* 14 DAYS OF PREPS: you have about 90 days or less to effectively prep for Y2K

greenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread

INTRODUCTION

Preparing for potential Y2K problems can be overwhelming if you have just learned about the late start and slow progress of government and other organizations in dealing with their Y2K technology problems. Though there is not much time for those who would like to get ready, newbies need to "prep smart"; it is important to concentrate on the basics of survival: shelter, heat, water, and food. Without these basics, one's chances of surviving can be reduced to hours (depending on weather). Tackling the urgent challenge of prepping is also a lot easier than thinking about and shopping for everything you might want to have to make your lives more comfortable during an emergency. Once these first things are in place, you should proceed quickly to any second order of preparations that may make life easier. In this manner, you'll proceed from first things to the second order with a lot less anxiety about the safety of themselves and their family.

In this message, I will cover the following topics and subtopics:

There is a total of seven topics and subtopics (including the introduction) and each topic should take less than two (2) minutes to read. Generally speaking, there is a lot to cover, too much to put into one thread and expect someone to read down to the bottom. This message won't cover everything you need to know, but my intention here is to help you think about these topics and develop a plan of action for making preparations or helping someone else make preparations as quickly as possible.

The minimum of preparation should be for 14 days for you, your family, your pets, and whoever you know that may come to depend upon you in hard times. This 14 day recommendation is based on an assumption that public shelters can be organized and operating in a two week period in the event of intensive, wide-spread need for assistance in your local area, region, and nationally. Alternately, you may decide to prepare in such a way that you do not need to evacuate to a public shelter. Many on this forum are making such preparations.

FIRST THINGS

Shelter, Heat, Water, and Food. Without these first things, one's chances of surviving can be reduced to hours (depending on weather).  Most people have a shelter (they can "shelter in place" at their house, apartment, etc. If things get really bad (and I don't expect them to), you may need to make plans for a fall back shelter whether that includes seeking a public shelter (contact your local red cross unit and ask them what they their contingency plans might include), going to a neighbor or relative's home, or, generally, bugging out. Bugging out has been discussed in a number of threads (now located in the archives of the Timebomb 2000 discussion forum). If the extent of a disaster is such that you will be bugging out, you should now begin to coordinate your bug out plans with others in your local area, outer lyings areas, and elsewhere.

First Things: Heat: Introduction

Heat may or may not be a serious concern. It depends on where you live and how cold the weather gets around you, how well insulated your house is, and how much air gets in and out of the house. Where I live it seems to rarely get down to 20 degrees (30 being freezing).  Still, I find that my body temperature drops when I sleep and I am uncomfortable to sleep in less than 50 degrees with a good down comforter. I want to stay warm and get sleep-- whatever may happen.  I say that the solution or solutions will vary according to how long you guess that the power will be out, how long you will weather  persisting power outages in your home, and what you'll do if you bug out. I am told that over time, your body will adjust to colder temperatures (some number of degrees less than you normally prefer.  Nonetheless, can you make it 14 days?

First Things: Heat: Keeping Warm

There are lots of ways you can keep warm: wear warm clothing, wrap yourself up in blankets, and fire up a wood/coal stove, a propane stove, or a kerosene heater.  Wood stoves are the most expensive option; warm clothes are the cheapest solution. If you get a wood stove, for example, you also have to get the firewood and chop it up to the right size. This could be a $US 2000 or more proposition. A propane stove or kerosene heater are more affordable (usually not more than $US 250), but require ventillation, thus they may reduce the heating effectiveness of the fuel and require more fuel to balance out the loss of heat through ventillation. Some kerosene lamps may keep you warm in a tight space (like a bathroom) such as an Aladdin Lamp, Coleman lantern, or Petromax lantern. Wool blankets (Pendleton and Hudson's Bay Company have been recommended) and down comforters may help you get through high 20 and 30 degree nights. For clothes, wool is fantastic and the other cold weather materials used in snow suits, winter jackets, etc. Don't forget long underwear (silk long underwear from L.L.Bean is recommended), socks, and hats.

First Things: Heat: Links

Brian's Preparation Archives: Posts on Heating
http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=000rye

Five essentials to getting the most out of your woodpile
http://hearth.com/what/essentials.html

Chimney Safety Institute of America
http://www.csia.org

http://www.chimneys.com
http://www.chimneys.com

http://www.oillamp.com
http://www.oillamp.com


First Things: Water: Introduction

You can go three days without water, experts say. I found that I had a hard time on one hike in the Sierras after about 4 hours since I had had my last gulp of water. Probably, I was dehydrated before starting out. I was so desparate that I drank right out of a stream and was very lucky not to get anything. So from now on, you should consciously keep hydrated. That means a minimum of eight cups of cool, refreshing water not including what's in the caffeinated drinks and sodas that you drink. You'll also need to figure out how much water you need to store up, how to have access to it (well or whatever), or how to filter and/or distill potable water. Will you have water for 14 days?

First Things: Water: Health

According to the World Health Organization, contaminated water is the largest health problem in the world. Throughout the world, 50,000 human beings die every day to waterborne disease. The Center for Disease Control estimates that 1,000,000 people in the United States of America suffer health problems caused by microbiologically contaminated water each year. In the U.S., an average 1,000 people die every year from water-related diseases. Furthermore, waterborne gastrointestinal infections account for 80% of all diseases in the world. Health-related problems from chemical contamination is also a serious problem. Biological and chemical water-related health problems are expected to dramatically increase around the world as public water treatment centers seem likely to be temporarily disabled by Y2K technology failures.

The three natural biological water-related health threats are bacteria, viruses, and protozoa-- all of which are generally invisible to the unaided human eye. Bacteria are one-celled organisms that generally vary from 0.2 and 1.5 microns   (maximum 10 microns). The most common waterborne bacteria which cause infections include: typhoid, para-typhoid, dysentery, colibacillosis, and cholera. Viruses vary in size from 0.1 to 0.004 microns. While most a virus can pass through the smallest filter, viruses tend to adhere to particles in the water. Many filters can filter out these virus-carrying particles. Common water-borne viral infections include hepatitis, yellow fever, and poliomyelitis. Protozoa are one-celled animals; they vary in size from 10 to 100 microns. They can be carried by insects or in the form of cysts when outside of the human or animal organism. Water-borne protozoans that cause disease include amoeba, giardia, cryptosporidium, and malaria.

Chemicals (found in tap or well water) that may cause health-related problems include toxic chemicals, heavy metals, and common radionuclides. Among the toxic chemicals are trialomethanes, PCB, PCE, detergents, and pesticides. Some heavy metals to be concerned about may include aluminum, asbestos, cadmium, chromium, copper, lead, and mercury. A common radionuclide such as Radon 222 may be found in some well water in areas where Radon is a problem.

First Things: Water: How much?

The experts say that you need one gallon of water per day. I say that the number of gallons you need will vary and vary according to how long you guess that water will be out, how long you will weather out persisting water outages in your home, and what you'll do if you bug out. Let's start with 14 days of water after which we would all hope that the worst was over. Some of you will be amazed at how much water you would want (and still wish that you had lots more water!). Try to guess how much water you go through in an average day. And just because you don't do the dishes or laundry doesn't mean that your water use isn't many many gallons.

You'll need water for everyone in your house and whoever joins you to drink, bathe, wash dishes, flush toilets, and possibly wash some clothes like undergarments. Figure on one gallon per person per day for drinking and washing dishes, 5 gallons per day per flush, and about 5 gallons per day for a quarter load of hand-washed undergarments. Therefore, a party of five flushing the toilet three times per day and with one quarter load of undergarments to wash will need 70 gallons for drinking and washing dishes, 210 gallons for flushing the toilets, and 70 gallons for clothes washing. That's a total of 350 gallons of water (stored in seven 55 gallon barrels).

First Things: Water: Water Storage

Depending on where you live (house or apartment and city, suburb, or country), your access to water and storage capacity will vary. 350 gallons of water (stored in 55 gallon barrels in different rooms) will be about the maximum for second or higher floor apartments. Roughly, it is about 2,800 pounds of weight on that floor -- not to mention all your other stuff. If you are in a house or have a house with some yard, storage is less a problem and allows you several options: pond, above ground kiddie pool, well, etc. Let's say that the average cost of very large water storage solutions is about $US 1.00 per gallon. Generally, 55 gallon barrels for food and water storage can be obtained for less than $US 10.00 each from a soda, juice, or other beverage bottling plant.

First Things: Water: Water Treatment

There is a lot of debate about treating tap water (if you get city water) for storage. So check with your water provider and find out if you need to add bleach. There are also other chemical agents used to treat water for biological contaminants, but I would stick to bleach (chlorine) or use a filter. Dry chlorine, also called calcium hypochlorite has the added benefit of extended shelf life. Providing it is kept dry, cool and in an airtight container, it may be stored up to 10 years with minimal degradation. If you want to keep chlorine in larger quantities, this is the item to store (according to Bingo1). It must be ONLY 65% calcium hypochlorite, no additional anti-fungals or clarifiers. There are a variety of filters on the market. The Katadyn and Doulton-type filters generally provide "mechanical" type protection against Crytosporidium, Gardia, cysts, and spores. Filters that use carbon may be helpful as a chemical filter, but generally the run of the mill carbon-based filters have a short life and become a fantastic breeding ground for micro-organisms. In most cases, it is a good idea to boil your water for 5 to 10 minutes after it has been treated with bleach or filtered.

In an EXTREMELY well-ventilated area, (Hint: OUTSIDE!) add and dissolve one heaping teaspoon of high-test granular calcium hypochlorite (approximately 1/4 ounce) in two gallons of water, thus creating a liquid bleach solution which is the approximate equivalent of "Clorox" & other off-the-shelf bleach products. This solution can then be used to sanitize water as necessary. Five pounds of dry pool bleach (costing about $10-15) will make 640 gallons of stock bleach solution which will treat 640,000 gallons of clear water, or 320,000 gallons of cloudy water.

You can also get a filter such as those used by the Red Cross and other organizations such as the hand pump Katadyn, the British Berkefield Water Can, or the Seychelle Personal Water Filtration System. Katadyn and Doulton-type water filters can get very expensive, very fast. The hand pump Katadyn and Berkefield water can generally retail for $US 250.00.  On the other hand, you can take a filter with you... but not a well or several 55 gallons filled with water (each filled 55 gallon barrel weighs about 440 pounds). There are less expensive filters that generally use the same filter as the more expensive units. If you are interested in these less expensive filter units, you might consider the Seychelle Personal Water Filtration System. The Seychelle come as a plastics bottles or canteens and are good for 200 gallons. These are affordable (about $US 25) and may be ideal for your 14 day preparations or bug out bag.

First Things: Water: General Links

Brian's Preparation Archives: Posts on Water
http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=000vFW

Does anyone know where I can get the best price on water drums? An Older Forum Post.
http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=000VTq

Small problem with my 2 liter bottle water storage. An older Forum Post.
http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=000iLs

First Things: Water: Storage Links

Harvested Rainwater
http://www.greenbuilder.com/sourcebook/RainwaterGuide1.html

Storing Water
http://www.millennium-ark.net/News_Files/LTAH_Water_Store(3).html

How and where to Store Water
http://members.aol.com/keninga/water.htm

Collecting Rainwater
http://www.pol.com/people/jrobbins/roofrain.html

watertanks.com
http://www.watertanks.com/main.html

First Things: Water: Treatment Links

EPA: Emergency Disinfection of Drinking Water
http://www.epa.gov/OGWDW/faq/emerg.html

Purifying Water
http://www.millennium-ark.net/News_Files/LTAH_Water_Pure(2).html

Basic Survival Rain Water Filter System
http://www.baproducts.com/rainwatr.htm

The Solar Puddle
http://www.accessone.com/~sbcn/puddle.htm

Solar Water Distillation - Stills
http://www.solardome.com/SolarDome84.html

Water Purification - Links from RMSG
http://www.artrans.com/rmsg/water/pureh2o.htm



-- Stan Faryna (info@giglobal.com), September 14, 1999

Answers

CONTINUED

First Things: Food: Introduction

While some can continue to exist up to a month without food (and really have irreversible internal damage and health problems for the rest of their life), most people don't like to skip more than one meal and can get quite cranky about it. Without power, the frigerator and freezer food will go bad and if the grocery store shelves are empty, you'll be glad that you filled up your pantry or whatever. In fact, you should plan on nutritiously balanced meals that are rich in calories, vitamins, nutrients, and other essential things -- while you can still can enjoy them. Once you have a handle on the nutritional requirements of your household, pets, and guests, you can figure out how this works out in terms of canned and dehydrated foods and specific foods that you, your family, your pets, and your guests normally eat. Make sure that you are fully aware of food allergies and preferences. While it may seem that you have enough food in the cupboard or pantry right now to feed you and yours, please do not underestimate the general unpleasantness of people and animals that do not eat well during a time of high stress. In fact, it is unlikely that you have 168 twelve ounce cans of vegetables right now (which is about what a family of six may need for 14 days in regard to the daily recommended consumption of vegetables according to USDA guidelines).

First Things: Food: Calories and Nutrition

According to the USDA Food Pyramid, the daily ratio of servings of different food groups looks like this:

The USDA makes the following recommendations for caloric intake:

These caloric level recommendations were based on findings of the National Academy of Sciences and on caloric intakes reported by people in national food consumption surveys. Those that have pets will have a better idea of what amounts and kinds of foods are appropriate for their pets, therefore I am avoiding specific recommendations on nutrition and calorie requirements of animals. If you own pets, you may not be able to bring your pets to a public shelter. If facilities for pets have been set up, your pets may be kept separately in a stressful and infectious containment area. Therefore, you may decide on sheltering in place (in your home) or elsewhere and will need to make the appropriate preparations for more than 14 days.

First Things: Food: Cost and Calories

In their preparations for Y2K, some have found that food preps can get pretty expensive. Even if you buy it on sale, store bought canned food can become very expensive when you try to get the calories to match up with individual requirements. For example, one entire 12 ounce can of green beans on sale at $US .70 may have 80 calories. A mixed can of carrots and peas of the same size and sale price might only have about the same amount of calories. Therefore, if you have a family of six and are feeding each person 2 cans per day for 14 days, that comes out to 168 cans at $US 117.60. This may seem like a lot of food to you, but it only provides 160 calories per day to each person. In other words, you have to make up 1400 to 2600 calories per person in other foods.

One strategy for boosting the total caloric value of your Y2K food stockpiles (without spending a lot of money) is by including a good store of honey, syrup, pasta, olive oil, and vegetable oil. If you are making pan bread with each meal, for example, load it up with honey or dip it in olive oil. Include several servings of pasta per person at least one meal per day. Plan on making pancakes a lot. Fry as much of your food as often as possible-- especially if people are hauling water and chopping wood. Think about southern food and how many high calorie southern dishes evolved from old slave recipes-- slaves that often were short of food supplies and yet had awesome energy requirements due to their many difficult chores.

First Things: Food: Storage

Canned foods have various expiration dates. Typically, a can of vegetables is good for two years from the date of its canning. Fruits are typically good for at least one year from the canning date. Grains, sugar, and the like will usually store a year or too in a good bucket that was packed with nitrogen or carbon dioxide. Buckets that include food sealed inside mylar liners are even better. While dehydrated canned foods generally have a shelf life of ten years or better, they are more valuable for their storage life and vitamin content than their calorie content. Of course, the shelf life of both canned foods and dehydrated canned foods will be effected positively or negatively by temperature and exposure to sunlight. It is generally recommended that you buy canned foods that you already eat, or that you start including canned foods in your meals in order to adjust to digestive challenges that may be posed by an intensive canned food diet. While the ideal situation is if you can and dehydrate your own foods, this is a time-consuming chore that most people can not spare time to do these days. The point is that you know what you like and you know how to make it taste best to you.  Those that would like to incorporate living foods into their meals, might consider sprouting alfalfa and other seeds.

First Things: Food: Growing and Cooking

Food is a really big subject that includes growing and cooking in addition to storage, nutrition, and caloric requirements. Check out Sally's Y2K Kitchen for more information about cooking and planning Y2K meals. Check out Old Git's posts in the archives for a lot of info on growing things.

First Things: Food: General Links
Brian's Preparation Archives: Posts on Food
http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=000ryq

Brian's Preparation Archives: Posts on Food Storage
http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-one-category.tcl?q_and_a_p=t&a mp;topic=Year+2000+Preparation+Archive&refers_to=NEW&category= Food+Storage+and+Preserving

Brian's Preparation Archives: Posts on Growing Food
http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=000ryo

First Things: Food: Storage Links

The Food Storage FAQs Version 3.0
http://waltonfeed.com/GRAIN/FAQS/Default.htm

Walton Feed Info Page
http://waltonfeed.com/sitemap.html

Solar Food Drying
http://www.epsea.org/dry.html

National Food Safety Database
http://www.foodsafety.org

North Dakota State University Publications
http://ndsuext.nodak.edu/extpubs/foods.htm

Food Preservation Data Base
http://www.enter-2000.com/Tips/food_preserve.htm#basic

Food Storage Life
http://www.glitchproof.com/glitchproof/storlifofgro.html

First Things: Food: Related Books

Suzanne Ashworth, Seed to Seed

Mike and Nancy Bubel, Root Cellaring : Natural Cold Storage of Fruits and Vegetables

Jane Cooper, Woodstove Cookery: At Home on the Range

Barbara W. Ellis (Editor), The Organic Gardener's Handbook of Natural Insect and Disease Control

Carla Emery, Encyclopedia of Country Living

Dan Halacy, Cooking With the Sun : How to Build and Use Solar Cookers

Joseph C. Jenkins, The Humanure Handbook : A Guide to Composting Human Manure

Harriet Kofalk, Solar Cooking : A Primer/Cookbook

John J.Mettler , Jr., Basic Butchering of Livestock & Game

James Talmage Stevens, Making the Best of Basics: Family Preparedness Handbook

Steven Thomas, et al., Backyard Livestock : Raising Good Natural Food for Your Family


MAPPING OUT YOUR WISHES, GOALS, AND BUDGET

Time is short and your cash and credit may be in short supply too. How will you complete the first phase of your Y2K preparations? You know, first things.  It's likely that you won't if you don't it smartly. So be smart about
your preps; prep smartly. Get a pencil or pen and some paper (not now) and map out your wishes, goals, and budget. I know you can do it in your head, but you may not remember everything in a day or much less
a week. The first thing to do (once you have your list) is "x" out all your of wishes and re-evaluate your goals.

CHEEPING

You know what you need (you wrote it down on paper), you know how much each category is generally going to cost (you wrote this down too), and you are ready to go out and spend your hard-earned cash.  Depending on how much personal time you have to hunt down a good bargain and how much money you can afford to spend, you may want to... CONSIDER THE FOLLOWING (said in a Bill Nye, the Science guy, booming voice) ...

TOP 11 PLACES TO GET THINGS CHEAP OR FOR FREE

Number 11. Ebay (non-electric music boxes, used Hudson Bay Company 100% wool blankets, etc.)

Number 10. BJs, Big Lots, Costco, Kmart, Sam's Club, and Walmart (canned food and more)

Number 9. Sales at the local grocery or other stores (canned food and more: most yourdonites)

Number 8. Estate Sales (fireplace inserts, wood stoves, garden tools, firewood)

Number 7. Yard/ Moving Sale (gas-kerosene cans, kerosene heaters, firewood, and more)

Number 6. Public Storage Auctions

Number 5. Dollar Store

Number 4. Soda, juice, and food plant-factory (55 gallon food grade barrels)

Number 3. Store and Restaurant Dumpsters (food containers and more)

Number 2. Local Dump and Junk Yards (canning jars and lids)

Number 1. Your local Y2K nut (they'll have water, food, heat, and more: Y2K Pro) "Just be sure you contact the appropriate authorities to confiscate their guns and ammunitions, first."

Got any other ideas for the top ten cheapest places to get stuff? Send me an email at info@giglobal.com.

Cheeping: Link

Best Preparation Buys: A Recent Forum Message
http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=000xBy

additional links

Girl Scout's on Y2K preparations
http://www.girlscouts.org/girls/Why/Y2K/Y2K.htm
(contributed by FM)

Which Are Your Favorite Y2K Preparation Checklists? (For The New GI): A good forum thread
http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=000shh
(contributed by Diane J. Squire)

 

Good luck to you all, and God bless you.

Sincerely,
Stan Faryna
info@giglobal.com

 

Disclaimer
This document is created and designed to provide information on the Year 2000 computer date problem. It is provided with the understanding that neither Stan Faryna or any other contributors to this document are engaged in rendering legal, accounting, investment, spiritual, or other professional services or advice. Persons needing such advice are advised to seek private and personal counsel. The author and contributors are providing certain information that is, at the time presented, believed to be an accurate portrayal of facts. All information should be used as a general guide only and not as the ultimate source of information. The author and contributors shall not be liable and/or responsible to any person or entity with respect to any loss or damage caused, or alleged to be caused, directly or indirectly, by any information provided.



-- Stan Faryna (info@giglobal.com), September 14, 1999.

For further preparation information, click here to visit the TB2000 Preparation Forum.

How do you make spam interesting? Ask Sally at the Y2K Kitchen? If not, click here.



-- Stan Faryna (info@giglobal.com), September 14, 1999.
Stan, you may have heard of the Air Raid Wardens we had in Britain during World War II. It was their job to make sure people were in their shelters or basements when the dreaded air-raid warning siren wailed over the neighborhood and to see that black-out curtains were in place with no chinks of light showing. Those wardens saved many lives--and not a few were lost among their number as they carried out their duties. When I read the post calling you a Preparations Warden, I immediately associated it with those gallant men and women who braved exploding bombs, conflagrations and falling masonry to ensure the safety of their fellow citizens. Now I may get criticized for grouping you with Britain's Air Raid Wardens and insulting their service but, you see, I knew some of them and your personality reminds me very much of them--kind and concerned for friends and neighbors. Thanks for being so generous with your time and advice.

-- Old Git (anon@spamproblems.com), September 14, 1999.
Correction:

In this manner, you'll proceed from first things to the second order with a lot less anxiety about the safety of yourselves and your family.

It seems my latest version got lost in the machine and we only get a paragraph of the change and not without mistakes. I'll have to rewrite it again.

...

Old Git,

You are sweet, Git. Thank you. I hope to one day achieve the kind of courage and dedication that history remembers of the WWII preparation wardens. When I look around here, I see many courageous preparation wardens who keep up this forum of hope though the whistling bombs of hateful and unkind words fall all around. Thanks for what you do and what you have done.

Sincerely, Stan Faryna

-- Stan Faryna (info@giglobal.com), September 15, 1999.

Give me a break. How long does it take to get a months worth of food from Costco, for a family of 4? 2 hours??? maybe 3?

If you are new to y2k, you are better of going and buying some bulk items yourself and not listening to the nonsense on this board, put out by extremists. They start out sounding rational, but will slowly guide you to y2k vendors to buy overpriced items, that you don't really need.

Use common sense and ignore people infected with Millenial Madness

-- Super Polly (Fu_Q_y2kfreaks@hotmail.com), September 15, 1999.

F Q, this time you have gone too far! Your signature is disgusting enough, and your nastiness only adds to it. I hope that this alone is enough to alert newcomers to the fact that the others here who try to help them get started are of a quite different breed than you are. I live near and have had some lengthy conversations with Stan, and have read a half year's worth of his posts. PLEASE do NOT dare to say that this good man, or anyone else here, has the design in mind of trying to sell Y2K supplies to others! I have to laugh, because Stan hasn't been able to find the brochure of a DC-area man who sells bulk for me to buy from!!! What Stan has done here is a real service to other human beings, and if you are so pinched of soul as to mistake that motivation, then more's the pity on you. I have distributed his list to all askers at church, work, and neighbors, who cared enough about their families or themselves to wish to prepare for a time of great uncertainty next year, and it has helped them immensely. To Stan I here again express my thanks for this. To you I put one question: who pays you to do this dirty work here? Banks? Hill Billy's friends? And please note: Stan is man enough to sign his real name and address!

-- Elaine Seavey (Gods1sheep@aol.com), September 15, 1999.
F Q, another question: have YOU tried to shop for a month's food for a family all at once...financially, that is? Perhaps what they pay you to disrupt here is sufficient for you to do that, particularly if you haven't any dependents (and I cannot envision anyone with dependents being such a polly that they don't provide for them), but for many Americans who live paycheck to paycheck it is very, very difficult to do. They need to start NOW, if they haven't already, and they need to work industriously to do it also. Would you and your bosses prefer them to all rush out in late December, and create/add to the panic you are supposedly trying to forestall??? Get real, man!

-- Elaine Seavey (Gods1sheep@aol.com), September 15, 1999.
If this Fu Qeeng moron had seen how fast stores ran out down here before the storm *it* might be singing a different tune. Go ahead and wait til the last minute, then fistfight over a two-pack of D-cells, idiot.

-- Uncle Deedah (unkeed@yahoo.com), September 15, 1999.
Assuming Super Poly's expected 30 days of disruptions to water, food, gas, and electricity. But not necessarily a continuous 30 days of disruptions, but rather occuring over 3 months. Add to this assumption that you really didn't plan out your personal contingency plans-- you're just doing the basics. You are not waiting for the best deal or taking advantage of the different sales going on every week. And you are going to get this done in a weekend, because you don't have time to worry about the little things.

One month of ordinary non-perishable food, toiletries, etc. (not a diet of beans and rice and newspaper for toilet paper) for a family of six could easily add up to to $1000 from mixed visits to local Costco or Sam's Club and the grocery store. Or you could watch out for sales at the grocery stores over the course of time save yourself a hundred bucks or more.

If you are using about 4 gallons of water per day per person for this same family, you need twelve 55 gallon water barrels (used: a total of $120 from your local soda bottling company or new: a total ranging from $200-$800 from Sam's or a shipping company) +plus+ six 5 gallons buckets (hechingers or home depot: $30). Of course, don't forget the UHAUL truck for the 55 gallon water barrels and with mileage that will be at least $100.

A portable kerosene heater (new) costs about $200-$300. Assuming you don't have a cookstove or outdoor grill and that you can and want to cook outside, a double burner kerosene stove (new) could run $80-$150. A short aluminum Aladdin lamp (no shade) with spare parts costs about $120. I think kerosene around here is about a buck per gallon and you might plan on four 5 gallon kerosene-approved cans (about $10 each for the cans) will run you about $20.

A metal flashlight per two people that takes 4 D cell batteries (say good for 6 hours use per 4 D cell batteries) will run about $90. 240 D cell batteries will be about $80 at radio shack. Or one Baygen hand crank flashlight (Sam's Club) per two people at a cost of $200 or so. A Baygen hand crank AM, FM, SW radio for about $80 (Sam's Club or other) or a battery operated Radio Shack AM, FM, SW radio for about $100 and another $100 for the batteries.

Prescription meds, over the counter meds, medicine cabinet stuff, a good first aid kit, a good sized a-b-c fire extinguisher, two battery operated smoke alarms and batteries may run from $300-$500 or more depending on your prescription meds.

Super Poly's bill for getting his/her basic preps done next weekend: just over $US 2000.00 to somewhere around $US 3,400.00. Of course, Super Polly didn't plan on spending this much money (he/she has a few hundred bucks to burn), so Super Polly ends up getting a week's worth of groceries for the family of six and puts off his/her Y2K preps until he/she gets a tax refund come next April. Are you ready for Y2K?

Sincerely, Stan Faryna

-- Stan Faryna (info@giglobal.com), September 15, 1999.

First off, screw you both. MY E-mail is real, what the hell difference does my name make? The owner of this software asks that you not use fake e-mail addys. I don't. I can't say the same about most of the extremists.

Should I call myself Bill Simpson? or Janet Oragami? Maybe DiEtEr would be suitable? WHO CARES! Taking you up on your offer, Elaine I spent 2 hours and a total of $232.67 for 1 months worth of supplies for a family of four. But here is the freaky part. I don't plan on keeping them for myself. You see, there is a rather poor family down the street that wonders where they will get the next meal at the end of the month. They are always tapped, forget y2k. So these "preps" are going to mysteriously appear on there porch one morning. I refuse to selfishly hoarde while fellow human beings are just scratching by, less than 400 yards away. Don't tell me about the extremists, who are shilling for vendors or ARE VENDORS THEMSELVES are "doing a great service" Fuck them all! You say there are no vendors here? what about minnisota smith? that bastard charges Big Bucks just to TALK to people about y2k. Give me a break. I'll tear apart Stans little paper shortly.

-- Super Polly (Fu_Q_y2kfreaks@hotmail.com), September 15, 1999.

Ah Stan, I see you posted some more retoric while I was posting. What's the matter, have you changed your tune? I didn't say there would be 30 days of disruptions. my point was that I can buy twice the amount of "preps" you recommend in a few hours. Now you are talking about 30 day disruptions. You prove the point of my original post....ALL YOU ARE TRYING TO DO IS SCARE THE SHIT OUT OF INNOCENT PEOPLE, then lead them down the garden path. You are pathetic. You and the rest of the Tinfoil Sect. Let's anilyze your opening paragraph, shall we? you said: INTRODUCTION

Preparing for potential Y2K problems can be overwhelming if you have just learned about the late start and slow progress of government and other organizations in dealing with their Y2K technology problems. You start with "overwhelming" and "potential y2k problems" You aren't using FUD at all here, are you? "late start" and "slow progress" Well THAT sure is a big assumption! You need to learn how the government works! (it would take to long to educate you on that, go find out yourself) Though there is not much time for those who would like to get ready, newbies need to "prep smart"; it is important to concentrate on the basics of survival: shelter, heat, water, and food. Without these basics, one's chances of surviving can be reduced to hours NooooOOOOoooo; you aren't using FUD tactics here at ALL. Give me a break. You are a Gary North wannabe. Nothing more.

-- Super Polly (Fu_Q_y2kfreaks@hotmail.com), September 15, 1999.
Stan's stewardship here is a wonderful thing that undoubtedly has/will have helped many.

Too bad we can't say the say the same thing about the manic (or is that manIac?) detractors, huh? Although, I do think it's a good thing that the pollies have the ability to 'speak' to the forum also.

After all, what better way to expose idiots than to let them do it themselves?

Thanks again Stan.

-- Wilferd (WilferdW@aol.com), September 15, 1999.

After all, what better way to expose idiots than to let them do it themselves?

You said it Wilferd. You said it.

-- Super Polly (Fu_Q_y2kfreaks@hotmail.com), September 15, 1999.

Dear S. P. :

THis past weekend, my bride and I spent $345 at Sams in our area. We did NOT even come CLOSE to a 4 week supply of food, paper, soap, etc consumables. AT BEST what we accomplished was to fill in some holes, in the 6-8 weeks we have in the pantry, and extend it to 7-9. There are only 2 of us in the family. I FAIL to see how you could come up with 30 days for 200 and change. Always assuming that you are working with a greater than 1000 calorie a day diet, which would quite literally kill us.

Chuck

-- Chuck, a night driver (rienzoo@en.com), September 16, 1999.

What's funny to me is that I pretty much guessed right about how much money Super Polly spent on Y2K preps. And as for Super Polly giving any preps away-- his bags of beans and rice would have to be [grin] moth-ridden before he did that (or he really doesn't dig beans and rice). But like it or not and even if moth-ridden, I will wage one 16 ounce can of Solid Gold organic dog food that the Super Polly does not not give away his preps to the needy family down the street (his heart is two sizes too small for that). Ironically, he probably took notes on my little list of basics. His problem with the 14 Days of Preps is that he lacks the attention span to read it through in one sitting.

Laughing loudly! Stan Faryna

-- Stan Faryna (info@giglobal.com), September 16, 1999.

Yes, Super, I *did* say it.

And you continue to prove it. Thanks for being consistant!

-- Wilferd (WilferdW@aol.com), September 16, 1999.

The food went last night Stan. They have no idea it was me.

I know this will get me deleted for sure, but FUCK YOU. let me say that again.

FUCK YOU.

I hope you read this before Diane Queen bitch chops it off. Are YOU willing to give 230+ dollars worth of food to someone in need? You can take your can of dog food and shove it up your ass, fuckhead. That reveals WAY TOO MUCH about you. You wanna bet? I bet you there is NO WAY you will send relief supplies into the FLA/GEO area to help others get back on there feet after the hurricanes. *I* will. I have plans to send AT LEAST $500 that way, maybe more. Will YOU Mr. EXTREMIST belly up to the bar and match that?!? NO fucking WAY. You are all too selfish and WAY TOO busy thinking of YOURSELVES first. Screw you all.

CHUCK: I only purchased food and a few other items with that money. Yes, I know it would cost more for some other stuff. MY point was that Stan starts out trying to scare the shit out of the unsuspecting, then goes on from there. He builds NO CASE for WHY you need to prep for 14 days. THEN he moves on to some nonsense about 30 days of disruptions. (HUH? didn't he just say 14?) And its not 30 days continiuos (OK so you can't get a few things for a few days, you pick them up when available. what the hell is the big deal?)

This is a typical shill tactic. Its called the "insurance salespitch" (I'm surprised that one of the EXTREMISTS on this forum hasn't parroted THAT line yet!) Once Stan has his grip on people, he can start hustling them into the sites of the vendors. They just LOVE that!

BTW Stan the Man; did I mention Fuck You? I am done with this thread.

-- Super Polly (Fu_Q_y2kfreaks@hotmail.com), September 16, 1999.

Super Polly, take some Prozac man! You are getting all worked up over nothing.

-- Prozac Man (prozac@calmdown.com), September 17, 1999.
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