bias and prejudice to protect yourself, the STATE OF OREGON and fellow bar members from criminal exposure; By failing to protect a child while being kept in unlawfull STATE incarceration, criminally abusing, aiding and abetting child sexual abuse and conspiring with other STATE OF OREGON agents and authorities to destroy my daughter and my family; By conducting a court of unknown unConstitutional jurisdiction, using Statutes against a free, innocent State Citizen; using unconstitutional 4l9 "juvenile code" statutes to deprive me of my inviolate rights . You cannot regulate a human being. By conducting a court, to quote you "you are in juvenile court - there are no charges, there are no defendants, there are no juries" and to proceed against an actual parent, and sever the natural bond of the family body, having never charged me with a crime or convicted me of a crime, is an unconscionable violation of my due process of Law. Your authority for this proceeding does not exist. By allowing the STATE to prevail with complete disregard for undisputed court testimony - sworn confessions and a jury verdict that you are, along with other judges, committing fraud and treason in open court against the Citizens of the State of Oregon, as well as my daughter and myself. By using hearsay and previously discredited reports and witnesses whose lies were dismissed in open court in November, l996, when the case was exposed as lies and fraud, and the original petitions were dismissed.

By refusing to uphold subpoenas of critical adverse witnesses to be cross examined, even quashing the subpoena of Dep District Attorney William Howell, whose fraudulent, malicious, discredited, dismissed petitions have been holding Melissa for three years unlawfully. You have refused to uphold your oath to the Constitution and have intentionally and maliciously deprived me of fundamental rights and liberties guaranteed by the Constitution to be free from excessive government intervention and criminal STATE abuse. By refusing to answer all questions as to venue and jurisdiction. I cannot defend myself if I do not know what venue and jurisdiction I am in, and you refuse to make this clear to me. .Jurisdiction has been challenged,and what the court does beyond this is void if you continue, and you cannot lawfully proceed. . You are beyond the ninety day limit of ORS l.050 that you must answer questions before the court within ninety days or give a written reason for the delay, which has not happened. You refused to answer and tried to dismiss my motion, and there are mandated prison sentences for failure to answer or if you try to fabricate a document to appear that you have filed for an extension. You will answer to the people. (At least two people stand - state their names - I concur that he has committed tresspass of treason to the Constitut ion.) To the Bailiff: You have more than two people in open court under the Constitution of the US concurring treason - you have no choice - you must remove this man from the bench.....You do have handcuffs, don't you? You refuse? Title 18, Section 4, US Code, is MISPRISON OF FELONY - as the bailiff, you are now as guilty as he is.....ARE THERE ANY ATTORNEYS PRESENT IN THE ROOM? YOU ARE JUST AS GUILTY OF THE SAME CRIMES BECAUSE YOU FAILED TO STOP THIS MAN FROM COMMITTING TRESSPASS OF TREASON AND MISPRISON OF FELONY TO THE CONSTITUTIONS. "Who ever having knowledge of the actual commission of a felony, cognizable by a court of the United States, conceals and does not as soon as possible make known the same to some judge or other person in civil or military authority under the United States, is guilty of the federal crime of misprison of felony" 18 United States Code, Sec. 4

To the Bailiff: Will you interfere if I perform a citizens arrest on this man? I will not subject myself to be arrested performing a citizens arrest, as is my constitutional right, but on the record, in open court I am placing Mr. Avera under citizens arrest for the crimes of Tresspass of Treason and Misprison of Felony here before God and my fellow State Citizens of the Republic of Oregon.

I WILL NOT PARTICIPATE IN A COURT OF NO DUE PROCESS AND WILL NOT ALLOW MY RIGHTS TO BE FURTHER VIOLATED. THIS IS NOT A COURT OF LAW, NO CONSTITUTION, ONLY A KANGAROO COURT - A TRIBUNAL FOR THE SOSCF - I WILL IMMEDIATELY APPEAL INTO THE UNITED STATES NINTH CIRCUIT COURT ANY THING YOU DO BEYOND THIS POINT, AND WILL PROSECUTE YOU TO THE FULLEST EXTENT OF THE LAW. AS GOD IS MY WITNESS THIS CORRUPTION STOPS NOW.

DATED THIS 30th day of September, l999 in Marion County, Salem, Oregon

_________________________________ Wilbur Russsell Gaston, sui juris

I swear and testify before God that I witnessed the above citizens arrest of FRED E. AVERA in the Marion County Courthouse and demand prosecution of this corrupt public servant according to STATE and Federal Laws and Constitutional mandates for TRESPASS OF TREASON.

ORIGINAL SIGNED BY THIRTEEN PEOPLE ON SEPTEMBER 30 1999 \

-- Mark Hillyard (foster@inreach.com), October 13, 1999.



Cool. Stand up and be heard, or cower and be herded.

-- Will continue (farming@home.com), October 13, 1999.

I would have had a lot more sympathy for you, Concerned, if you had asked for suggestions on how you might support your children in a tanked economy. Why don't you begin by stashing food and other supplies for your children so that if you ARE hauled into court, you can show you made a good-faith effort to provide for those personal responsibilities? If what you're looking for is a way to avoid paying your unquestionable obligation, then I can give you the name of my ex-husband who knows how to do it. Good luck tracking him down, though, he's been out of sight since my son was nine years old.

P.S. If by license you mean drivers license--hell, I couldn't afford a damn car, even working several jobs to make ends meet and avoid public assistance! If you mean a professional license--then you should be making enough money to stash sustenance for your children.

-- Old Git (anon@spamproblems.com), October 13, 1999.


i am afraid that my ex will look at this as an excuse so that is part of why i am preparing for the kids and i ahead in anticipation of his child support possibly ending.

i would say to you dads or moms that are non-custodial and actually care about your kids (and aren't just looking for an excuse to avoid child support) this might be a good time to have a meeting of the minds with your ex spouse. maybe a good time to try to get along. get them to prepare, then tell them your concerns and make an agreement that if something does happen to you jobwise, that you will commit to actually working together to provide for the kids--maybe they won't be so quick to try to go to court. this is the biggest worry of custodial parents--is that you will skate and they will be left high and dry with kids and not enough resources to care for them. if you think you actually can skate on your obligations, don't count on never being caught--like some folks are doing. pretty risky strategy.

-- tt (cuddluppy@yahoo.com), October 13, 1999.


Pardon my skepticism when provacative threads (certain to engender a lot of conflict and controversy)are posted from previously unseen handles. It reminds me of that "why women shouldn't be in the military" diversion of a few weeks ago. Do you suppose this will get 50+ hits, too? As someone posted then, "Focus, people!"

-- (RUOK@yesiam.com), October 13, 1999.

Simple answer - child support & parental visitation are two seperate issues. Inability to pay support due to unemployment, depending on the state, will attach a portion of your unemployment, a percentage of what you draw. As a single father, with custody of my son, I have a support order against my ex-wife, who has not paid a nickel in the almost 5 years I have had custody. She doesn't have to pay a nickel until 30 days after she returns to work and is off public assistance. I'm not holding my breath for that to happen any time soon.

Despite this, she is entitled to reasonable visitation, a seperate issue, and one I don't fight, as I believe he should have contact with her. So don't sweat it... unless you do something to endanger the childrens health or well being, your financial situation has no bearing on visitation.

There are a lot of deadbeat Mom's out there too folks... if more fathers had custody, I would bet the percentage of deadbeats male & female would be pretty damn close. I personally know 2 other Dad's that have custody of their kids, and of the 3 of us, not one is getting a damn dime to help with the kids.

-- C (c@c.com), October 13, 1999.



The child support recovery service will go down just like the IRS. So don't sweat it! At the recovery service, each case worker has about 1500 cases to manage. They has no time to persue all of them.

As long as you pay some, they will leave you alone! They only have orders to go after those who pay nothing.

As for being hauled into court. I was issued a summons in 1986 and refused to show up. I'm still a free man and they have not bothered me since. I have been told that in a civil case, a summons is merely an invitation and not an order. If you don't show, there is nothing they can do. I have had traffic tickets since and all I get is a ticket and nothing is mentioned about the no show. So don't sweat it!

-- freddie (freddie@thefreeloader.com), October 13, 1999.


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