You all are wonderful doomser's, but all your effort has been in vain! The only way that you could have properly prepped for the "big fiasco" was to get almost every one involved. This did not happen! The doomser's are sick and tired of pollys, ready to kill, ready to let children starve, ready to run and hide, ready to sit back and feel proud when they continue to exist (as if the life style they will be existing within will be any fun anyway) while their knowledge, and leadership skills will be needed by the pollys. Where would we be now as a nation, if George Washington, General Patton, and countless others had been so selfish as to refuse to serve and share their expertise for the benefit of the pollys! There was an excellent post in my last thread that pointed out the difference between prepping and actually preparing. You may have stockpiles of food and water, but how long is it gonna last? Long enough???? How are you going to source food and water when your stockpile depletes? Now that you are ready to save your own ass for whatever length of time that you have prepped for, how's about some of you get ready to "source"! You will eventually have to return to those that you deserted and left behind and answer for your cowardly and selfish ways. Most of us are aware of what this country does to "deserters"! Anyone here have the balls?

-- Vern (bacon17@ibm.net), September 08, 1999

Answers

Quit swigging on the Mad Dog, Vern.

Please don't feed inebriated trolls.

-- Been (there@done.that), September 08, 1999.

Vern,

You're sick. And you ass*ume too much... or too little.

Many people posting here have spent time and countless hours in alerting their communities, friends and neighbors. What are you doing... for your family or neighbors? Except complaining... and pointing fingers.

Take a close look in your own mirror.

Diane

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), September 08, 1999.

Diane.............this ain't about alerting, this is about staying behind with the afflicted, to lead them, to help them, to console them, to be there for them, cause when you need to "source" when your stockpile depletes, they are going to remember you as much as you remembered them.

-- Vern (bacon17@ibm.net), September 08, 1999.

Vern, I don't have balls because I am a female...but I have the fortitude to care about my family and store months worth of food until I can PLANT nonhybrid seeds in the spring/summer to eat and can for next winter. I have 2 daughters 13 and 18 and a hubby who I LOVE and care about. If I can help others without starving ourselves I WILL. I had the fortitude to get onto 5 rural acreas with a stream and well. Maybe it will be so bad no one will want to live anyway. Maybe NOT! Maybe enough SMART people out there will store enough supplies to live and have some left over to help others. Maybe not! But life is a chance. Who says we are deserters? How about we are preparers. You seem like you are deserting life by not preparing. I truly hope you will take out some Y2K insurance and prep up! Then YOU can help others if possible. I don't know you but I CARE about you because you are a fellow (don't mean to be sexist LOL) Soul, human being.

-- Debi (LongTimeLurker@shy.com), September 08, 1999.

Vern,

You have a valid point, but I think I speak for the GI group as a whole by saying that "preps" are our best chance for survival. The scenario you have suggested is an "8" or better in severity. If this happens, you're right...there is little hope for long-term survival for anyone. BUT, if in fact we have a few weeks of "disruptions' in the Iron Triangle, we ( the GI's) may not have to endure watching our children, or our loved-ones suffer in the process. Look at it this way, if you are told by the local weather service that a tornado is approaching your city, do you stay in the living room and watch tv? If your oil engine light flashes "red," do you continue driving for the next hundred miles "hoping" that your engine doesn't lock up? I believe that the majority of "posters" here are doing their level-best to 'expect the best, but prepare for the worst.' Your "worst" scenario is "impossible" to prepare for, but anything less than an "8" is "possible" to survive with some careful preparations. Keep God close to your heart, friend........:) he has been known to work a few miracles!

Keepon

-- Keepon (vacillating@hourly.ed), September 08, 1999.

Take your medication.

That's right Vern.

-- no talking please (breadlines@soupkitchen.gov), September 08, 1999.

When you get on a plane, the stewardess instructs you that in the case of emergency to put your own oxygen mask on BEFORE helping others with theirs. Suggest you might think about why this is standard procedure and how it might relate to taking care of oneself before helping others.

-- marsh (armstrng@sisqtel.net), September 08, 1999.

Vern-No one can talk a polly into anything. I take full responsibility for my life and expect them to do the same. Stop whining.

-- Gia (laureltree7@hotmail.com), September 08, 1999.

Hey Vern,

Ever hear about survival of the fittest? It's Nature's way.

-- @ (@@@.@), September 08, 1999.

Vern,

Your getting yourself just a little too torqued up over an abstraction, son. The talk is just talk; there will surprises in store for all of us. Some of the people who talk selfish now will end up being the most helpful to others, and some of the people who sound so altruistic now, will be the ones doing their best to screw over everybody else.

If you think you can really make an accurate prediction based on pre-game bravado, then you're younger than you realize.

-- Bokonon (bok0non@my-Deja.com), September 08, 1999.

Vern's last thread was written by a depressed man. "Why bother", eh Vern.

This thread is full of anger and angst. Sounds like the "phases of grief" to me.

It's OK Vern, most of us have been through the roller coaster of emotion.

Most of us weren't as nasty though, but that's OK, cause you're good enough, you're smart enough, and gosh darn it, people like you.

Oh yeah, and as far as your smart assed remark about Washington and Patton, most everyone here HAS TRIED TO SHARE THEIR EXPERTISE! BUT THE POLLYS DON'T WANT TO HEAR IT! So get off of that.

-- Uncle Deedah (unkeed@yahoo.com), September 08, 1999.

I don't think there's anyting funnier than watchin' somebody loose there marbles on the inter-net.

-- CS Man (csm@smoke.com), September 08, 1999.

Vern, you remind me of an old Sally Struthers commercial for the starving. I contributed, but, looking back Sally wouldn't be happy until everyone on the planet died of starvation at the same moment. Equality you know. Reread Bokonon's post above.

-- Carlos (riffraff1@cybertime.net), September 08, 1999.

Vern, You never mentioned if you have a family or loved ones that depend on you. If you do, then you must review the information at hand and make decisions with their best interests in mind.

If there is a chance, however small, that TSHTF and big trouble lies ahead, you owe it to them to be prepared. The first prep is to get good with God, and let Him tell you what to do. The messages will come, not necessarily from sources you expect, but they will come. Don't judge the messanger, but listen to the message.

If you only have yourself to look after, then make your decision and be prepared to live or die with it. But don't be critical of others with more at stake.

I sense that you are a recent GI. I feel for you. If I had to start my preps now, don't know if I could cope either. Find a support group in your area, a group that is preparing, and they will help you. If you make good contacts, they will no doubt help you through all of this. One thing is certain, when you are in the minority (like all of us who are prep-ing, there is comfort in knowing you are not alone. That is probably why this board is so popular.

God bless you, find some help, there are other GI's in your area. Looks like we are all going to need it.

-- Bill (bill@tinfoil.com), September 08, 1999.

Vern,

I'll be remaining in Silicon Valley and helping my community where ever I'm needed. And however I can.

How 'bout you? Gonna "walk your talk?"

If you ARE depressed... then get off the internet... and start taking long walks and growing things. Spend quality time with those you love. Only you can control your attitude adjustment... and face your own fears.

Good luck.

Diane

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), September 08, 1999.

dIEtER iS AWaRE tHAT He is NOT tHE oNLy ONE WhO NoTIcED HoW WeLL fEd saLLy stRUTHeRS LoOkEd iN THoSE COmmERCIaLS!!!!!!

-- Dieter (questions@toask.com), September 08, 1999.

Carlos,

You know all that food that Sally Struthers bought with all of the money you sent her ... She ate it ...every last morsel.

-- @ (@@@.@), September 08, 1999.

Vern,

Please try this link: http://www.webpal.org/registry.htm

Click on

list of communities and groups

It will tell you of y2k groups in your area.

-- maggie (aaa@aaa.com), September 08, 1999.

I think Vern passed out from the Mad Dog.

-- @ (@@@.@), September 08, 1999.

Vern, all your posts are in vain.

-- Y2KGardener (gardens@bigisland.net), September 08, 1999.

Aloha Vern (and the rest of you). I think a bit of compassion is called for here. We're hearing some very real frustration, and we'll be hearing more of it. Vern, what you said reminded me of something I posted a few weeks ago, that I think our most important preps are the people around us. What you say is true, some of the posts here suggest total self-interest. On the other hand, I know for a fact that there are plenty of others here who are have been unbelievably community minded -- above and beyond. What is it that YOU want? I mean that -- can you clarify it? I have a feeling that your'e very overloaded (I'm getting there myself!) and that you need to do some reflection. I apologize for these presumptions -- perhaps your post was the product of your reflections. Oh good grief, here I go into Ramble City -- never mind -- just know that your post touched my heart and that I think of you with Aloha. I'll be checking for further posts. grngrl

-- grngrl (jhandt@gte.net), September 08, 1999.

I have the balls to say that I think the mental health business will be swamped in early 2000, dealing with people who have had their Doomer belief system unceremoniously yanked out from beneath them, by plain ol' day-to-day events.

The rest of the normal world will have inconveniences with which to deal. So what's new. That's been happening regularly for, oh, about 6000 years now.

-- Chicken Little (panic@forthebirds.net), September 08, 1999.

vern, are you always this tightly wound? excuse me--but you make so many FALSE assumptions. i am a doomer (uh, not a doomser) and YES i have spent hundreds of dollars of my own money, making tapes, creating y2k info packets, mailing them, and delivering them to POLLYs. we care about many pollys-because we each have them in our life. however, you can only do so much for folks that don't want to change. i think your problem is you are co-dependent. you MUST change people. it is in your nature. so you have transferred this codependency to the doomSers. you assume it is our job to CHANGE the pollys. and not to have the pollys take responsibility for their own choices. YOU ARE AN ENABLER VERN!!! YOU ARE ENABLING THE POLLYS TO MAINTAIN THEIR UNSAFE BELIEFS! that is unhealthy. it is unhealthy to be an enabler vern. after awhile you have to see that it is mentally more healthy to do what you can for people but then ultimately everyone has to make their own choices. so--my choice is for me and my family to survive. here is a good math test for you. if a food supply will last a family of three for six months--how long will it last a neighborhood of 180? SOUNDS TO ME LIKE ONE GOOD SNACK AND ITS OVER!!!!!!!!!! if you care so much about the POLLYS then why don't you spend your efforts trying to help them instead of wasting all our time.

-- tt (cuddluppy@wacko.com), September 08, 1999.

To quote the coaches of the past "Only the strong shall survive..." and anyone ever hear of 'Darwin's Theory of Natural Selection'...The one that sez the Intelligent and careful will watch the stupid, slow and ignorant die in the gutter for lack of foresight...

-- Billy-Boy (Rakkasn@Yahoo.com), September 08, 1999.

I see two problems here.

First is the assumption that the unprepaired will last as long as the prepaired. By the time my 3-4 months' (today, hopefully 9-11, by Dec) supplies run out, the unprepaired will probably not be a problem.

Second, I see someone who has gone through the mental exercise of the lifeboat problem, looked at the triage required, seen the probable results, run into the cognitive dissonance, and decided that to resolve the dissonance, he should place himself in the non-survivor catagory, to avoid the survivor guilt and dissonance.

I can understand this, I KNOW what happens in nursing homes as I've been in and out of them enough as part of a job, and I'm pretty sure what will happen in January. NOT PRETTY, but I have to concentrate on keeping my family whole, healthy, and vital so that we can contribute to the islands of light which wil be needed to beat back the coming dark.

Night Train

-- Jes' an unfortunately compassionate ol' footballer, lookin for the light (NightTr@in.Lane), September 08, 1999.

Chicken Little: Go pluck yourself.

-- King of Spain (madrid@aol.com), September 08, 1999.

You're toast, Vern. I sincerely hope nobody is depending on you for anything. If they are, they are doomed as well. Quit sniveling. If you have any balls, get back to the preps, and start reaching out to YOUR neighbors.

You're gonna need

GODSPEED,

-- Pinkrock (aphotonboy@aol.com), September 08, 1999.

Vern, you want to .... stay behind with the afflicted, to lead them, to help them, to console them, to be there for them.... Great. But can you make them a bowl of soup?

-- smfdoc (smfdoc@aol.com), September 08, 1999.

Vern may be a new species of chain-jerking troll. Messages of real gloom & doom & despair & Everything's Futile! Same effect of trying to dissuade preps. If it ends up with the same objective as a duck ...

IOHO, if 5-10, the first 3 months will be the worst for violence outside while the unprepped duke it out over dwindling supplies. Then in Summer when the weather's warm there may be a new cycle of violence. It would be Polly Folly to go out and be a walking target the first 3 months.

Don't know anybody who is foaming to go kill. Know lots of people whose self-preservation instinct has prepped them to defend against thieves stealing their provisions. A thief taking one's stored food is tantamount to a murderer. Self-defense is legit.

Many of us researched, photocopied, outreached, helped, organized, talked ourselves blue, only to be branded. When the slaughter starts they won't find us. Time to wake up to some harsh realities and get smart.

It is in NO WAY cowardly OR selfish to *think*, research, prepare, cope, and deal with life's realities.

The real deserters are those who have Done Nothing and advocate that others do nothing. These real deserters are criminally warped and will be karmically responsible and accountable for terrible suffering.

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), September 08, 1999.

Ashton & Leska...

Talk about shirkers!

*Sigh*

(Lots of dot gov, et. al., somebodys dont think prepping, or monitoring, is in vain, Vern.)

Diane

See...

The Government's Y2K War Room

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id= 001My7

[snip]

The federal government is mobilizing what could be the largest peacetime emergency response effort in U.S. history to deal with the main event - Jan. 1, 2000.

[snip]

...It will be the largest event-monitoring effort in the history of the federal government."

[snip]

Vice President Al Gore has closely followed the efforts to prepare for Y2K, Mr. Koskinen said. "I would not be surprised if he was with us at the center and the White House as this goes on."

[snip--to end]

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), September 08, 1999.

Vern, Why do you want to see US die? You are, as Diane said, sick. In a mean way. You are not a fun guy to be around.

-- Mara Wayne (MaraWayne@aol.com), September 08, 1999.

I saw an interview with Senator Bennett last nite on CBN. He stated that he had prepared for more than two weeks. He also pointed out that last year's ice storms lasted more than two weeks in places, and less than a day in others. I think that people will begin to move soon on preparing with Bennett and others saying things like this.

-- marsh (armstrng@sisqtel.net), September 08, 1999.

Your right Vern,

Why bother? We're DOOOOOMED. It'll never work...

-- Glum (Glum@gulliverstravels.com), September 08, 1999.

You have all been Suckered into responding to what I thought was an obvious troll.

What a dumb post!!!

-- David Butts (dciinc@aol.com), September 08, 1999.

"I have the balls to say that I think the mental health business will be swamped in early 2000, dealing with people who have had their Doomer belief system unceremoniously yanked out from beneath them, by plain ol' day-to-day events."

Oh no, Chicken Little. I can say with certainty, that this particular doomer will doing a happy little dance in the middle of the town square. I will experience a glee that knows no bounds. If Y2K turns out to be a non-event, I am most certain that I shall be able to do without the sevices of my shrink for at least a whole year.

-- Bokonon (bok0non@my-Deja.com), September 08, 1999.

Hey, Vern:

I've been eating some of my preps. Yum, yum!

-- Randolph (dinosaur@williams-net.com), September 09, 1999.