I don't really like off topic threads, but some just HAVE to be shared. Not saying we're going to be nuked, BUT:

XXXXX DRUDGE REPORT XXXXX TUESDAY, JUNE 30, 1999 21:42:08 ET XXXXX

PAPER: RUSSIAN BOMBERS FLEW WITHIN STRIKING DISTANCE OF U.S. LAST WEEK!

The WASHINGTON POST'S Dana Priest is preparing a post-Cold War shock story for Thursday's editions:

Strategic bombers from Russia flew within striking distance of the U.S. last week.

The POST reports that Russia is in the middle of the largest war exercises since the end of the Cold War and that U.S. and western leaders are increasingly concerned about the current military leadership in Moscow.

Developing hot... X X X X X

-- Jon Johnson (narnia4@usa.net), June 30, 1999

Answers

And an UPDATE:

XXXXX DRUDGE REPORT XXXXX WED, JUNE 30, 1999 20:59:23 ET XXXXX

INTELLIGENCE WORRY: TWO RUSSIAN BOMBERS FLEW WITHIN STRIKING DISTANCE OF USA LAST WEEK

During a massive military exercise last week, Russia flew two of its strategic bombers to within striking distance of the United States.

The move, the first of its kind since the cold war, alarmed and astounded U.S. intelligence officials and underlined recent Western concerns about the military leadership in Moscow, the WASHINGTON POST is reporting in Thursday editions.

The Russian TU-95 Bear bombers were intercepted by four U.S. F-15 fighters near Iceland early Friday morning and escorted around the island, according to us intelligence.

[Russia's wire service ITAR-TASS claimed that the interceptors failed to reach the bombers before they turned back. DRUDGE REPORT 6/27/99]

"White House officials said Wednesday night that the United States considers the Iceland incident a military matter and has not formally raised it with Russian officials," reports the POST's Dana Priest, in a detailed Page One accounting of the event.

Russian news reports claimed that the military exercise drew NATO aircraft and ships into the region. A Norwegian reconnaissance "turned up so close to Russian fighting ships taking part in the exercise that it had to be driven out of the dangerous area," one Russian newspaper reported over the weekend.

The paper claimed: "An Orion-class aircraft flew almost directly above the masts of the nuclear heavy missile cruiser Petr Velikiy and other combat ships of the Northern Fleet, while an American nuclear submarine took a position in the immediate vicinity of a target practice range."

Neither U.S. defense nor administration officials could comment on the accuracy of the reports, according to the POST.

MORE....

-- Jon Johnson (narnia4@usa.net), June 30, 1999.

Ya really know how to ruin a guy's day don'tcha?

-- Greybear (greybear@home.com), June 30, 1999.

Nikoli and Andy....comments please!

This is really SCAREY!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yes, caps are justified here!

-- Moore Dinty moore (not@thistime.com), June 30, 1999.

Just more irresponsible fear-mongering from the Sludge of the Universe. He's so incompetent he can't even get his dates straight - is it Tuesday, June 30 or Wednesday, June 30?

Let me know if Russia comes as close to the continental U.S. as NATO is to their continent. Now that would be interesting, but of course it will never happen. They are going to be assimilated and they know it. Resistance is futile.

-- @ (@@@.@), June 30, 1999.

Does anybody know how many orbiting "satellites" there are around the Earth? A few thousand? How many times have Russians, Chinese and Americans launched missiles up there? How many times has anybody really bothered to find out what was being sent up?

If you want things to worry about how does the idea of a silent warhead circling the planet sound? At any time any country could just radio up to the "satellite" and give it the command to fall... and detonate. Would even the most advanced early warning systems track such a "satellite" as it begins it's decsent? Even if it could would it even be alarmed? Many pieced of space junk fall to the surface on a regular basis... what would one more piece matter?

I guess it would matter if that piece of junk was a 50 Megaton Hydrogen bomb with a Tritium core and plummeting towards Washington D.C., or Moscow, or Bejing... or London.

The Nuclear Genie is just that. Once released from it's lair it grants you power, fame and wealth. But it has it's price that inevitabley must be paid.

-- (AtlantaAS@aol.com), June 30, 1999.

Last week the Russians conducted West-99. It was an all out countrywide defensive alert as if they were under an attack. It was not given much attention because the Kosovo situation made for the perfect cover. But was it just a defensive maneuver?

Russia has enlisted over 100k draftees, took in over 80k volunteers, and close to 300k from the Gulag. This exercise last week enabled them to integrate these new people and coordinate a number of possible scenarios.

In Nyquist's latest newsletter found in Dispatches...he was told by one military official that N.Korea and China will have everything ready for an attack on S. Korea and Taiwan by the end of June. The official said that all they are waiting for is for american soldiers to take their place in Kosovo.

Russia is preparing for war. Tonight Lunev was on radioliberty.com and said that Russian weapons are already here in the U.S. and that Russian commandos are entering the country as businessmen.

Good reason to get some more food.

-- BB (peace2u@bellatlantic.net), June 30, 1999.

Here's some fuel for the fire:

Famine-hit North Korea reports drought, high temperature 10.25 a.m. ET (1426 GMT) June 29, 1999

SEOUL, South Korea (AP) - Droughts and high temperatures this month have caused rice and corn plants to wither across North Korea - a country already strained by severe food shortages. "With the small amount of precipitation caused by the dry air from the west, drought hit nearly all areas of the country in June,'' the official (North) Korean Central news agency reported Tuesday. Nearly the entire country, including the capital Pyongyang, had only 1 to 2 inches of rain, or 25 to 34 percent of the average, so far in June, it said. Temperatures were also 2 to 5 degrees higher than average, hitting 95 degrees in Pyongyang on Tuesday, an all-time high, it said. The heat wave was expected to last for one more week. Drought, flood, tidal waves and other disastrous weather have plagued communist North Korea for the past five years, devastating its inefficient collective-farm industry. North Korea has been largely dependent on outside aid to feed its 23 million people since 1995. U.S. and South Korean officials have estimated that between 2 million to 3 million people have died of starvation in the North. North Korea estimates that only 220,000 people have died from famine.

Russian grain harvest forecast at 51 million tons 5.49 a.m. ET (949 GMT) June 29, 1999

MOSCOW (AP) - Russia is again facing a poor harvest and will probably need food imports to make up for the low yield, an agriculture analyst said today. With just 51 million tons of grain expected, Russia at best will have just 1 million tons of grain to restock its reserves this year, said Anatoly Altukhov, head of the Agricultural Economics Institute. As a result, the country will have to import as much as 6 million tons of food-quality grain, he said. Russia is likely to need imports of feed grain as well, he said. "Feed-processing facilities are grinding to a halt'' because of a lack of grain, he said. Russia consumes around 70 million tons of grain annually, including about 26 million tons of food-quality grain. The country harvested just 47.8 million tons of grain last year, its worst crop in decades. Drought this year has already ruined some crops and reserves are low in some places. The United States and the European Union are already supplying large amounts of food aid to help Russia cope with the shortages caused by the 1998 harvest.

-- a (a@a.a), June 30, 1999.

I believe this thread is way overblown! This Russian intercept was most likely the first time these bomber pilots had flown in months! Precious little fuel exists for flight training on any regular basis.

Intercepts off the coast of Alaska were quite common thru about 1992 on almost a weekly basis. Such events are quite rare in recent years. Most of what we have been seeing since the coin toss leading to the start of the Kosovo Crisis, has been posturing on the world stage. Russia continues to want to maintain the appearance of a world power, even though its citizens know they have fallen to a third world country. The taking of the airport may have signaled a shiftng of power back towards the military. Even this they bungled badly begging for water from the British within days. Our newly commisioned lieutenants wouldn't even have made such a glaring mistake.

Remember in March when the Russians were sending Naval warships into the area. Few ever arrived, and then those two were replaced in short order. A local Russian in my town claimed they were emptying all available fuel from other sources just to field those ships.

To me, the real danger is in acts of desperation to try and unite their beleagured country against a common foe, in an attempt to restore itself to its once proud position in the world. The disruptions caused by Y2k could be viewed as a means to provide cover for such expansionist attempts. Russians would rather die proudly fighting than die in their villages of starvation.

Most of the world press missed the loss of one of two key oil pipelines about two weeks ago. Only clear facts reported was it was close to Chechnya suggesting rebel involvement, and it would halt the flow of oil for quite some time. For an already cash starved country this is a serious blow!

Reports indicate the true status of the Russian military more less resembles the Mir space station. In short, its in shambles! It is a more hollow force than our Armed Forces. Sure they can still field some impressive numbers, and they still have some crack units, but the bulk of the force is unfit for combat.

I am amazed by reports from the Russian Far East. The Anchorage Daily News did a week long story last month on the City of Magadan. Temperatures in school classrooms kept at 45 degrees F through the harsh Russian winter. Massive starvation throughout. Street vendors selling only sunflower seeds and rotten fish heads. One and one half hours of work in Alaska equating to about one months rent. Everyone wants out. Fuel shipments arrived barely before the ice set in. Pensioneers receiving December's check last month, and being told next one won't come til maybe October. Some smaller villages already abandoned or relocated. Overall, future bleak at best! Situation quite desperate.

A sharp reader in Anchorage noted that food boxes collected and put together by the people of Anchorage containing Powdered milk, sugar, shortening and one other product that escapes me was sent to Russia just before a report from Kosovo by a member of the Red Cross thanking Russia for the wonderful food boxes containing powedered milk, sugar, sortening, and that one other product. Hmmm!!!!

A few years ago a Russian Border Guard on the Island of Big Diomede, on the international dateline in the Bering Sea was critically injured in an avalanche. Bad weather, and no military helicopters capable of flying due to maintenance prompted a distress call for American help. The Alaska Army National Guard dispatched a Blackhawk helicopter in rough weather in the attempt to aid the injured soldier.

Burning gas in fuel drums marked the pick-up point to aid the Guard pilots. The American crew was shocked at the tattered uniforms worn by the Russians as they loaded the injured man. Holes everywhere! I must inject that in the high arctic at twenty or thirty below holes in your gloves and elsewhere is a recipe for frostbite.

In closing, I just wanted to provide a few insights into the Russian military as I see them. They are solely my own and those of some in my region of the country.

Yes there are dangers coming from Russia. The most serious I feel are the unbrideled proliferation of Nuclear weapons, biowar strains, shoulder fired anti-aircraft weapon systems capable of bringing down a civilian airliner, and radiation from a Nuclear accident. Blank screens, an accidental launch, a first strike, must all be considered as possibilities.

I really feel that Russian leaders are more threatened from a further break-up from within and that is where we will see the employment of the Russian military, but it will be against their own people.

snowleopard6 on the Russian border (Common saying up here: "It is not the end of the world, but you can see it from here!)

-- (snowleopard6@webtv.net), July 01, 1999.

Thanks snowleopard, your perspective has always been appreciated! It also falls in line with what my brother has been telling me as well. My biggest fear of Russia has been their potential for unpredictable behavior based soley on their desperate conditions. I share the same concerns in relation to North Korea's starving population.

-- Will continue (farming@home.com), July 01, 1999.

The Bear has never gone to sleep, it's still just as it was. We will square off with Russia, thats all. The problem is, I don't agree with the Russians, but I hate what our Dingleberry of a joke of a convict in charge has done to our country. I guess I'll just side with myself, and hope for the best.

-- CygnusXI (luppotreb@aol.com), July 01, 1999.

Heard on the farm report yesterday that we will be selling/giving another huge shippment of grain to the russians in the near future. Their country is hungry. It doesn't make sense that they would want to destroy the "kitchen". Then where would they get their food from

-- rick (I'mset@home.house), July 01, 1999.

http://www.msnbc.com/msn/285754.asp

U.S. intercepts 2 Russian bombers Moscow plays down Iceland incident Associated Press MOSCOW, July 1  Moscow denied Thursday that two Russian strategic bombers violated the airspace of Iceland  a NATO member  during military exercises last week. The two long-range Tu-95 Bear bombers did not cross Icelands air border during a 15-hour training flight last Friday, a Russian Air Force spokesman said, the Interfax news agency reported. U.S. defense officials reportedly said the military exercise was the largest by Russia in a decade and the first time since the end of the Cold War that Russian planes had probed Western air defenses. RUSSIAN OFFICIALS said last Monday that four bombers  the Tu-95s and two Tu-160 Blackjack bombers  flew over the North Pole and test- fired strategic missiles as part of military exercises code named West 99.

The Tu-160s flew directly north from Moscow, while the two Tu-95s flew over the Atlantic Ocean before heading to the Arctic and crossing the North Pole. Long-range missiles were test-fired and hit targets in southern Russia, officials said.

The training was conducted in the airspace above neutral waters, the Air Force spokesman said. Interfax did not identify him.

The spokesman also played down a report in The Washington Post today that U.S. fighter jets escorted the two Tu-95s around Iceland.

Such trailing of an aircraft in the vicinity of the air border of another country is usual and no excesses occurred in this instance, he said.

The Post quoted U.S. defense officials as saying the military exercise was the largest by Russia in a decade and the first time since the end of the Cold War that Russian planes had probed Western air defenses.

A White House National Security Council official was quoted anonymously by the newspaper as saying we are looking into the incident but that the United States has not raised it as an issue with Russia.

More than 30 ships, several nuclear powered submarines, 10,000 troops and a number of aircraft from Russias Baltic Fleet also took part in the exercises.

Russia insisted that the maneuvers were not connected to NATOs bombing raids in Yugoslavia, which officially ended June 16. But Moscow sees NATO as a threat, and the alliances campaign raised calls in Russia to boost military spending.

Moscow vehemently opposed NATOs air war against Yugoslavia and played a prominent role in mediating a peace plan for Kosovo.

) 1999 Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

-- Gayla (privacy@please.com), July 01, 1999.

The problem is, with what Billy's done to the military, the old "let's see if they're on their toes" stuff gets a real bad answer....NO! And then the tacticians have a field day with the new data!!

C

-- Chuck, a night driver (rienzoo@en.com), July 01, 1999.

Rick,

What makes more sense? Stand outside the "kitchen" waiting for handouts, Or, gathering your fellow bums together and taking the "kitchen" by force and having it all.

-- (America@land.of plenty), July 01, 1999.

Hmm, seems Lunev says Russian weapons are already in the US and Russian commandos are entering as businessmen. Maybe a disinformation campaign on the net also, as in the "poor ol' Russia, she's so weak that she couldn't possibly harm us" pap that Snow leopard 6 is passing on. What branch of the KGB misinformation center trained him?

-- We're gonna get nuked (Russia@playing.possum), July 02, 1999.

West Point

-- (snowleopard6@webtv.net), July 02, 1999.