Subject:	Re: Why mcbankshill Is A Fool.
Date:	1999/06/23
Author:	cory hamasaki <kiyoinc@ibm.XOUT.net>
	Posting History

On Wed, 23 Jun 1999 02:35:16, "Joseph E. McIsaac" <jem@marketpartners.com> wrote:   > Now please indulge me for a second and consider it post Y2K and it turns out that everything that > I've stated was dead accurate.  That I was telling the truth, that I knew what was going on and > you, and many other doomsters, just didn't want to hear it so you resorted to personal attacks > against me. Will you just hand-wave your own mistaken behavior away,  forgetting the decency that > I originally brought to the group -- only remembering the '"fuck you's" of Schwarz and the other > idiot assaults?  You think about that.  If you want, go research the original posts that I made > and the tolerance that I've demonstrated herein.   Oh my, your feelings are hurt.  Lookit, you're sadly mistaken about this. This mess is far worse than you realize.  By that, I'm referring to the software and systems issues.  You have no idea how complex large systems are.  No idea at all.   This thing is going to take down a major bank; maybe several.  It'll take out dozens of F500 scale corps.   What does this really mean?  Assuming that muties aren't lurching through the streets, Clint Eastwood isn't blasting open the vault with a cannon, what it means is the management at a bank goes, like, "oh shit", and sells out to a competitor.   I expected BankBoston to "make it",  I expected them to be done several months ago.  They didn't make it, the bank was sold, and ComputerWorld ran a cartoon of BB's Y2K staff in the unemployment line.  Maybe this is a clue, maybe not.   There have been too many mergers for this to be a random variation in the economy.   Remember when the cold war ended and they cut the defense budget?  The defense industry was going down?  The result was a series of mergers and sell outs.  No one went out of business but for millions of people, it was the same.  Their job is gone, see you around, clown.  It's now Lockheed-Martin-Loral, aka Lo-Morals.   A few keep their jobs, a fortunate few get golden parachutes but lots of just regular people get the old heave-ho.   By this definition, the banks have already taken big hits.  Gone, adios, no good paying job for you,  I can still hear the sobbing as they closed the offices.   You want proof?  It doesn't exist.  The systems are too dynamic and complex but if you examine the historic record, lots  of people lost out in the last year and this is just the beginning.   In a complex, dynamic system, it's the system efficiency that counts, not humanity or people.  If a "turn around" specialist comes in and savages BankBoston or 1st Union, fires the sorry asses of a bunch of people who thought they had a good secure job, sadly, it's a good thing for the investors and society.   We win twice, the bank is more efficient and some poor sap has to wash cars to buy food.   So is the bank in trouble or has it risen to a challenge?   They're not going to tell you.  Ask the people.  Ask the guy who's working two jobs to make ends meet or the woman who used to be a bank VP (yeah, I know about bank VPs.)  It's already started.   Milne is wrong when he says, "It won't be long now."  It's already started.   The problem is, this is just the beginning.  Software that has worked reliably for 10, 20, 30 years is about to break and this is an event that has not happened before.  The result is "non-computable"; we don't know what will happen.   Suck it up, JEM, I got problems here in River City.  I've got an acquaintance with *serious* cancer.  We're getting phone calls where she says she has good news, her chances are up to 15% and deep in her heart of hearts, she knows it really means Zero and she starts sobbing on the phone.   What's going to happen is that things will get worse.  Maybe we can fake it.  Maybe each bankruptcy will be disguised as a merger but the human toll will be just as large.   > So now you are no better than the rest?  Enjoy the tuna!   I *am* no better than the rest. I've never claimed to be better than anyone.  I do know some things about large systems and have unusual skills and qualifications, and generally I don't push on people harder than they can take.   *You* might rethink your attitude and your writings  if your feelings are easily hurt.   Y2K will be a leveling event. A resetting and a disruption of the way things are.   Somehow, you've started believing your own propaganda.  Look man, the posture from FEMA and the DoD is now 14 days.  The government is advising people to take their money (a small amount) out of banks.   I was only half kidding when I said that Tim May and Frank Ney would be the Broomies.  In the near future, I might be considered a Polly.   If we have a few more Peach Bottom 2's and Van Nuys, the balance will tip way over.   cory hamasaki  http://www.kiyoinc.com/current.html   

-- a (a@a.a), June 23, 1999

Answers

yessir, i see it, a level playing-field.anyone want some good bean-recipe,s? corn bread,grits;brown-pan-gravy'greens;MOCK-YUPPEE-PIE.

-- al-d. (CATT@ZIANET.COM), June 23, 1999.

Al-D,

A level playing field? Yup, guess that's one way to look at it. You sure do have a way of cutting through the crap. Amazing. And you're pretty darn ready to deal with that aren't you? Good recipes. Folks around you are going to be the lucky ones. You know how to make a can of sardines go a long way. Thanks for the refocus Al-D.

-- Gordon (gpconnolly@aol.com), June 24, 1999.

Response to Hamasaki: Milne is wrong when he says, "It won't be long now." It's already started.

Cory mispoke on one point: when 'efficiency' strips people of their jobs, it might be good for shareholders, but it sure isn't good for society. The disruption of lives affects communities, which are destabilized by dynamic competitive capitalism. Look at Eric Harris (of Littleton): a perfect product of our military-industrial complex: an army brat, moved from place to place as a kid, never formed deep relationships, or if he did, had them stripped by the idiot needs of Uncle Sham. Who taught him to be alienated? If he had been able to form stable relationships, and not had to dread dad's next move, maybe he wouldn't have turned to murder to express his anger. When money is worshipped in a society, humans are turned into ciphers, are felt to be expendable, and are offered such compassionate solutions as euthanasia and abortion to solve their economic woes. Strong, resilient human communities care for their members. In our America, more and more the armored fist is offered to those on the short end of the capitalistic stick. And the elites know it: thus more and more 'gated' enclaves and rent-a-cops at the local mall, just to maintain some semblance of order in our feckless, deracinated society.

-- Spidey (in@jam.commie), June 24, 1999.

The merger between Fleet and BankBoston has more to do with deresulation gone wacky than anything else. Also it's been in the works since 1996. I suspect quite highly that BankBoston wasn't in the bailout mode in 1996 because of Y2k. So, that merger really isn't a clue of anything except the deregulation boomerrang effect that is being expereinced in banking, insurance, securities, and telecommunications.

-- Yep (yougoth@right.com), June 24, 1999.

That's deregulation...sorry.

-- Yep (can't spell @ times.com), June 24, 1999.

spidey, you are an idiot. Harris proves your point? How many other military brats have NOT gone on a killing spree? It takes only one to tie the military to all that's gone bad in society! My, your logic is astounding. Keep up the good work.

-- Unbelievable (spidey@hasfound.theanswer), June 24, 1999.

Say what you will in defense of the lifestyle. I wasn't military, but next to it. It tends to make or break one's childhood, as do broken homes, abuse, neglect and parents with substance abuse problems...the last mentioned being in epidemic proportions in this self-indulged society we live in. Americans have become increasingly pathetic in their personal code of ethics....don't even get me started.

-- Will continue (farming@home.com), June 24, 1999.

In regard to Spidey's "military brat" hypothesis, it's a known fact that Marines suffer astonomically high divorce and spousal abuse rates, and the USMC now activly discourages its recruits from getting married, or joining if they are married.

-- a (a@a.a), June 24, 1999.

Yep............I'll buy the Bank Boston speculation that cory mentions over yours........Meanwhile my inlaws are still trying figure out their "Bank Stock" hit. I sent them info from this forum that gave them plenty of forewarning to no avail. Says it was a speculated interest hike that dropped the stock value. Is Disconnect Fever that contagious?

-- kevin (innxxs@yahoo.com), June 24, 1999.

a do you listen to yourself sometimes? Give me a break, you moron. Have some kind of filter before you start typing. So you have the answer too? Why don't you let the experts know your take on the psychological effects of military life? I'm sure they have inquiring minds.

do you suffer astonomically high UFO citing rates? "I have a degree in physics" so I know about UFO's. BWAHAHAHAHAHA!

-- Unbelievable (a@hasfound.theanswer), June 24, 1999.

Response to Hamasaki: Milne is wrong when he says, "It won't be long now." It's already started.

Yo, unbelievable: I readily admit to being an idiot. Do you wish to argue that American society, 1999-style, is a healthy one? You think we have strong, cohesive communities? Wassup wid dat? Word.

-- Spidey (in@jam.commie), June 24, 1999.

Kevin: Mergers do not occur overnight in the banking industry, nor do they occur without significant government oversite. There isn't any speculation there.

-- Yep (yougoth@right.com), June 24, 1999.

Response to Hamasaki: Milne is wrong when he says, "It won't be long now." It's already started.

And anyway, it wasn't the 'military' I was singling out for blame; it is the exigencies of the National Security State, the one that sucks down half our income in taxes, and disrupts lives and communities in the name of national defense. It is the imperial ambitions of our leaders that play havoc with the lives of the home folk. Oh, while I'm here: since you laugh at my theory (not mine at all, really--Tom Fleming's at Chronicles Magazine), what is YOUR explanation as to why those kids shot 35 people? Bad hair day? Your views on causality are somewhat misapplied: You attempt to satisfy Koch's postulate on infectivity to human events: cigarette smoking CAN'T cause lung cancer because look at all the people who smoke who DON'T get cancer. Flawed argumentation doesn't prove your point, hotshot.

-- Spidey (in@jam.commie), June 24, 1999.

Not singling out the military Oh sorry, the Army (Look at Eric Harris (of Littleton): a perfect product of our military-industrial complex: an army brat). So you don't want a national defense? Go live in Switzerland; they do have a defense but it's very small compared to this nation's. "imperial ambitions"? Oh come now. To which group do you belong that feeds this crap? Flawed arguments don't prove your point either. Then you bring lung cancer into it with the correlation to smoking. Try to keep to one topic.

What's wrong with our society today? Lots of things. What's the cause? Probably lots of things also. Can we blame just one thing or two (like the military and imperial ambitions)? No. Sweetheart I don't know the answers but then again I didn't make those statements. I think it starts in the home. Parents have become very lazy (for whatever reason) and pay little attention to what they are doing. Unfortunately, we can't take away their right to procreate and we're left with abused or abondoned children; and the cycle starts over again. You can't blame the military (even though you denied this in your last post). Please seek some professional help yourself; you have way too much rage bottled up inside.

-- Unbelievable (spidey@hasfound.theanswer), June 24, 1999.

Spidey and Tom Flemming are right! Please see www.dixienet.org for further info re: Tom

We HAVE become fleckless and deracinated thanks to unbridled modernity!

We now have an empire instead of a republic.

Jacobin egalitarianism rules the day. You know the famous line, "liberty, fraternity, equality or DEATH!" I'll bet you forgot the DEATH part in your quest to be equal. Decker, Flint, Maria, JBD, Poole, Davis, etc., wish us to all be equal in death.

Deo Vindice, BR,

PS

Why are IRS-CID agents trying to stem y2k induced bank runs in Utah and Montana?

-- brother rat (rldabney@usa.net), June 24, 1999.